qobuz 24 bit music

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Scott Sheagren, Jun 26, 2019.

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  1. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    im so addicted to qobuz!
    steve miller hi -res
    chicago hi-res
    iron maiden hi -res
    doobie brothers hi -res
    ccr hi -res
    led zeppelin hi-res
    black sabbath hi -res
    fleetwood mac hi -res
    the doors hi -res
    rush hi -res
    the list goes on of some of my favorite bands!
     
  2. Timbo21

    Timbo21 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    When I export mixes from Logic Pro X I find 24bit is more of a noticeable improvement than using higher sample rates.
     
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  3. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    I 100 percent agree!
    In my car using qobuz through the usb I’m sure my cars dac cannot go over 48khz but it does 24 bit.i listened to Chicago and Steve Miller and they both sounded fantastic!
    and with hi-res hifi system its just simply amazing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2019
  4. art

    art Senior Member

    Location:
    520
    thank the gods and and goddesses.
     
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  5. Ontheone

    Ontheone Poorly Understood Member

    Location:
    Indianapolis
    I currently have both Qobuz and Tidal. I listen mostly to jazz and lesser to rock, americana, alternative. Qobuz has a much deeper 24/192 library and I greatly prefer the Qobuz hi-res over the Tidal MQA. I wish Qobuz would offer a family plan...I'm pretty sure I would offload Tidal if they did. Tidal does have more rock.
     
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  6. vwestlife

    vwestlife Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey, USA
    Have you tried converting it to 16-bit and then doing a blind comparison test between 24-bit and 16-bit? I bet most of the difference you're hearing is due to better mastering and the placebo effect. Even an MP3 file can sound "much more musical" than a CD if the CD was poorly mastered.
     
  7. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    Qobuz is way better in my opinion!
    I also love jazz rock.
    Listen to Chicago their albums sound amazing
    And listen to billy cobham they sound smazing.
     
  8. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    No just flac baby!
    My dream came true!
    Hi-Res in flac
    No more need to buy cds or vinyl,only my favorite bands.
     
  9. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    At the moment I’m just going between the cd vs the hi res(like a fast response between the 2 to make sure it’s not just my mind playing tricks on me)and at the moment everyone the hi res has deeper bass and music just pops out more from the back ground and instruments are more separated.if it’s just mastering then qobuz has the best masters.next is clockwork angels by rush cause the 24 bit one on hd music vs the cd I heard no difference cause of the ****ty mastering.
     
  10. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    I hate to burst the OP's bubble, but 24-bit has nothing in the real world sound quality wise over a 16-bit recording of the same bit rate.

    The 16 or 24 bit specification is does not refer to the sample rate which is the resolution of the digital music. It references only the dynamic range of the sample.

    For example, 16-bit integer resolution allows for a dynamic range of about 96 dB., while 24-bit can give you a dynamic range of 144 dB.

    For example, assuming a noise floor of 30-dB. of background noise and it you were to listen to music loud at an average SPL of 85 dB., with peaks of 105 dB, you would have a real world dynamic range of 75 dB.

    Having an extra 48 dB. of dynamic range is not going to have any effect over the music that you are listening to.

    The sample rate is the resolution or how many samples per second the digital signal is sampled, as in the above example of 192.

    The sample rate of a CD is 44.1 thousand time each second. 192 refers to a sample rate of 192,000 times each second.

    If, in fact that one digital file sounds better, with the same mastering over another it has to do with the sample rate and not the 16 or 24 bit depth.
     
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  11. Josquin des Prez

    Josquin des Prez I have spoken!

    Location:
    U.S.
    I had TIDAL for months when Qobuz became available. After a month I cancelled my TIDAL account. I'm using Roon which does the first unfold of MQA, but my hardware doesn't support MQA, nor do I. I don't see the point of it except as a power/money grab web of licensing fees for another proprietary format thinly veiled as DRM. It's ultimately a big bag of hurt for consumers fro what I can tell. Qobuz via Roon sounds great on my streamer. I have no desire to use TIDAL again.

    And yes – all things being equal, mastering wise – 24-bit sounds better. More dynamic, better clarity, more musical.
     
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  12. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    Oh I know that tech stuff.
    And your right I’m sure.im hearing more samples per second of the original wave and it has nothing to do with the bit depth.
    I just figured the more sounds coming out at me had to do with the bit depth.
    Basically what I hear is like a small circle when listening to the cds and hires it’s a much larger circle and not so conjested.every instrument has more room to breath.i just figured that had to do with the dynamic range that’s all.
     
