Power Cables... Do they really matter?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by PinkIsTheSky, Oct 7, 2019.

  1. Hanks3

    Hanks3 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, Tx
    I'm really impressed with the Quantum Science Violet. It has fared significantly better in my system than the offerings from Furutech including Orange. Picking up a QS Red this week and am very interested in its presentation.
     
  2. fish

    fish Senior Member

    Location:
    NYS, USA
    This one?
    Quantum Science Audio Ultra Black/Red AC Receptacle
     
  3. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
  4. fish

    fish Senior Member

    Location:
    NYS, USA
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  5. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
  6. If they modified sonics, like adding/subtracting certain frequencies it would be clearly measurable. And yet the manufacturers never validate this. Puzzling.
     
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  7. jea48

    jea48 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Midwest, USA
  8. Limopard

    Limopard National Dex #143

    Location:
    Leipzig, Germany
    If power cables do matter at all their impact should be rather small. On the other side of the wall socket there are mostly cheap solid core wires, maybe decades old. So why bother?
     
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  9. tlowe

    tlowe Life Explorer

    Location:
    somewhere
    I wont be surprised decades old cable made in the old days are actually made with very much better material, like higher purity in copper content compared to many cables made today.
     
  10. Brother_Rael

    Brother_Rael Senior Member

    Audiophiles love to get wrapped up in this "everything matters" thing. It does.

    But some things matter much, much less in audio. And mains plugs land bang in that category for me. Get them to perform to spec and not go up in flames and I'm good. Focus on what really matters and the hobby becomes less inconsequential rabbit hole.
     
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  11. tlowe

    tlowe Life Explorer

    Location:
    somewhere
    Please read my signature...:biglaugh:
     
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  12. Just Walking

    Just Walking Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    In a conductor such as copper, outer electrons freely dissociate from the atoms. It is these electrons that are available to conduct current. When a current is caused to pass through a copper wire, the wire offers electrical resistance (rho x L /A, where rho is the conductivity of copper, L is the length and A is the cross section area).

    The reason for this resistance is that the copper ions jiggle a little bit as a result of the temperature, and look bigger than they actually are. This is the real reason that that copper has electrical resistance, and the reason for rho. So the conduction electrons scatter off the jiggling copper ions. In fact at room temperature, electrons only move about 50 copper ions before they scatter.

    If you cool or heat the wire, the jiggling gets less, or more, and the resistance of the wire gets less or or more. So rho is in fact not constant but changes with temperature.

    For copper this works out at 0.4% per degree C.

    Now there is a secondary effect that impurities also act to scatter electrons. But in any reasonably pure copper this is by far a minor effect as compared with ion scattering in the copper itself. In fact to discern any effect from impurities, you have to cool the copper right down to at least liquid nitrogen temperature, or less. This reduces the copper ion jiggling so much that any residual effect is due to impurities (the ratio between room temperature resistance, and cryogenic resistance is called the Residual Resistance Ratio, RRR). For bog standard electrical copper that will be around 100 to 500. Which means that at room temperature the effect of impurity scattering is about 1/100th to 1/500th the amount of copper ion scattering.

    Anyhow, you get much more effect in a cable as a result of the temperature of your listening room, or whether you have just handled the cable to swap to another one for comparison (and therefore heated it up a bit) as anything else.
     
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  13. mando_dan

    mando_dan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Beverly, MA
    Has anyone ever simply tested the voltage coming to the amp via either the regular cable or the fancy wire using a good multimeter? If there's a particle of difference between the two I'd be (bad pun) shocked. Simple test of simple physics, aka the antithesis of the audiophile lifestyle. :)
     
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  14. jea48

    jea48 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Midwest, USA
    If it were only that simple...
    Voltage is just one component of the equation. Example. Two buckets of water. One bucket is treated water the other is not. Both buckets of water measure exactly one gallon each. Conclusion, both buckets of water are the same.
     
  15. I did, on the 20 amp dedicated line that feeds my main stereo system. No difference. Receptacle is a Leviton hospital grade 20 amp outlet. I wasn’t doing it to compare cables but rather to see if it registered the same as what my SurgeX SX2120 was displaying (I bought the SurgeX used so was validating it worked correctly).
     
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  16. mando_dan

    mando_dan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Beverly, MA
    How does this relate to voltage, amperage, or resistance? Remember, V=IR. Am I missing something?
     
  17. Hanks3

    Hanks3 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, Tx

    It is a Pass and Seymour Legrand. What you are paying for is their proprietary treatment that changes the sonic presentation.
     
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  18. Hanks3

    Hanks3 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, Tx
    There isn't an adding or subtracting of anything. Kinda the wrong way to look at it.
     
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  19. Hanks3

    Hanks3 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, Tx
    No, just the Redfor now. Some day perhaps. The good thing is if I try it and don't like it, or don't see the value I can send it back for a refund. This certainly is something someone does because it looks sexy.
     
  20. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict Look what I found

    Location:
    AZ
    I think the thread title should be changed to "Pricey replacement power cables - do they matter?"

    Of course power cables "matter" but most of the time the one that came with your equipment is sufficient, especially if buying higher end gear. I have an Accuphase power amp that comes with a 10 gauge well made cable, wouldn't dream of replacing it, besides the fact I'd be imagining any improvements.

    Then for lesser / cheaper gear, why? Again, what it came with is 99.99% sufficient.
    Shhh..... you're not supposed to talk about what's behind the curtain! :)

    Like most electrical-related "upgrades" (power conditioners, fuses, outlets, cords, etc) they work best and can show improvement if there was a problem in the first place (like dirty power, bad fuse, cheap outlet, undersized cord). Otherwise it's just audiophilia nervosa fed by marketing.
     
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  21. Bryan T

    Bryan T Forum Resident

    Location:
    L.A.
    I inspected the wiring in my walls when our place was built. Spending lots of money on the last bit to get from the wall to the equipment wouldn’t be a good use of funds.
     
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  22. You said each cable has its own sonic signature, so I figured you meant some cables add/subtract bass, or midrange, or treble. If I misunderstood what did you mean by their own sonic signature?
     
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  23. Hanks3

    Hanks3 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austin, Tx
    Tonality isn't measured in amplitude.
     
  24. What do you mean by tonality?
     
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  25. fish

    fish Senior Member

    Location:
    NYS, USA
    This one?
    Quantum Science Audio Red AC Receptacle
    $690

    Hahaha. I like the way you think :)
    I borrow stuff from thecableco.com they are great that way. Dont like it? Send it back!
     

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