Selling vinyl...my nightmare

Discussion in 'Marketplace Discussions' started by sunking101, Aug 2, 2022.

  1. zombiemodernist

    zombiemodernist Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northeastern USA
    Yes the usual etiquette / policy around a vintage sealed record in IRL stores is that the buyer assumes all responsibilities since it is not “new stock”. And generally speaking an online private seller isn’t even held to the standards of a store that buys stock from distributors.

    At the end of the day I think it was unwise of them to buy one of these box sets on the used market, people always have issues with warping and whatnot.

    I guess lesson learned is don’t get into a sale like this again haha.
     
  2. bopdd

    bopdd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    As per this Mr. Leugi, please direct all your replies to the OP and nowhere else. Apparently, this topic wasn't open for discussion. Now let's all give OP a big sympathy hug!
     
  3. Lord Summerisle

    Lord Summerisle Forum Resident

    You buy sealed - you take the risk. His problem.
     
    TonyCzar and MielR like this.
  4. bopdd

    bopdd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    So when you buy new records from a place like MusicDirect and they're warped, you took the risk. Guess you're out of luck.

    There is no etiquette or policy except eBay's policy. The dude bought a product online for what sounds like retail price and then wanted to return it. Anyone who doesn't like the sound of that shouldn't sell their vinyl on eBay. Sell them here instead, where the "etiquette" is either stated or implied.
     
  5. Leugi

    Leugi Forum Resident

    Location:
    DC
    And you couldn’t let it go

    Discussion is fine. Repeatedly insisting you are right and everyone else is wrong is stupid.

    Good day
     
  6. edrebber

    edrebber Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    The buyer might just be purchasing the box set to listen to the records and assumed the records in a sealed box set would be pristine, so was willing to pay extra. Individuals can buy equipment to seal merchandise to make it look unopened. It could be that you were deceived when you purchased the box set. The buyer may have old worn out vinyl from their box set that they will substitute for your vinyl. Lots of scenarios. You've got zero leverage to even prove what what was inside the box, not to mention the box set being unsealed now.
     
    TonyCzar likes this.
  7. MielR

    MielR THIS SPACE FOR RENT

    Location:
    Georgia, USA
    Block that buyer so he can't purchase anything from you again.

    State in the listing that it is a vintage record and you can't guarantee the quality, so NO REFUNDS if the buyer unseals the record.

    I bought a sealed record off eBay once and inside the box was a printout stating something like: "STOP! Once this record is unsealed, buyer accepts all responsibility and LP cannot be returned" blah, blah. You should maybe include something like that in your packages.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022
  8. bopdd

    bopdd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Block the buyer for sure and you can state all that other stuff, but I'm not positive it would matter. You can even make it so that there's no return policy in your store. But at the end of the day, I'm fairly certain the buyer will still try to get their refund/return or leave negative feedback (and still probably get a refund/return), though maybe that policy has changed in recent years. But if the buyer is saying the item is defective, I think eBay will take their side.

    If you actually look at my initial replies, I share your sentiment that this buyer is indeed quite annoying. But anyone suggesting that it's the buyer's fault for purchasing a sealed item and not understanding the implied "etiquette" doesn't seem to understand how eBay works. It's a bummer, for sure, but that's just the nature of selling through a place like eBay.

    That said, there may be precautions a seller can take such as the ones mentioned above. I'm just not sure if it will do any good in the case of what the buyer perceives to be defective merchandise.
     
    MielR likes this.
  9. MielR

    MielR THIS SPACE FOR RENT

    Location:
    Georgia, USA
    If they make a stink, they will get a refund, but it may discourage some dishonest or overly-picky buyers by stating that basically, "Hey, this is an old record. It's a crap-shoot."
     
  10. bopdd

    bopdd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    But is the record old? A Status Quo box set sounds like something that would've come out in the last decade. Maybe not--OP didn't specify.
     
    MielR likes this.
  11. PatBateman86

    PatBateman86 Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Coast, USA
    I dont agree that the seller is accountable for the quality of a sealed out of print lp set. Thats a risk for any of us including those that buy something expensive like The Beatles in Mono box. There were some boxes that contained damaged discs from the factory if i remember correctly. I don't get all this “ if you sell on wbay you are now a record store” (that can send things back to a manufacturer etc). But I get that the buyer has most of the power in situations like these and thats why I dont sell records or even buy them on ebay ( VG my a@$!) not to mention the sellers that dont know how to package. Sorry for your situation.
     
    sunking101 and TonyCzar like this.
  12. zombiemodernist

    zombiemodernist Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northeastern USA
    If you re-read my original post I said “IRL record stores”. Yes eBay is a bit different. That’s why I recommended OP stay away from selling sealed LPs there in the future. With eBay sellers risk encountering buyer protection, and eBay attracts the widest range of buyers who are more likely to be vinyl neophytes than other dedicated marketplaces.
     
    bopdd and TonyCzar like this.
  13. R. Totale

    R. Totale The Voice of Reason

    eBay doesn't care about statements like that in the listing or package.

    OP has already refunded so it may be moot, but they did make some moves in recent years to allow a seller to reduce the amount of refund by up tp 50% if the item is not returned in the same condition in which it was sent. I've never had to deal with this myself, but I know at first it only applied to sellers with a store subscription and for some reason I think it may have been extended to all sellers.
     
  14. eddiel

    eddiel Senior Member

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    PayPal or eBay involved = seller responsible. If not, you are free to do whatever your conscious tells you to do :)
     
    bopdd likes this.
  15. bopdd

    bopdd Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    If you sell on eBay you're subject to eBay's policies. You're not technically a record store but your buyer has the same general rights as a record store customer--that makes you accountable for the product. Furthermore, why is it fair to professional sellers that a private seller can offer the same item at the same exact price while incurring none of the same risks? If you sell at or above retail price through an official online marketplace, why would you be exempt from providing customers with the product they're expecting?

