Prince, R. I. P.

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by mr._mojo_filter, Apr 21, 2016.

  1. Freek999

    Freek999 Forum Resident

    I agree on Musicology, though I love the title track. To be more specific, I love the live version of it. There's a wonderful but way too brief bass lick in the live version, luckily it is played in every tv appearance. I replaced the studio version with it in my Musicology playlist. the bass part is at 3.01 in the link

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC0OwtS3iFM
     
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  2. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Musicology was the byproduct of good timing. It was 20 years since Purple Rain and nostalgia always sells, Prince was getting inducted in the Hall Of Fame, he'd had a successful performance on the Grammys with Beyonce, he was "Prince" again and not "O+>", he was embarking on his most mainstream tour for years where he promised to do all the songs people wanted to hear, it was a great year for him in general. It worked for what it set out to do, bring Prince back to the masses who had largely abandoned him after Love Symbol, but as a whole, I always thought it was a very sanitized album and nowhere near his best. 3121 far exceeded Musicology in setting out to do the same thing, but to me 3121 had far better songs, more edge, more funk, more melody, etc...
     
  3. Osato

    Osato Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Hey - thanks for that! Cool interview too... Prince is much more, uh, animated in that interview with Leno than others I've seen.

    I think a lot of his stuff after the 90s was pretty sanitized and watered down, but my issue with Musicology is that, especially with some of the ballads, it doesn't even particularly feel like Prince. Most of 3121 doesn't compare to his older stuff, but it's funky! Black Sweat is amazing, as is Love.
     
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  4. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Yup. IIRC, the Lovesexy show didn't change much across the tour- there may have been some minor setlist variations here and there, but it was a very scripted show so not much room for changes.

    Just a whirlwind, powerhouse show. I saw Prince 3 times in a short span in 1988 and then immediately saw Michael Jackson 3 times - MJ was boring compared to Prince!
     
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  5. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I like the 1987-88 band best by far!
     
  6. Jayseph

    Jayseph Somewhere Between Penny Lane & Alphabet St.

    Location:
    Philadelphia
    Art Official Age is actually pretty good. My favorite album of the 2000s is most definitely 3121, but I would put Art up there. Plus the song Way Back Home is a very haunting song now.
     
  7. Izozeles

    Izozeles Pushing my limits

    Call my name is my favorite song from the “comeback” years
    A couple of years later, I also very much enjoyed some of the songs on 2010
    I didn’t like Planet Earth or LF/MS , nor did like any of the download only albums from that era.
    AOA was a good album, but HNR II is still my favorite from the 10’s
     
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  8. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Well, the prob was Prince's imperial period (roughly Dirty Mind to Lovesexy) was so amazing that few can compete with that, including his own later work, but the strong material in his later years is just fine if you don't keep it stacked next to Sign O' The Times. Prince had some low points in his career, but nothing that was outright terrible. He just burned so brightly in the 80s that being a mere mortal in the last 25 years looks worse than it really was. There's a lot to love on every album, he just never quite reached the 10/10 levels of Dirty Mind, 1999, Purple Rain, Parade and Sign O' The Times again, but then again, how many artists do? Of course 3121 doesn't stack up to his greatest work as he was in a different frame of mind, but on its own accord it's a worthy addition to any collection.
     
  9. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    In a weird way, although unintentional, AOA almost feels like his own "Blackstar", except Prince had no idea he'd be dead 18 months later, and it was also the last "real" studio album and the HitNRun's were more collections of previous singles plus new tracks. But so much of the concept of Art is very prophetic, about how Prince "leaves" the world as he knows it and has to adjust to life in a new realm, it's like he was predicting his own death and afterlife. Not just Way Back Home, but Clouds, the Affirmation segues, etc... It was almost like Prince was doing a concept album aware of his own mortality
     
  10. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    'Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic' was terrible-IMO. When I saw Sheryl Crow was Guest Singing on a Song on that Album, I thought 'Uh Oh'.
     
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  11. Osato

    Osato Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Yeah, back when Sheryl Crow was everywhere for some weird reason. That kind of empty pop culture ubiquity would later pass to Dave Grohl.
     
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  12. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    I recall a lot of hype prior to the release of 'Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic', which is what made it even more disappointing when I first bought the CD and played it a few times. It is in a Box somewhere, as have not listened to it in years. It makes 'Musicology' look like 'Purple Rain' by comparison.

