Sometimes dealers have relationships with the distributor of multiple brands, so (in theory) they sell everything that distributor carries . . . meaning they can get it. Whether they put it on their floor on display -- at their own cost because they have to buy the floor inventory -- is another matter. My local dealer, from whom I bought my Nait XS2 in 2011, nowadays has very little Naim on the floor; maybe one Uniti-type product. And because they didn't buy a ND555 streamer/player for their floor, the distributor wouldn't even let them sell it; at least that's what they told me. So I bought mine from a dealer 1000 miles away.
Bart, My local dealer only has Naim's all-in-one unit on display. They were able to sell me the ND555 streamer/Uniti Core/555 PS DR combination.
I’d purchase a Naim CD player but keep my tube preamp and tube amp (for midrange ) for its superior tone.
Won't name dealers but two I know well, weren't selling Naim around late 90s and Naim rep wanted to know why, they said because at moment Naim isn't good enough, Naim threatened removing franchise, so they said OK no problem, as I said before I've not heard present line but both have started to sell them again, so they at least rate them. Looking at current prices way over priced it seems to me but as I say I've not heard them, in the 80s-90s there was dealers all over Greater Manchester now you have to travel if you want to hear hi-end gear, I'm thinking lack of customers is pushing everything up to silly prices. If someone was happy with the older versions, I'd say buy with confidence and get them serviced, they seem built to last.
My reply was US-focused, where there is a distributor (which as of last year happens to be owned by Focal/Naim) between the manufacturer and the dealer. I think that this is NOT the case in the UK. So different issues for those dealers. In the States, there is essentially no relationship between the dealers and Naim; it's all through a distributor.
Maybe something changed, or maybe my dealer just wanted to get rid of me In any event, I get WAY better prices, and service, from the folks 1000 miles away from me.
Well ... regarding a special way that Naim gear sounds, I really don't get that reference. I have Naim gear now, but I've had some very respectable pieces of audio equipment go through here in the past. Conrad Johnson PV-5 tube preamp with a tube phone stage, Adcom 555ii amp, Ayre amplifier, and others. And during those times, the focus always seemed to be about the gear, and getting it matched properly, and getting the cables right, and constantly playing with speaker placement. In other words not very satisfying, unless you like that sort of thing. Now ... my main source and amplification is a Naim Superuniti. Very simple, extremely well-made, and just sounds great. It has an internet radio, plus an excellent FM tuner section which sounds much better than my Rega Radio R tuner. It's also a very good music streamer, the DAC in it is very good. It has a ton of inputs and outputs which makes it very easy to use in my system. It also has an integrated 80 WPC Poweramp, which drives my fully reconditioned Kef R107s beautifully. They have never sounded so good. The Kefs are four ohms and the output is 120 wpc at 4 ohms. I really don't find there is a particular, special, Naim sound. It's just that the Naim gear sounds very good, just like any other very good audio components. It has excellent clarity and realistic depiction of the instruments that are playing, and the sound stage is always very wide and full, no matter where I put my speakers. I know that some speakers are more challenging when it comes to placement, but both my pairs of speakers seem to be quite forgiving. And keep in mind, that the Superuniti, with all of these things happening within one box, tends to be thought of as a lower sonic level of quality within the Naim line. Indeed, I'm currently saving for the upgraded, newer music streamer/iradio and separate integrated amplifier. I know that the sound quality will improve substantially when the upgrade happens, but it's already very, very good with just this one simple, well-designed, piece of equipment. This is a lot of musical reproduction from a single $8K unit. Another excellent benefit is the free Naim App which controls the Superuniti from my cell phone or tablet, anywhere in or round the house. I listen to so much more music now. I still have my Linn Unidisc 1.1 reference level CDP for playing my CDs, which of course, is the best sounding source in my system. And when I'm using the Naim app, the Linn is listed as a piece of equipment, and if a CD is playing I can control the volume. Again, from anywhere around the house. The same goes for when an LP is playing. I can control the volume level of the phono input. So, now that I have switched to Naim gear, the whole music process is so much simpler. Music is more accessible, and sounds very good from any of the sources. It seems to make any speakers I connect to it sound great. And I haven't been able to achieve that situation from any of the other audio systems and setups that I've had in the past. Anyway, these are just my experiences with Naim gear. Cheers. Dave
I think that it's a generalization that I certainly don't agree with. I'm very happy with the soundstage in my room, and spatial placement of the instruments - to also generalize. So much goes into creating soundstage . . .
The way I perceive Naim, is that it dispenses with the recorded soundstage to a certain degree, and replaces it by a "Naim soundstage", bringing forward the separate instruments into your room. This can be very satisfying in itself! But in my opinion it doesn't really recreate the recording space accurately, especially in terms of depth and reverb cues. My experience is with the Naits. Perhaps the pre power combos are different.
A good dealer was always hard to find but with less in the 'pool' now it's even harder. When I bought my system it was always if you don't like it after a few days they'd take it back and use it as demo stock. If you have faith in what and how you sell it, it's a good ad without much of a take up. In 92 I bought a replacement cartridge from the same dealer but at that time we'd moved 50 miles away. I had a Troika, which had just been replaced by a different model. As I was unable to travel at that point, they came up installed it and left me to to see what I thought. The owner was away on holiday and hadn't heard the new cartridge so when I rung them, I told home it was , he agreed managed to get me, probably the last Troika in the country and he took the replacement back, not that's what I call a service. You do need time to fall in love or find there's no chemistry going on.