    Furthermore, this particular seller could have opened the item when he bought it and then returned it if he found a defect. Instead, he waited a few years and then turned around to sell it at the same price or maybe even a higher price. I'm not sure if a record store has the ability to return merchandise to a manufacturer something like 3-5 years after ordering it (maybe someone out there can clarify on this point). That's not to mention that record stores often buy merchandise from walk-in sellers and have no ability to return sealed products in that scenario.

    To be clear, this appears to be a downright crappy buyer. I've dealt with plenty of them myself. Were I the seller, I would have first offered a partial refund and then asked for the item back because based on the description, it was perfectly re-sellable at a lesser price (this is what I assume a record store would do). On the other hand, the buyer might expect you to pay for both the initial postage and the return postage and so now you're losing extra money. It really is a nightmare but I'm sure your local record store owner has a few nightmare stories of his own as well.
     
  16. MielR

    MielR THIS SPACE FOR RENT

    Location:
    Georgia, USA
    No, eBay doesn't care, but it may discourage some buyers from making a fuss if you make it clear that they'll be in for a fight if they want to return it.
     
  17. eddiel

    eddiel Senior Member

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I often see eBay sellers with "no returns" even for used items. There's a lot of them on there. eBay usually gives a message like "This seller does not accept returns but you may be covered by eBays 30 day guarantee". That always makes me laugh as it basically means "The seller says they won't accept returns but don't worry, we'll force them to" :)
     
    JasonA, R. Totale, MielR and 2 others like this.
  18. sunking101

    sunking101 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Yorkshire, England
    Yeah, ignore the seller's terms lol.
     
  19. Rodneywhite5

    Rodneywhite5 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Iowa

    That's why it's always best to buy on eBay over discogs, less hassles for the buyer to jump through if/when things go south.

    As a seller, I've been burned twice on sealed items. One was a 40+ year old Aretha Franklin greatest hits, the second a 40+ year old Count Basie album. Arethas buyer said the album was all scuffed up upon opening, closer to VG than anything. Bouncing around in the inner sleeve over the past 4 decades seems plausible. The Basie buyer said it was a bootlegged album inside. Sure enough, upon opening it was not a legitimate pressing. It was unopened when I shipped it, I can't say that it was definitively NOT a bootleg. Now were both buyers honest and legitimate, and they didn't do a switchero, who's to say. But given the ebay return policy, it's 100% futile to fight it. As the seller, you are going to lose, every time. But that is the risk, and you can say NO Returns on opened items, and I do as well, but the reality is anyone can return anything on eBay. And honestly it's best that way. Are there some crappy, dishonest buyers out there looking to take advantage? Definitely. Are there crappy sellers who over grade and mislead to make a few extra bucks? Definitely. And there are likely far more crap sellers than crap buyers. As a full time seller and only a rare on occasion, sometimes buyer, I'd still prefer the eBay money back policy.

    Have an issue, create a claim, get a prepaid label, ship it back. Done and done.

    Discogs? Have a claim? Deal with a grouchy seller, have them tell you to ship it back on your dime, Deal with a PayPal dispute and eventually get your shipping reimbursed (dear God, don't have it happen on an international purchase that exceeds $30. Don't forget to insure that it has tracking from point A to B).

    They both end up with the same final, disappointed, biter result. At least eBays involves less stress and scar tissue.
     
  20. kwadguy

    kwadguy Senior Member

    Location:
    Cambridge, MA
    In theory, yes, you should be able to stipulate that it's factory sealed, sold as-is, and buyer takes all risk once it's opened.

    In practice, eBay and PayPal won't have your back and you're stuck taking it back. Oh, and it won't matter if you listed it "as is" unless you also said something like "records are assumed damaged and unplayable." And even then you might lose a case.

    Yes, it sucks.

    (Of course, the seller is always responsible if the item is not as advertised, i.e. if it is not factory sealed [rewrap] and it was described as factory sealed. Or if there are any obvious defects that can be ascertained without opening the album that weren't noted. )
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2022
    Pali Gap likes this.
  21. R. Totale

    R. Totale The Voice of Reason

    ueah, ignore the seller's terms lol.



    That's what I do. The site's terms will always prevail. All your do if you put stuff like that in the listing is show that you are a novice and//or troublesome seller and I should probably look elsewhere
     
    sunking101 likes this.
  22. Pali Gap

    Pali Gap 'Why did you throw the Jack of Hearts awayy?'

    Location:
    NJ
    Yes.
     
    sunking101 likes this.
  23. Pali Gap

    Pali Gap 'Why did you throw the Jack of Hearts awayy?'

    Location:
    NJ
    No, sellers put 'stuff like that' in the listing as an attempt to protect themselves against dishonest buyers who buy things without accepting any risk, knowing Paypal will always have their back.
     
    TonyCzar likes this.
  24. Pizza

    Pizza With extra pepperoni

    Location:
    USA
    This is why I’ll never sell stuff. I realize this would be the exception rather than the norm but when it happens it would be frustrating.

    I will say that I have bought stuff that was listed as “still sealed” that clearly was repackaged. And if it was labeled new, I will go for a refund or a major discount on the price. Amazon has always helped me in these situations.

    I realize this isn’t what you did. I would feel the risk should fall on the buyer if it is legitimately unopened and being sold as a collectible in that state. You’re buying an unopened record. That’s obviously not the case, so I wouldn’t waste my time selling stuff.
     

Share This Page

molar-endocrine