Rush - Hold Your Fire

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by thatguy1976, Jul 25, 2017.

  1. ytserush

    ytserush Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northeast US

    As to Roll The Bones, from a cohesive and theme standpoint, I would agree with that. The songs belong or fit with that theme. But Face Up? Neurotica? Maybe I'd have liked these songs if they'd have been played live but I don't know if Rupert Hine ever did them any justice.

    Vapor Trails (original) flat out is one of the best albums they have ever recorded in even in spite of the sonic disaster it is. They never recorded another album like it. Totally inspired and original unlike anything they've ever done before. I really wish more was played like but I get why it wasn't. I'd almost pay a lot of money to hear a tribute band do it.
     
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  2. Dansk

    Dansk rational romantic mystic cynical idealist

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I would pay a lot of money to have the album remixed by a sympathetic and talented engineer. One of the frequent complaints I read about VT is that it contains so many layers, particularly Geddy's vocal tracks. (I've seen it called a "Pro Tools disaster" more than once.) Personally, that's part of what makes it so fascinating; I love the dense layering, it feels like walking through a dark forest, with new details hiding everywhere waiting to be found. I just wish the production gave it a little more room to breathe, so you could better hear those layers. The basic building blocks of a sonic masterpiece are all there, it just needs the right set of ears to massage it into being.

    The first and most important thing to understand, though, is that it's NOT a metal album, which is how Dave Bottrill came at it. They made a terrible choice in picking him to remix it...
     
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  3. Futurecity

    Futurecity Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nevada
    I think that Roll The Bones might be their best Atlantic Records album actually, that whole album was very commercial, but the songs are fantastic. Counterparts was a terrific follow-up of course. As for Presto, it's still a mixed bag to me, but is essential for "Show Don't Tell", "The Pass", "Presto" and "Superconductor" and a few others. They finally ditched the heavy synthesizer sound and got back to basics...I like the way that "Show Don't Tell" starts off that album...the guitar was back!
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2019
  4. Ron2112

    Ron2112 Forum Resident

    HYF was my least favorite tour, and the fact that they revived Xanadu at all was sort of a turning point on the Presto tour. And I agree about the RtB tour.
     
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  5. Ron2112

    Ron2112 Forum Resident

    Ummmmmm…….that DID happen in 2014. And the results are stellar.
     
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  6. Dansk

    Dansk rational romantic mystic cynical idealist

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    The results hurt my head every bit as much as the original mix does. The kick drum sounds like a telegraph key. Not to mention, it uses completely different tracks than the original, it's not even the same album.

    I bought it, listened to it once or twice, and then put it away and never listened to it again.
     
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  7. Ghost of Ziggy

    Ghost of Ziggy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hell
    I love every song on Presto.
     
  8. lwh1

    lwh1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kent, England
    Me too!
     
  9. George Co-Stanza

    George Co-Stanza Forum Resident

    Location:
    America
    I can't say I love Super(freaking)Conductor, but I do like most of the songs on this record, and love a few (The Pass, Available Light, Chain Lightning). Even though it does rock at times, the production makes it Rush's "easy listening" album, which isn't a bad thing per se.
     
  10. RicB

    RicB Certified Porcupine Tree Fan

    Location:
    Pacific NW, USA
    Agree totally! I thought that was just me... What the heck did he do to the drums???
     
  11. Futurecity

    Futurecity Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nevada
    Yes, I also like the Sector Grace Under Pressure CD a lot and find myself playing it a little more than the other CDs in the Box...it's got the lowest volume level of all the Sector 3 CDs and it does sound excellent - this album always had more normal original production...Getty's vocals weren't processed like they were on Signals and it doesn't sound like a super bright and digital album like PW and HYF...it's got warmth and a nice analog quality and more guitar and far less synthesizers.

    I wish all of the Sector 3 CDs had this lower volume level...how could GUP be a DR 9 and PW a DR 7?
     
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  12. *Zod*

    *Zod* Forum Resident

    Location:
    New England
    has anyone done the thing with the sector box where you can remove the NASA voiceover effects in Countdown and/or the mob chants in Witch Hunt? Man, I've GOT to hear that.
     
  13. JulesRules

    JulesRules Weaponized, Deranged Warthog Thug

    Location:
    Germany
    I only said "part of". I'm not saying they completely lost it. However they had a very particular sound, starting from the first album, evolving over the 70s and early 80s, that just didn't sound the same anymore after "Signals". I'm pretty sure it has a lot to do with Terry Brown's particular way of producing. None of the albums that followed ever recaptured that mixture... that's not to say I don't enjoy them, far from it, but the tones and arrangements just somehow become more "standard" than "Rush". Hard to put it into better words. You can quickly draw a line from any post-1982 Rush album to a couple of other then-current bands and see sonic similarities, something I find much harder to do with albums like Hemispheres or Moving Pictures. Those don't sound like anyone else to me.

