Rush - Moving Pictures on CD / Digital Poll: Blind Listening Test

After countless assurances that I'd make a Moving Pictures blind listening test, it's finally here! I'm hoping that this one'll do a little better than the previous Rush threads given that it's their most popular album. Since I'd prefer to keep the number of choices in these polls limited to 6 or less, there are 3 masterings that I left out. Doing a back and forth revealed that these are extremely similar to versions that are already in the poll (and one comes from the same digital transfer with nearly identical EQ), so I felt it was best to not include them. The alternative would've been to offer 9 different CDs to choose from, and that's just overkill IMO. I feel that I should've done this for Signals too, but at least there, all of the masterings sounded somewhat different against one another.

This is the first time that I've started a blind test while another one is running concurrently (In a Silent Way). I don't know how much that's going to affect this one, but we'll see.

Each sample contains 6 different masterings of a track played in consecutive order (ie - A, B, C, etc.). ReplayGain has been applied through Audacity so that each version of the song is at the same relative volume.

Rules and notes:

• ***In order to avoid biased votes, please do not guess or speculate which mastering a sample uses. This is especially important here since pointing out which sample is the hi-res version will likely sway the results in its favor!

• If you intend to vote, it may be better to read other people's posts after you have listened to the samples and voted, in order to escape confirmation bias.
• It's recommended that you listen to the samples and discuss what you heard. Discussion of compression (without referring to DR values), EQ, and different tape speeds is fair game.
• Comments based on visual inspection of waveforms, spectral plots, and DR values might condition the poll results while the poll is open. I strongly urge you to avoid talking about these things until the poll has closed.
• You can't view the results before you vote.
• Votes are publicly displayed.
• If you want to change your choice, you can do so as much as you please until the poll's expiration.
• This is entirely optional, but I'd appreciate if you could point out if you're listening on speakers or through headphones. If you don't, then that's totally fine. It does help a bit though.

SAMPLES

• Tom Sawyer
• Red Barchetta
• YYZ
• Limelight
• Witch Hunt

If you want, feel free to check out my previous blind listening polls:

• The Cars - The Cars
• The Cars - Heartbeat City
• Miles Davis - In a Silent Way (currently ongoing)
• Genesis - Trespass
• Genesis - Nursery Cryme
• Genesis - Foxtrot
• Genesis - Selling England by the Pound
• Genesis - The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway
• Genesis - A Trick of the Tail
• Genesis - Wind & Wuthering
• Genesis - ...And Then There Were Three...
• Genesis - Duke
• Genesis - Abacab
• King Crimson - In the Court of the Crimson King
• The Police - Reggatta de Blanc
• Rush - 2112
• Rush - Permanent Waves
• Rush - Signals
• Rush - Grace Under Pressure
• Yes - The Yes Album
• Yes - Fragile
• Yes - Close to the Edge
• Yes - 90125

Feb. 12th will be the date of MP's 41st anniversary, so I think that's a decent deadline for voting.
Have fun!

 

I'm passionate about getting the recording with the best dynamics because I've found that when I sit and listen to an album (ie listen whilst not doing anything else), the better the dynamics the better my engagement and enjoyment at the end of the album.

I joined this forum about 16 years ago just after I had bought the remaster of Sparticus by Triumvirat. One thing I always found amusing near the end of the album is when the lyrics are "Kind of death will be the choice of Rome, Crucifixion or a lion's food" and this always made me smile because the music sounded happy and thus didn't match the lyrics.

What I found with the remaster is that though it clearly sounded better than the old CD, by the time I got to near the end of the album I was no longer listening. I had turned it down and was doing something else as well. So I always missed this. Even when I tried to keep listening I kept getting distracted.

Trying to find out what could be happening is how I discovered this forum, and thus learned that remaster did not mean using better tapes and doing similar work to the host of this forum to get the best sound possible, but was now compressing the music so the dynamics were killed.

My point of the above is that when listening to a 6 second sample of a track a compressed snippet may sound better. Similarly just adding more bass and more treble can make a sample stand out. It's only when paying attention to many whole tracks that the loss of dynamics and/or smiley EQ starts to become annoying to me.

For a trained ear it is possible / even easy to hear compression and/or smiley EQ in a 6 second snippet. And of course the worse the remastering then the easier it is to detect. But I think for most it is easy to be fooled by a remaster.

PS - One of the reasons that even bands you would expect to have great sound fall prey to the loudness wars is that I don't think anyone in the band ever sits down and listens to a recording as I do. Rather, by the end of mixing, or after playing it live many times, they only listen to a snippet of the loudness wars tweaks, agree that the changes add a bit of punch, and we thus we often have a great recording ruined.

 

It seems obvious that six seconds wouldn't be adequate, but it's also obvious that there are no six-second samples in any of the listening tests around here, so it seems like you're complaining about a problem that doesn't exist. Diablo usually provides roughly 45-second samples. Sure, it's not whole tracks, but there would be copyright issues with that, and your argument gets a lot weaker when we're talking about 45 seconds rather than six. 45 seconds seems enough to get a sense of what each disc sounds like, especially since Diablo generally chooses his samples well.

