Looking better in my notes, I realized that as far as the code 1S 1A 1 used by RCA Italiana, I am not currently in possession of first-hand information that is 100% safe: while for the code 1S I'm almost sure that it does indicate the number of lacquer, by contrast as regards the code 1A it is very likely that it does indicate the take number and not the mother number. If in the future I have news 100% safe, I'll keep you informed.
I am still not sure about a Bowie lp I have.....it is called Images....it has a full silver label (no burgundy) ...it has the third stamp on the label which suggests autumn 1978 onwards.....does this mean it left the pressing plant in 78 ?.....if it was six months older ( with the same label design) would it have the type 2 stamp? ....if so the 2 different stamps could appear on this label ....I have burgundy/silver label for this album which I assumed was the first issue...it has no stamps at all.....what I want to know is did the all silver label appear before 1978 ?
Well: the album "Images" was released in 1973 in the USA and in 1975 in the UK; honestly, I do not now when it was first released in Italy: it may be that this seller is telling the truth.... http://www.popsike.com/DAVID-BOWIE-...P-RARE-EDITION-SILVER-LABEL/190757851941.html Unfortunately, in this picture I can not distinguish the type of SIAE stamp.... The third stamp suggests autumns 1978 onwards, and it does mean that your copy left the pressing plant in autumn 1978 or later. To determine if your copy is a first Italian press, you need to know the year this album was first released in Italy: honestly, i do not think that your copy is a first Italian press. Yes. It's true: it could happen that two copies exactly identical could have two different types of SIAE stamps because these copies evidently had been pressed in the transition between two different types of SIAE stamps; In such cases these copies are considered both first press. Not all copies were stamped by SIAE: there are very few copies not stamped, but there may be. Sorry, I really do not know the Deram Italian label-design history.
Well: on wikipedia (Italian version) there is that this album ("Images" by Bowie) was first pressed in Italy in 1975: if this info is true, I really think that is almost impossible that a copy with the 3rd SIAE stamp type could be a first Italian press. We should have the opportunity to compare two copies, one with the stamp of the second type (which certainly exists, though the album was really released in Italy in 1975) and the other with the stamp of the 3rd kind (ie your copy) and see if they look exactly the same (except for the stamp, of course). Actually, there is a tiny chance that two copies of this album have remained exactly identical at a distance of 3 years of each other: this fact could only happen if in 1975 were pressed an oversupply of copies of this album here Italy, many of which remained unsold, and then put back into circulation gradually over the years; otherwise, I can guarantee that it is almost impossible to find two identical copies at a distance of 3 years. Metal plates (matrices, mothers and stampers) can be used even after many years, but it's really almost impossible that in the meantime have remained identical even the cover, the inner sleeve and labels. Hope this help, at least a little ..
I have some information to add, since on some (I have seen very few of them) Italian vinyl records' labels appears the acronym SEDRIM instead of SIAE or BIEM or DR. SEDRIM is the acronym for 'Società per l'Esercizio dei Diritti di Riproduzione Meccanica': in 1926 in Italy was born the SIDE (Società Incassi Diritti Editoriali), then transformed into SEDRIM that will found in 1929, along with similar French and German companies, the BIEM to provide international protection to holders of copyrights. The functions of SEDRIM will then, as of January 1, 1970, taken by SIAE: therefore, S.I.A.E. took charge of SEDRIM role on January the 1st, 1970. So it's an acronym that was used very little, but it has been used.
A warning to all Italian prog-rock collectors: the outer cover of the album "Storia di un Minuto" by PFM, had a gatefold date-coded cover: only the first Italian pressing has the code 1/72 (January 1972) printed on the back cover, in the lower left corner. Later editions had later dates! This date is printed in really tiny typefaces, but it's out there! Same argument regarding the album "Per un Amico" (by PFM): in this case, however, the date 11/72 (November 1972) is printed on the back cover but in the lower right corner. These outer covers were printed by Grafiche Campi Foligno, a typography that had the custom to date its covers. I just updated discogs.com
My "Storia di un Minuto" gatefold cover has on back, in the lower left corner, the text "CAMPI GRAFICA - FOLIGNO 1/72".... it is printed in really tiny typefaces!