    PS: Love "Red Lenses" and think it's one of the better songs on an album that just doesn't really connect all that well with me either...
     
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  14. JulesRules

    JulesRules Weaponized, Deranged Warthog Thug

    Location:
    Germany
    Caravan is one of the catchier songs IMO! I love playing the riff on the guitar. Great start to the album too. And The Wreckers is pretty impressive, I think... but the sound quality hurts it a lot, the live version from the R40 CD sounds so much better. Same goes for Headlong Flight (which gives me a headlong headache in the studio version), The Anarchist and the title track. Wish them Well is definitely weak, and personally I also find 7 Cities too labored and forced sounding despite some good ideas. Carnies is OK. If they had gone for a less overproduced sound, I think some people would view the songs differently...
     
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  15. George Co-Stanza

    George Co-Stanza Forum Resident

    Location:
    America
    Regarding the Terry Brown mixing, I know what you mean, but to be fair, I don't think his style would have worked well with the direction they were going in the 80's, as shown by the original mix of Signals, which has fortunately been drastically improved over the years with the remasters. I think Peter Collins was by far their best producer post-Terry Brown; he was the producer on both Power Windows and Counterparts, both of which are great albums that sound tremendous.

    I would kill for a cleaner-sounding version of Clockwork Angels, but even with the muddy sound, I still love it. The songs are all very strong (at worst), and there are some legitimately great Rush songs on there.
     
  16. Instant Dharma

    Instant Dharma Dude/man

    Location:
    CoCoCo, Ca
    Whats great about the Peter Collins albums is that he helped crystalize their keyboard leanings and worked on making the tunes more dynamic and intricate. Then after a two album gap helped them get back to being a tighter, leaner guitar-led power trio.
     
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  17. ad180

    ad180 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Signals sounds fantastic, especially the RL-cut vinyl. Terry did a great job, and I don't think any remaster did anything to change his work drastically. Some remasters used alternate mixes, but they are still Terry's work.
     
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  18. They needed to use John Cuniberti, who might have re-amped a lot of it, or Steven Wilson. Either of those guys would have been able to get something better. I still prefer the remix edition to the original, though. The original is one of the 2-3 worst-sounding albums in my collection.
     
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  19. Definitely one of their most consistent start-to-finish. It's a great full listen, in the way that Moving Pictures and Power Windows are. Many/most other Rush albums have a number of songs that I skip.
     
  20. JulesRules

    JulesRules Weaponized, Deranged Warthog Thug

    Location:
    Germany
    I agree that they sound great, and Counterparts is one of my favourite late-era Rush albums, but I still find them sounding a bit more "generic" than the 70s and early 80s Rush material. They were not setting the trend themselves anymore. Fair enough, they still did great work within the context of the respective zeitgeist.
     
  21. George Co-Stanza

    George Co-Stanza Forum Resident

    Location:
    America
    The remasters seemed to balance everything out quite a bit. The original sounded like the guitars weren't as up front as they should have been, and at the expense of the keys, which also aren't as up front as they should have been.

    As much as I liked Roll the Bones, Counterparts sounded like a return to hard rock form. I don't worry about if an album is setting trends or not...good music is good music. :)
     
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  22. ad180

    ad180 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Well, everything up to the 2015 remasters were more and more compressed. That would bring background instruments forward slightly.

    I still prefer the original master, not dynamically compromised. It breathes and sounds great when you crank it up.
     
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  23. Dansk

    Dansk rational romantic mystic cynical idealist

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Yeah, Signals is probably Rush's most crankable album. It just sounds better and better the louder it gets.
     
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  24. DiabloG

    DiabloG City Pop, Rock, and anything 80s til I die

    Location:
    United States
    Has the band ever spoken about why they did different mixes of some of the Hold Your Fire songs? All we know is that the 'incorrect' tapes were used on the Sector remaster. Considering the 2 tom tom hits after the first chorus of Time Stand Still, the wind chimes at the beginning of Tai Shan, the panning chorus in Turn the Page, and that extra guitar @4:37 during High Water, I wonder if these versions were how the band intended them to be heard. Given that they're more 'complete' than the original mixes which didn't have the overdubs, maybe it could be the case. However, the counterargument to this is that Sean Magee's vinyl and hi-res remasters both reverted to the original mix, so I guess we'll never know the true reason for the Sector's differences. Perhaps this could be a good question for Geddy or Alex if anyone ever gets a chance to meet them?
     
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  25. c-eling

    c-eling They're made of light,We never would have guessed

    I'll add the old S/T as very crankable as well. (WG For US)
     
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