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  13. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    9.5 times out of 10, I prefer the Qobuz Hi rez vs Tidals MQA version. One exception, The Eagles Hotel California MQA sounds a smidge better to my ears. I assume the Qobuz is the same mastering.
     
  14. enfield

    enfield Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex UK
    Probably different master used in the 24bit if you can hear any difference .
    No one in controlled listening tests have been able to differentiate 24 bit over 16 bit.

     
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  15. Doctor Fine

    Doctor Fine "So Hip It Would Blister Your Brain"

    Nope.
    I disagree from experience in the studio.
    With 24 bit you can avoid low bit loss of digital details due to low bit rates on LOW VOLUME passages.
    For example if everything stops and there is a very low volume flute playing in the background with 16 bit you may only capture 7 bits of information as the volume drops down that low.
    If you were running 24 bit even that LOW level would show up at 15 bits (using the "extra 8 bits of recording headroom").
    And I GUARANTEE you that a flute sounds better using 15 bits than it does using 7 bits (which sounds AWFUL).
    If anybody knows better than this please tell me as I spend an incredible amount of time trying to keep the bit rate close to 16 with the volume going all over the place on recordings with actual dynamic changes (NOT rock music---of course).
    In other words YES 16 bit sounds GREAT---IF everything were running the full 16.
    But when the volume is LOWER than that you lose a TON of detail with digital.
    It has been like that since the beginning and is why I prefer analog for capturing cymbal detail.
    OR 24 bit!
    My two cents.
     
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  16. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    We are talking about two different things here. In the studio, different instruments, as well as voices are being recorded, all of which have different dynamic ranges.

    24-Bit is designed to be used in the studio, it is a professional tool. It is there to capture all of the different dynamic information, just exactly as you have said.

    However, at home, dynamic range is simple that, dynamic range.

    A CD can handle all of the dynamic range that is needed for accurate reproduction for the dynamics of music.

    The bit-depth specification in digital, references only the available final dynamic range of a recording.

    Unless someone is going to tell me that a greater dynamic range than 96-dB. is necessary in the final mastering, then 16-bit will be able to handle that range quite satisfactorily.

    No, it is not. Unless you need more dynamic range than 96-dB. than 16-bit has nothing to do with sounding better, it doesn't make an end recording have any more clarity and doesn't have anything to do with being more or less musical.

    The bit depth is concerned only with the difference in volume reproduction between the lowest and the maximum volume level that can be reproduced.
     
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  17. enfield

    enfield Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex UK
    Unless you can be sure that the two versions of a recording you are listening to are exactly the same mastering .Which requires measuring the files via a program such as EAC .And you are playing those recordings back via the same dac/amp/speakers/headphones,then a comparison is hard to make.

    As i said earlier,when all those factors do match,no one as yet - in a controlled listening test- has been able to pick out 24 bit over 16 bit.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2019
  18. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    I will test myself one day and tell you the results.ill use audiocity.
    Or actually qobuz hi res albums I can just change them to cd quality on the fly.
     
  19. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    That was fast on qobuz I took the 24 bit 96khz wave and brought it down to 16 bit 44.1khz
    Right away going down the sound got muddy and conjested.
    but again actually not sure if that has to do with the bit depth or sample rate.
     
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  20. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
     
  21. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    Sine we know that the bit depth only determines the volume range, we can rule that attribute out.

    However, you can't rule out the conversion program that you used mucking things up.
     
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  22. Scott Sheagren

    Scott Sheagren I’m a Metal,Rock,Jazz Fusion,Gaga type of guy. Thread Starter

    Location:
    06790
    I’m using the qobuz app to do that
    I just changed the hi-res album on the fly to cd sound.
    Also I have my own lossless server with jriver with all my cds ripped on it.
    The first Chicago album I compared and I’m sure they are the same masters and the hires is just darker,with thicker less muddy bass the mids pop out more and the cymbals have more space around them.The horns have a much better sound also way more focused.
     
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  23. enfield

    enfield Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex UK
    The CD sound is probably a different master. Or maybe they converted the 24 file themselves and didn't 'dither' the conversion properly.

    Archimago's Musings: 24-Bit vs. 16-Bit Audio Test - Part II: RESULTS & CONCLUSIONS
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2019
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  24. CoolJazz

    CoolJazz Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eastern Tennessee
    Scott,

    Save your time and effort. The Flat Earth guys always have a reason why you didn't hear what you heard. It's just a given as they don't want anyone to hear what they don't. This cycle has gone on for decades now, ever since the first bit was guessed at and laid down.

    CJ
     
  25. SirMarc

    SirMarc Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cranford, NJ
    +1,000,000
     
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