 

Apologies for getting the timing wrong.

But 45 seconds is, IMHO, not at all enough time to get a feel for what a disc sounds like.

As I said, a trained ear will be able to tell lots about the recording. But it takes much, much longer for the feel of what has been done to become apparent.

The first taste or two of some food is when we tend to judge it most. More salt or sugar (depending on the food) gives an impression that the food has more taste. And this explains why so much food has high sugar/salt. But it's only when you eat all the food/finish the drink, that the negative effects of too much salt/sugar are apparent.

 

I agree that these blind tests aren't representative of listening to the whole disc, but I still like doing them since they can be fun and the results are often interesting. FWIW, I've found that the masterings that I ended up preferring in these threads are almost always a version that retains dynamics and doesn't have bright or smiley-faced EQ.

 

A, B, and C didn't have enough bass for me.

D,E,F had meaty Geddy bass. I liked all three. It was a tough call but picking D.

 

I selected E, but I liked A very much, as well.
B sounds the warmest to my ears. It would be my third pick.
C and F sound similar and a bit compressed.
D sounds very compressed. I would avoid this one.

I listened on speakers using a Plex Media Server through a Roku.

 

I played all these on my usual Sony headphones into my Scarlett interface, running at 192kHz over an ASIO connection so I think I'm getting the hi-res one at the native sample rate...

This is a great album, but Terry Brown's fully kitted-out production is surely a hard one to balance correctly: getting the SNAP of Neil's kit and the GROWL of Ged's bass to sit well alongside everything else going on (Lerxst's multi-layered guitars, synths galore, special effects, and of course that voice) must be a challenge for any mastering engineer!

I think the most evident compression is on A, it sounds very 'boomy' or 'thuddy' overall as a result. E also has a bit too much compression going, especially in the top-end, which gets in the way of the clarity. B and C are more clear, and have nice moments, but I didn't like the balance of frequencies, either too much top or too little mids, whatever choice was made it feels too polite. F is closer to what I'm looking for, but not quite enough bass extension. D really ROCKS, everything articulates nicely and it got my head bopping almost every time. So that's what I'm picking!

 

Par for the course, I went with my Meze 99 Classics through foobar2000. In contrast to In a Silent Way, I surprisingly found that all of the samples showcased very clear differences over one another.

A - Reasonably balanced EQ, but also compressed. Drums lack the slam and impact that I expect from this album. Witch Hunt has more tape hiss here, possibly indicating a copy tape.
B - Excellent and lifelike midrange, best sense of space. Treble is smoothed over a bit, potentially making it the easiest listen if you're playing the whole album.
C - Cymbals are a little too splashy sounding, but otherwise, it's fine. Like A, Witch Hunt has a little more hiss than the others and could be from a copy tape. Maybe an older transfer?
D - Very similar to B, though it's somewhat 'cloudier' in the busier sections. The bass playing is highlighted quite well on this one. Will go with D as my favorite, but B's rich mids might make me prefer it.
E - Thin, kind of brittle, and compressed. As with A, I think the drums feel constrained and don't jump out of the mix like they should. Not horrible, but far from engaging.
F - Probably the most balanced, but I felt B and D gelled more for me.

Excellent: D > B
Decent: F > C
Fair: A
Nah: E

 

Interesting. I thought the drums sounded the sharpest on A. Maybe I need to listen on headphones to see how it differs from my speakers.

Totally agree with you on B.

 

I have the original Europe CD (Mercury maybe) so looking forward to the results on this one!

 

This one is more difficult for me than In a Silent Way, which was pretty straightforward to my ears. There is always a little something that doesn't quite perfectly gel for me here, must be the mix!

Listening on speakers, on the whole:

A lacks body and the imaging is not as good as the others but it's subtle.
B has better tonality but sounds a bit dead, subtly lacks room/reverb for some reason.
C has snap but is inconsistently balanced.
D has good extension, impact, sounds full, hifi.
E has air and space, but is on the bright/thin side.
F has good tonality but sounds a bit hard/dead.

It's like things went better in the second half of the samples.

I went with D.

 

Interesting (at least to me) poll. First, one of my fave albums. Second, unlike a lot of these polls I've followed, seems like to date one overwhelming favorite.

 

D was superb with its huge and full sound, everything sounded right.
E was the thinnest and hardest sounding,
All others fall somewhere betweeen.

 

I have a pretty good idea of what three of these are, based on their peaks, but the others are a little mysterious... should be really interesting to see what is in store for the long-awaited 40th anniversary (41st!) box set later this year

 

Ok, I finally got a bit of time for this. Just a general review:

A may lack a bit of bass. I don't know, there's something I don't like about it. Weird imaging too.

B lacks a bit of detail, especially on highs compared with the others. But it's a bit more cranckable.

C can sound a bit thin at times, especially compared with D, but it's fine to me.

D seems to have more info on the low mids, giving it more detail. With Limelight sounded a bit smiley faced; lack of detail on mids.

E feels somewhat between D and C. But doesn't feel interesting. I know, very subjective remark.