The 'Naim sound' means different things to different folk, as we see here. I agree with the general observation that -- to a slight degree -- an all-Naim system tends to 'foreground' musical elements, while, er, caring very slightly less about hifi stuff like soundstage, burnished instrumental timbres or whatever. Some perceptive audio writer (Paul Messenger? Art Dudley?) said something like "Other audio manufacturers are very good at showing you what the session sounded like; Naim lays bare what the performers meant to communicate." Which is why I've remained loyal to the brand, I think. I've been privileged to hear some eye-wateringly expensive high-end systems. One stands out in memory, though; about a dozen years ago(?), Naim released their flagship CD deck, the CD555. Naim North America arranged for a demo at Hawthorne Stereo in Seattle (my 'local') with a top-level, all-Naim system comprising the 555, XPS(?) p.s.u., NAC552 preamp, three NAP500 amps, 500 preamp, active crossovers, SuperCap p.s.u.'s, etc. etc. driving a pair of DBL's. I got an invite to attend (already owning an entry-level Naim system) ... what an evening. All sorts of music was played, and I have to say, it was probably the most convincing music playback I've ever heard. The "in-room presence" (an attribute I value very highly) was most evident ... I recall them putting "Working Class Hero" (John Lennon) on, and all canapé-munching ceased ... everyone was stunned. To the extent possible, John and his Gibson J160E were just ... there, right in the room. More a seance than a hifi demo ...
I have always steered myself away from this brand because of what I perceive is their scamming of their customers by charging separate big bucks for outboard power supplies.
I am not sure about mystique, but my Naim journey was as simple listening to various CD players at the time and walked out with a CD 5 as it sounded “better” to me. Then decided to upgrade my Amp and heard a few amps and walked out with a 112/150 combo as again it sounded better to me. I have upgraded since then and used the same principal of listening to what was available and picked what I liked. Did the fact I had previous Naim equipment influence my decision when upgrading? Probably, because I liked what I had, but there was always room for improvement. I always went in with an open mind and if you liked it you liked it if you didn’t you didn’t. We all want and like different things.
Or you could look at it as a way for you to start with a more affordable system that has an easy and relatively cheap upgrade path that makes a massive difference to the quality of your set-up.
I've never heard a Naim amplifier but the schematics are all over the web so maybe I'll build one.... Right after I build a Krell KSA50.
From my 20 year naim journey I wouldn't say there was any mystique - it's just another audio brand. The electronics are great, the speakers less so. Once you move up from the one box stuff to pre power combos, yes you are in a bizarre 'naim world' of din connectors, unorthodox (by normal audio standards) connections, and separate power supplies which can I suppose look a bit cultish to the outsider, and yes costs on some of these combos can seriously mount up. If your not up for all this unique 'faff' then maybe naim is not for you. Sound wise, it can sound absolutely stunning partnered with some sympathetic speakers, which to my ears means Kudos or Neat.
I guess it depends how you look at it. One doesn't have to progress to separates and external power supplies. Buying a modern 5i amp and CD player, one can just stick with that and have a great sounding system, and as far as connections go it's pretty normal - as others have said, DIN connections are very good, and I find them more convenient to use than RCA's (they just make a simpler and better connection) - but RCA's are available as well. Bananas are required for speaker cables but that's not too crazy, though some may not like that. Not sure as you progress up the line if things get more weird than this, but so far it's not that strange, just a little different. If you buy used it's also not really that much more expensive than most of the stuff that gets purchased. You can get into Naim if you spend as little as $1K per piece (used of course). True, Naim can get expensive, but I think you can say that for most brands if you find the need to keep moving up their line. Maybe Naim makes that a bit more enticing however, because they provide upgrades to your existing unit. I don't find this to be a scam (as another poster said) because it is more affordable than moving up the line, and it's not required. If you find it makes no difference then just don't buy it. I guess if you are someone who doesn't want to get sucked into spending lots of cash, and you are prone to doing that, maybe avoiding Naim is a good idea. But I think avoiding this hobby entirely might be just as good an idea!
This comment would cover a large number of manufacturers in the audio world. Picking and choosing one isn't realistic IMO.
This. Naim's entry-level system is so good, it very satisfyingly comprises an endgame system for any sensible music lover (as opposed to audio hobbyist.) $3k! Cheap.
My take on the subject is that it came about kind of by accident. It was the combination of Naim electronics with a Linn turntable and Linn speakers in the mid-late 1970s that set off the Flat Earth thing. I doubt that either Julian or Ivor had the whole "Prat" thing in mind when they first designed their earliest products, it just sort of came out that way when they were combined. But once the dealers discovered it, it snowballed, and the designers knew how to exploit it. Some influential magazine reviewers got on board, and a cult was born. The original Naim amp was pretty much a direct crib of a circuit from a 1971 RCA transistor manual, and the preamp circuits were similarly basic early '70s standard practice. But the execution led to that "bouncy" sound, particularly the use of tantalum electrolytic capacitors in the signal path, and rather hefty power supplies with some attention paid to proper grounding. The original Naim circuits didn't change from the mid-1970s through the end of the century, just more refinement of basic principles and throwing more and more power supply at it.
DIN vs RCA seems kinda silly - Naim equipment comes with interconnects; they happen to come with DIN rather than RCA. You connect them....once...and doing the connection is as simple as plugging it in and turning the lock collar 90 degrees. If you want to upgrade, Naim sell upgraded interconnects, as do some other companies (such as Chord). The higher end amps and streamer/players use yet another type of interconnect - a multi-connection cable they call a "Burndy" but again they are connected once and that's it. And they generally are included with the hardware. It's never been inconvenient or an issue for me.
IIRC both Neat and Kudos use Naim electronics for their in-house listening, so some class of synergy is not surprising.
I don't have a lot of exposure to Naim other than owning a CD5si for about 6 years now. It has great rhythm. I love it.