Dear Stefano, Can you share some knowhow on this pressing? I have a 66s mono US version and that sound a bit better but it seems there could be some value in Italian pressings too due to the low pressing quantity? This I cannot even find on Discogs but must be from 66-70 somewhere then based on your info. Matrix A-12073-A, AT, LJ (or similar), M or W, IT
Well: your copy is a first Italian pressing of Coltrane's Sound: I don't think that copies with the BIEM logo exist (copies with the SIAE logo/stamp are later reissues). Please, keep in mind that very often here in Italy many American jazz albums were released for the first time some years later: so, it could happen that an album released in the USA in 1964, here in Italy was first released in 1966 or later. I can't see the outer cover of your copy, but I think that it somewhere says: Distributed by - Rifi Record... As for the sound, I can say that Italian Verve made very good sounding records; but don't forget that Italian editions of USA artists were mastered starting from second generation masters. As for the value, I can say that no Italian Coltrane's record has a great economical value. If you're looking for Italian editions with a high value, you have to look for Italian jazz albums by Italian artists: Giorgio Azzolini, Franco Cerri, Amedeo Tommasi, Dino Piana, Enrico Intra, Franco Ambrosetti...
Cannot see anything about this on the cover. Everything looks like a US copy on the cover. Anyway, I'll return it. Do you know more about these stickers? The right one says "Control importazione with SEDRIM in the middle". It's on another Coltrane Impulse record. Everything on this match the US 1st pressing. Deadwax, label, cover, everything. Made in the USA on both label and sleeve. Is it about that it is a US record legally distributed in Italy?
Thanks for your pics. Well: Rifi Records started to distribute Atlantic records at the end of the sixties, here in Italy. Before that, Atlantic records were distributed by other brands: in this case, by La Voce del Padrone; in 1969 it took place here in Italy the unification of the brands La Voce del Padrone, Pathè, Columbia and Odeon under the brand of EMI Italiana. In your sticker, the brand Odeon isn't mentioned, so I can say that your copy was pressed between the end of 1966 (when the D.R. logo appeared for the first time) and the beginning of 1969. That said, Atlantic changed its label design in 1969 here in Italy: from the black and white one (like your copy) to the black and red one. From the pics you posted, I can say that, as sometimes it happened, your copy has a printed in the USA cover, a pressed in Italy record using made in the USA metal parts, and printed in Italy labels. I remember that some Atlantic Ray Charles' Italian editions had the same features of your copy. Hope it helps.
Thanks! My copy with those stickers has printed "Made in the USA" both on outer sleeve and record labels + correct matrix so I assume it cannot be made in Italy if so. That would be extremely confusing
I can't see a made in the USA statement printed on the label you posted... Anyway, if a copy has the made in the USA statement both on the outer cover and on labels, it is an imported copy. In this case it surely has a sticker with the BIEM or SEDRIM or DR or SIAE logo glued somewhere.
It's two different records I talk about here The pictures with small labels on the outer sleeve is an IMPULSE record and that one says Made in the USA on label and sleeve with correct matrix. It is also a small BIEM sticker on the back of the sleeve yes. The Atlantic label says nothing about country on the label. I'll return that one to the seller since D.R means it is Italian and I wanted US.
I have an Italian Joker label of Sam "Lightnin'" Hopkins "History Of Jazz" The Blues album. One of the best sounding albums I own. You can close your eyes, and he is right in front of you, in the room, playing. Outstanding.
re: the RCA "OLS" series, is it possible that October 1973 releases had the first (?) SIAE logo in a square box? I bought as an "original" 1973 press white label promotional copy. Vinyl trail off in the "dead wax" of Side 1 is CKAY 27368 1S 1A 2 D R Delta symbol. The cover is NOT a gatefold and cheaply made. And NO Roman numerals. Any opinion on this OLS 20 "Anastasia Mio Fratello" (Original Cast LP by Piero Piccioni?
An October 1973 RCA Italiana release surely had the SIAE stamp of the 1st type. That said, when you talk about "first SIAE logo in a square box", do you mean that the round SIAE stamp is placed into the SIAE square box? Italian white label promo copies did not come out with SIAE stamp. The SIAE stamp was placed only on commercial copies: promo copies were not made for commercial purposes. During my career as record collector, only once I saw a promotional copy with the SIAE stamp. But I'm sure that white label promo was SIAE stamped by mistake. I'm not saying that your copy is a counterfeit one: I'm saying that it's very very strange that an Italian white label promo copy has the SIAE stamp. If possible, I'd like to see a picture. Roman numerals were not used by all Italian mastering engineers and/or pressing plants. RCA Italiana in that time did not use Roman numerals as matrix code. It's a very rare, highly sought and priced album... Welcome on board and greetings from Italy!
The "Branduardi" label shown has the same "boxed" SIAE with the 10/73 date to the left on my Piccioni LP.