F feels like it has too much subs and low bass on Red Barchetta. May feel uncomfortable at times.

Sometimes, D, E and F sound too exaggerated on the low mids and bass... I think they can be a bit tiring after a while.

Very hard, this one ahah
B is weird, but I don't think it's bad; just different.

Torn between B and D, oddly enough.

Then I compared the samples with other music I have here. I think I'm leaning towards B as the more neutral one. But D sounds better sometimes, with that extra bass.
Will leave my vote for another time, I guess ahah

 

This is kind of where I'm at but I'm going to have to listen to each one again before I can narrow it down among C, D,E,and F.

This is the toughest Rush call for me yet.

 

I'm thinking this could be one of the reasons why I'm not much of a fan of Limelight. I prefer the version from the live broadcast in Montreal (1981) more though. I've never really liked how the studio version sounded and maybe this is one reason why.

 

Listening on JBL 305P Mk II powered monitors with LSR310S sub, with a Focusrite Scarlett Solo 4i4 (3rd gen) serving as DAC.

For this album, I listen primarily to the snap of the drums and to whether Geddy's voice sounds right; secondarily to the overall tonal balance and how well the mastering conveys the clarity of the mix. This album always had a kind of high-tech gloss about it; back in 1981, it sounded as modern as Gary Numan, but it still rocked. There is also a certain nimbleness that needs to be preserved, but which you lose if you boost the bass too much. Too much thunder is not nimble.

A, D, and E all boost the bass too much for my taste. All of them tend to exaggerate the bass drum and floor toms. D has the thickest, muddiest upper bass; E the heaviest deep bass. A and E are also peak-limited, which recesses the drums and results in a rather uninvolving sound. E also has an unhelpful boost in the upper mids.

B rolls off the treble a bit, which kills the snap and projection of the drums. Other than that, though, it sounds good.

That leaves us with C and F. Neither is perfect, but C feels more like what I think this album should feel like. It has that high-tech gloss and feels powerful without feeling too heavy. It's hard to say why I don't think F equals it.

My rankings: C > F >> D > B > E >>>> A. Realistically, I could be happy with any of my top three.

I'm pretty sure I know what A and C are; I had an instant sense of recognition when I heard them. I don't know the others.

 

A jazzy new interpretation of one of the "Tom Sawyer" themes by Brad Mehldau — just in case you need a palate cleanser:



From his upcoming album Jacob's Ladder due in March

 

I voted for sample E. On my speaker system it has the best EQ of the samples. Good balance to the sound. Not too bright and just enough low end. Good separation between instruments and Geddy's voice sounds "just right". As does the snare drum and fantastic bass drum sound.

The runner-up would be sample D. Like in the G/P listening test it's pretty easy to guess which mastering this is. It's very easy on the ears, but ultimately it's a bit too dark and especially the bass is borderline bloated. This is not a mastering that feels "true" to the mix and recording, but it does sound darn good.

The others all have their minor problems. Sample F sounds pretty good, but lacks the fullness and body of sample E (not to mention sample D).

Sample A - C sounded bright and at least A and C sounded a bit harsh. Sample D had a bit better top end but otherwise it sounded a little thin and lifeless.

 

As with In a Silent Way, I hope we can reach 25 votes for this one.

 

Listened through Totem speakers with a Linn amp.
The common denominator for me on each track was D, B, C.
My system is a little on the bright side but pulls out a lot of music information, which I like and so pushed D to the top throughout the samples.
I would be happy with either B or C however but, I'm landing on D for Moving Pictures.

 

First impression, on main system:

I voted F, because it was the most consistently good and couldn’t find any major flaws, although I did prefer B on a few tracks, and especially Geddy’s vocals on B. Loved the big synth sound on Witch Hunt on B too.

I found myself always wanting to turn B, D, and F up, while A, C, and E had the opposite effect. On YYZ, though, B seemed a little congested. Overall, A seemed a little sterile and over processed, as did C. E was a little better but maybe a little smiley faced with way too much at the very bottom end.

 

I forgot to mention, but last time I used my ATH-M40X plugged into my pc.

I've listened again and, this time, I used my Yamaha HS8 plugged into my Scarlet 18i20. I didn't push the volume that much, because I couldn't.
General remarks:
A sounded aggressive. Didn't please me.
B natural and mellow. A bit vintage.
C compressed.
D sounded a bit boosted. Slightly exaggerated and smiley on some cases. Not necessarily bad, but not the mids I'd hope.
E compressed and exaggerated lows.
F sounded nice, this time, but the highs were weird here and there, I don't really know. Lacks bass compared to D. Could sound thin. I guess the sub bass was not that present. If I could have boosted the volume more, I'd probably notice more the low end impact.

Between D and F.. I don't know, but B is the softest one. More cranckable and balanced. Detailed and pleasant mids.

I'll vote for B, since I like detailed mids. Really like to listen to the guitars here. I find it the best on Red Barchetta. But both D and F would work for me, in general, I guess.

I have two versions of this album. I think one is B and the other is possibly D or F. That would be a good sign, at least ahah

Cheers!