Should I be offended? (Amp repairs) *

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by I333I, Jun 12, 2019.

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  1. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I’m not saying I can’t understand who would use something like that. I’m just saying my life has involved virtually zero need for lawyers (so far...), and it’s hard for me to imagine using lawyers often enough to warrant $50 a month (that’s record money!).
     
    JNTEX and Gumboo like this.
  2. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    To the OP: I believe I have read every post, but may have missed it.

    Can you reproduce the noise at a friends house? I’m not saying that you should lug all your gear, but maybe a friend would let you hook it into their system.

    What I am saying, maybe Rogue actually cannot reproduce the noise.
     
    JNTEX likes this.
  3. Slippers-on

    Slippers-on Forum Resident

    Location:
    St.Louis Mo.
  4. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    Oh I get what your saying. I never paid for it myself. I don’t even remember the monthly amount. For any documents like rental contracts, I use Legal Zoom. A real Lawyer for everything else
     
  5. h46e55x

    h46e55x What if they believe you?

    Location:
    Gitmo Nation West
    The only problem I have with this whole story is the 1.5 year timeline. How many times did you actually correspond with them? How does a static problem that will not go away create a 1.5 year conversation? \

    I feel for your dilemma, but you had ample time to address the problem under warranty. Pony up the less than $60 bucks to get your amp back. If it is still a problem request an exchange or credit.

    Despite how we all feel about getting dud equipment, you allowed the warranty to expire, unless you can demonstrate the time line was defined by their trouble shooting process (try this and let it burn in for 3 months), you don't have a good case. Your arbitrator is simply going to ask if it didn't work, why didn't you send it back? When was your last correspondence before the warrant expired? And what was the substance that convinced you to not have the amp serviced? If Rogue did not somehow trick you into waiting out the warranty, how is this on them? Yes it would be great if they resolved the problem for you now at no charge. But something about this whole 18 month drama just doesn't make sense.

    My impression is you got a dud, called the manufacturer who wanted you to try multiple fixes, got sick of it, boxed it up and let it go cold. Then at a much later date you decided you wanted it working, but the warranty period was long over because the amp sat unused for over a year. Close? Or a million miles off?
     
  6. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    ???
     
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  7. Old Zorki II

    Old Zorki II Storm Watcher

    Location:
    near Tampa, FL
    It is all true, but still.
    Manufactures do not build their reputation by following small print, but going a little beyond.
    I have nothing but praise for Rogue gear I had (and have now) and love it - and yet this story a little bothersome, at least in topic starter explanations.
     
    JNTEX likes this.
  8. StimpyWan

    StimpyWan Forum Resident

    The OP mentioned that the amp malfunctioned at several different locations. So, it seems he's done his part. Myself, I wish he would post the video of the noisy amp. I'd love to hear the issue.
     
    DaleClark, JNTEX and Strat-Mangler like this.
  9. Dream On

    Dream On Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    You can probably get more for a piece that works 100% as it should (even after paying to repair it) than you would selling a clearly defective product. Same as how people spend money restoring vintage things and then selling them.

    After an experience like this one, I would probably be sour on the amp, have little confidence in it's reliability, and would just want to sell it and just get something else. There are lots of amps to choose from.

    But has Rogue even repaired anything? Doesn't sound like they have. So he'll be out return shipping and still have a product that doesn't function. I'd probably take it to a local tech (who comes highly recommended) and see if he can fix the issue. Then sell from there.

    I agree with h46e55x...the 1.5 years is really what is hurting the OP. It happens though. I agree with those who thing Rogue should be more helpful regardless. Some companies do bend over backwards but it seems that isn't happening here, which will likely only hurt them in the long-run.

    Wow, that's insane. This is why I've always been hesitant to buy from a one-man operation (which I assume Odyssey is). You hear crazy stories sometimes.
     
    Big Blue likes this.
  10. Helom

    Helom Forum member

    Location:
    U.S.
    Yeah, learned that lesson the hard way, though I should've cancelled the order after the first BS excuse for why the build was taking so long. The mistake cost me $400, but he was able to recoup his expenses quickly through AC.
    Oh well, his time is far more valuable than mine so who am I to complain.
     
  11. fogalu

    fogalu There is only one Beethoven

    Location:
    Killarney, Ireland
    Exactly. I thought "Should I be Offended?" was an excellent thread title. (This was before the prosaic "Amp Repairs" was added.)
    Granted it was a bit vague but it's a better attention-grabber than something like "My G467/VB is out of phase on my Generic Driver" or even "Amp Repairs."
    All it took out of our busy lives was one mouse click.
     
