Seven or Se7en?

What do you think the title of David Fincher’s 1995 movie is?

I firmly believe the title is Seven, and consider “Se7en” to be a designed — a purely visual, stylized — version of that name. As far as I know, the original marketing supports this claim, down to the credits at the bottom of the poster, which include the title, “SEVEN,” among the cast and crew. (Apart from this evidence, it’s also how I remember it when it came out.)

Nowadays, canonical listings like IMDB show the title as Se7en. I think this is revisionist, but I’m sure some people will disagree with me!

I also wonder if David Fincher or anyone else directly involved with the production has ever weighed in on this question. I am open to persuasion if it’s out there.

 

I would go with Se7en because that's how the title sequence of the movie itself presents the title. Title appears at 0:24 in the video below.

 

Yes, indeed — but I would counter (like I said) that it’s a design stylization. There’s a long history of movie titles using alternate glyphs for display titles, e.g. swapping in a lowercase letter for uppercase, vice versa, a backwards 3 for E, and so on.

My guess (purely a guess) is that the designer of Seven’s titles thought it looked cool, and that it was a design decision, but not meant to represent the movie’s final name. And I’d expect the production documents all to say “Seven,” not “Se7en.”

(And nothing personal. I created this thread so we could all argue about it! )

 

Se7en I guess is just a poster way of writing Seven which is the title, otherwise shouldn't we be calling it "Sesevenen"? On Apple TV the image says Se7en but the title says Seven.

 

Our local CBS affiliate was using “Se7en” long before the movie. And a station in an adjacent market used “ei8ht” (it looks better if you lower the 8 so that it sits lower than the other letters).

 

As Cameron Crowe's mother would say (as portraid in Almost Famous) "se7en is not a word in English, it's either seven or 7".

 

You have to first decide what makes official the name. Is it the name that appears in the title credits? Is it the name used by the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences for that work? Is it the name that is used on the copyright registration with the government (leave it to the lawyers)?

Without that, you will just filter anything that reinforces your beliefs as evidence, and dismiss anything that does not because it's contrary to your belief. That is the logical fallacy of petitio principii, or begging the question. Begging the question is like arguing that smoking kills, because cigarettes are deadly. In this case, you are arguing that "Se7en" in the title sequence is merely a stylization, because the name of the movie is "Seven".

I presented as evidence the movie title in the movie's own title sequence. I don't know how a movie poster (marketing) or production documents (before the movie was completed) could trump that. When people try to figure out how to pronounce someone's name, they often go with how that person pronounces their own name when they introduce themself. You gotta find something better than what the movie itself announces itself as its own title in the movie itself!

You should also think about whether movie titles are as black-or-white as your question assumes. For example, with an individual, you might look to their birth certificate or passport for the correct name. But movies titles can and do change, or they can have multiple names that are all correct. For example, Star Wars was added the subtitle "Episode IV: A New Hope" upon its re-release, when Episode V (The Empire Strikes Back) was being developed. Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone was released outside the United States as Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone (and the book on which it is based has Philosopher, not Sorcerer, in its title).

 

If they had only called the movie : ' What's In The Box ? ' we wouldn't be having this discussion.

 

I agree, it should depend on some “official” reference, which we don’t yet have. Meanwhile, we can just speculate from the available evidence. I wouldn’t say I’m dismissing anything that’s contrary to my beliefs as much as I’ve arrived at my own conclusion based on the available evidence — which I happily concede is not objectively conclusive. I do think it’s factually true that the movie was consistently referred to as “Seven” in publicity and reviews when it was released, and was only referred to as “Se7en” later.

For me, the fact that it appears as “SEVEN” in the plain text at the bottom of the movie poster is persuasive. And sure, the fact that it appears as “SE7EN” in the title sequence is significant and, frankly, the reason there’s disagreement.

For what it’s worth, there is a production draft of the screenplay online with the title “SEVEN”. I can’t vouch for its authenticity. (I also have a friend who worked on the movie, and I suppose I could ask him if he has any records that would shed light on the question.)

Anyhow, for now I do think it’s a squishy question on which (at least for now) reasonable people can have differing opinions, which is why I started the thread!

 

Se7en
Se7en (1995) - IMDb

 

Se7en.

'Cos it's more fun. Otherwise the movie's not much fun at all. A fine piece of hokum nonetheless though.

 

Agreed! Se7en is the way to go!

 

@Oatsdad

 

I'd need to see it written in Klingon to decide...

 

Coil's 're-mix'of "Closer", in those opening credits, made me appreciate Mr. Reznor!
When wifey and I first heard NIN, we thought, "What a rip-off! Like Phil Collins singing over Ministry's "Twitch".
Plus, he signed Meat Beat Manifesto to his Nothing label!

 

I agree with the OP that the movie is properly called Seven and that Se7en is a stylistic affectation for the titles and promo material. It might be more prevalent now in citations because it facilitates web searches.

 

Indeed. I mean, when you discuss the movie, how do you pronounce it? The movie’s not called “Se-seven-en”.

 

It's kinda cool to say, "Se-seven-en"!

 

“It's a beautiful name for a boy or a girl - especially a girl, or a boy,” Costanza says. “It's Mickey Mantle's number. So, not only is it an all-around beautiful name, it is also a living tribute.”

 

Like that Phil Collins song, “Se, se, seven-en!”

 

Don't even get me started on Thirthirteenen Ghosts and Fantfourstic...

 

To tell you the truth, I forget! And I was involved with the production. But I'm pretty sure we were just calling it "Seven." And then later on I said to myself "What's up with Se7en"?" when I saw it around. I think that's my memory. I have the original script somewhere. In fact I think I posted pages of it here! Let me ask someone.

 

It must have been “se7en” all along. My friend oversaw the poster proofs and said it was “se7en” on the proofs.