    Prince had a Great Triple CD Release with 'Emancipation'(well most of it, as any 3 CD Set will have a few weak Songs), then I lost interest in most of his Albums since the mid 1990s(did not like 'Come' or 'Chaos and Disorder' and those Albums were just submitted to complete a contract obligation-IIRC, although maybe I need to re-listen to 'Come' as there seems to be some people who like at least part of that Album) until 'Musicology', '3121', 'Planet Earth', 'Lotusflow3r' & '20Ten'. The 'Crystal Ball' 4 CD Set is worth owning though, as I did like it, but need to pull it out and start playing it again.

    I will buy 'Art Official Age' eventually.
     
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  13. The Elephant Man

    The Elephant Man Forum Resident

    Before Sheryl Crow, it was Melissa Etheridge then Eddie Vedder. They were the 'acceptable faces of the new
    rock' for the middle of the road fans who aren't the kind to discover new music on their own.
     
  14. Orthogonian Blues

    Orthogonian Blues A man with a fork in a world full of soup.

    Location:
    London, UK
    Yeah, the Musicology era was the era I was getting into classic Prince. (You know, his prime eighties and early nineties stuff).

    For a long time, I thought of him as nothing but a crazy damn, chain mail hat wearing, symbol named, short assed fool.

    So as well as the thrill of discovering his classic work, in early 2004 I had the pleasant surprise of witnessing Prince return to the mainstream.
     
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  15. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    "Emancipation" was the first Prince album that really disappointed me. I'd liked everything until that point - yeah, "Come" wasn't great, but it didn't seem like the "beginning of the end" it now feels like.

    I really enjoyed "Gold" and was pumped for greatness from "Emancipation", partly because Prince sold it as a massive artistic statement. He was finally freed from his "slavery" at WB - huge 3-CD set! Classic imminent!

    Or maybe not. There's maybe 1 CD of good material spread across that set, and I'd be hard-pressed to find much that I'd call great.

    In fairness, I've not played "Emancipation" in years, so maybe there's more good material than I recall.

    All I know is that it fell far short of expectations in 1996 and was the first indication to me that Prince might be on the decline! :(
     
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  16. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Rave was one of the lowest points in his catalogue, but I won't lie, there's even stuff on that album I really like. The title cut, The Greatest Romance Ever Sold, Eye Love U But Eye Don't Trust U Anymore and The Sun The Moon And Stars all come to mind. The album failed in its mission but there's stuff on it that I do enjoy
     
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  17. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Emancipation is actually better than you remember. A lot of it sounds better to my ears today than in 1996. I think 3 discs of new material was overkill but on a track by track basis, there's a lot of worthy stuff on it and its definitely on the higher end of his 90s work (IMO only surpassed by Gold and Love Symbol). Probably would've been better to be cut down to a single disc, but at that point Prince was able to do whatever he wanted since he didn't feel the constraints by Warner anymore, so he did it.
     
  18. Freek999

    Freek999 Forum Resident

    Emancipation's worst problem is the plastic production. I've tried many times to "get" Emancipation, some times it seems I managed it, but if I'm honest, even a one disc best of would be overshadowed by the Gold Experience.
     
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  19. Freek999

    Freek999 Forum Resident

    and I love the NPGMC tracks on The Chocolate Invasion & The Slaughterhouse collections :) (talking about plastic production)

    So my dislike with Emancipation probably has to do with my dislike of 90's r'n'b
     
  20. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I should give it another listen and reappraise it. Heck, I hated "Rainbow" with a passion in 2001 but eventually realized it was a decent album!

    None of this will change the way my then-current view of Prince's post-1995 releases/concerts impacted my interest in the man, though! :sigh:
     
  21. footprintsinthesand

    footprintsinthesand Reasons to be cheerful part 1

    Location:
    Dutch mountains
    Emancipation is one of my favourites, especially disc 2. With this and half of disc 1 and 3 I could make an excellent double cd. And I also love Gold, so happy I got that in Florida because my Hertz rental car didn't have a cassette player.
     
  22. Go back and give it a listen. Emancipation is a near masterpiece.

    In fact, I don't get the whole "classic period" talk or there was a "drop off" from Prince.

    Prince had all but quit consciously writing radio oriented pop songs by 1985 for Around the World in a Day. On that album "Raspberry Beret" was an older song that he had dusted off, and "Pop Life," was a Purple Rain era song that didn't fit the album. He became a more album oriented artist who let the chips fall where they may if he had a hit or not. This is a person who wanted to keep his artistic integrity intact by not pandering the masses. He became only concerned with writing good tunes, and when it came time to release singles (as record companies are wont to do), there was a battle between Prince and WB as to what singles should come out. Prince wasn't necessarily the best at choosing singles, and he wasn't always the best at putting the strongest material on an album, either. I believe that after Purple Rain, if Prince had any fault (mostly out of ego), it was that he began to toy with WB, seeking hit records totally on his own terms, without following a formula. It worked, too! Only as every artist will inevitably find, they eventually fall from favor in the public eye. WB had, indeed, served a purpose, and that was a be the marketing machine by which an artist is exposed to the public. Therefore, by the time we get to the whole "slave" thing, it was a double-edged sword. On one hand, Prince was right to fight them, as he opened doors not only for himself, but for a slew of new artists to follow (the repercussions of Prince "winning" is still felt today as it caused a shift in how artists relate to big record companies). On the other hand, not only did Prince lose the power of marketing behind him, but his public image suffered with the name change and "slave." It wasn't anything that Prince hadn't already been doing - though this new tack was an extreme - but the public was confused, now he didn't have a distribution deal, yet he got what he wanted by being totally alone. Thus, by the time that Prince got around Emancipation their image of Prince was painted a different color. Many viewed his as crazy, and this is why the line in the sand ends at 1995 as his "classic period," where fans pencil him in as going down hill. It really didn't help that Prince broke stride and tried to cater to the crowd once more with Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic. Following a formula was what what he was good at, so trying for a Santana Supernatural fell flat on its face. Everything released after that, however, was mostly exceptional (with maybe the exception of Planet Earth - and even with that album, the outtakes were better than most album songs). These albums contained the exact same strategy that started back in 1985. The public wasn't listening, though, as concert sales for a legacy act was miles above album sales. Well, perhaps I shouldn't say "exact," because at an older age Prince began making a series of albums that either a.) was designed to school a new generation on the finer points of funk and R&B, or b.) constructed to feed Prince's inner flights of fancy (see the 20Ten album, where he went back to playing '70s & '80s instruments, and even writing much in the '80s style). By the time we get the Art Official Age, Prince is putting on a clinic in how to write smooth R&B. He's not necessarily trendsetting, but he was certainly saying that "I can do it just as good or better than you guys, only by myself, without 18 producers and multiple songwriters." It didn't matter that people's impressions were colored by the past; these were statements that were true to himself, ones where he didn't need audience validation to confirm his genius. The only thing that changed was time, but the approach dates back to 1985.

    I submit that his melodic invention never changed nor ceased to exist. Only his style changed. Gone were the days of guitar-centered cross-over songs, while the rock 'n' rollers wondered where Prince went. He didn't go anywhere. He had already done that shtick and it was over. There became no use of pining for those days that he didn't care to revisit. The quality remained.
     
  23. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    Kate Bush had done it earlier in her career(retain ownership of her Music), and surprised other Music Artists had not done the same thing until Prince finally had enough and fought for his Freedom and owning any New Music he would release.

    Also, I like everything you wrote, but using Paragraphs would be helpful.
     
  24. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    I lost interest when he became a Jehovah's Witness and apparently going around to People's Houses and knocking on Doors selling his Religion and also covered by Kevin Smith in his Talk that I think, IIRC, was at Kent University(I do not see the Link on Youtube anymore except for a small clip from it on Prince trying to have a Camel delivered in the middle of a Frozen Winter Night, as he was separated from reality at times).

    I did not buy 'The Rainbow Children' since this album apparently was pushing his JW Message, but then again I listen to and just attended a Spiritualized Concert despite several Songs by J Spaceman with references to Jesus and the Lord, and I am Agnostic, but Great Music is Great Music, so maybe I should check out 'The Rainbow Children'.
     
  25. citizensmurf

    citizensmurf Ambient postpunk will never die

    Location:
    Calgary
    You are correct. Great music is great music. An Athiest avoiding Christian lyrics and themes is as silly as Christians avoiding "devil" music.
     
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