  12. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    I’ve already stated my constant conversations with the employee. There was constant troubleshooting suggestions and the fact that the static was intermittent made the issue more complex.
    I can easily document that the issues began within the first year of purchase as I have the ridiculously long email thread.
    I don’t really care if my situation “makes sense” to you. I was told that I would have to send the amp back to them and I commented that I didn’t want to incur costs because the amp was faulty. I don’t have $200 to ship out an amp. I was disappointed that they didn’t send a shipping slip, like most companies that I have worked with, and figured that the issues would’ve been dealt with like a high end stereo equipment company should.
     
  13. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    My request has been completely ignored.
    I’ll give them my CC number to get it shipped, then will document the issue and the situation in greater detail and in other forums if the issue still remains.
     
    Strat-Mangler likes this.
  14. Fruff76

    Fruff76 L100 Classic - Fan Club President

    I had a McIntosh preamp act up once. The volume would go up on its own, like a ghost. I sent it in and they couldn’t diagnose it. I was able to take a video of it and I sent it to them. Eventually it was repaired, and luckily the dealer was the one sending it back and forth. I can see how it could drag on if they can’t figure it out.
     
  15. Phil Thien

    Phil Thien Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Now that is very interesting!
     
  16. Strat-Mangler

    Strat-Mangler Personal Survival Daily Record-Breaker

    Location:
    Toronto
    Strange and rather misguided that your request has been ignored. They should know you're not going to quietly go away. IMHO, they're shooting themselves in the foot by allowing this to continue when they so easily could resolve it.

    2 dead power tubes, charging shipping back for a problem that was supposed to have been addressed previously, email to the owner simply forwarded to tech support, request for a replacement amp devoid of any issues completely ignored. No apologies, compromises, no follow-up phone call, etc. Changing a volume pot is takes next to no time for a tech to do. A local tech could've done that and it wouldn't have cost as much as shipping the whole amp to replace that cheap part.

    I thought I might give their products a shot at some point but after seeing the way they treat their customers, I'd be doing myself a favor by crossing them off my list. Not an anecdote that paints a good picture of RA, that's for sure.
     
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  17. Fruff76

    Fruff76 L100 Classic - Fan Club President

    Yeah, it went back multiple times.
     
  18. Old Zorki II

    Old Zorki II Storm Watcher

    Location:
    near Tampa, FL
    While I believe you may be missing in really great sounding gear, your position is well understood and I wish company owners read it.
     
  19. Fruff76

    Fruff76 L100 Classic - Fan Club President

    Buying boutique audio gear nowadays is like buying a car. You keep the one you buy and if there’s issues from the get go, it’s a warranty fix. I bet if you bought cheap stereo gear from Amazon, you’d get a replacement.

    That’s why I was a little frustrated when I bought the Rogue. Instead of just replacing the unit, since I just spent $$ on the thing, I had to wait weeks for it to go back, be diagnosed, repaired etc. that sucks when you’ve been saving for something, buy it, only to see it shipped off with no real knowledge of when it’s coming back. The McIntosh was used, from a McIntosh dealer, so that was a different situation.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
    I333I, Helom and Old Zorki II like this.
  20. Phil Thien

    Phil Thien Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Well that, and the very real possibility that the Mac was possessed by the previous owner. So the fix likely involved a psychic.

    Did they say what the actual fix is? Not to derail this thread. OTOH, the longer it stays alive and reminds people of the poor service from Rogue, probably the better.

    I sure hope is amp is perfect when it returns.
     
  21. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    I considered Odyssey a few years back. However, so many threads on the lead time, months to wait on shipping, I just looked elsewhere.
     
    timind likes this.
  22. Helom

    Helom Forum member

    Location:
    U.S.
    Good call. Based on the lack of attention to build quality I experienced, I can't imagine any of his stuff is really that great a value. The parts are pricey but implementation was amateur level IMO.

    Rogue's stuff can look a little shade-tree like as well, however, they at least know how to choose correct fastener sizes that are actually long enough to reach into both adjoining parts. :eek:
     
  23. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    I see lots of issues with and in this thread.

    I have owned Rogue products since 2011. I have a pair of their M-150 monoblock's that I had Rogue upgrade from M-150's that I bought used on eBay. I had a Cronus Magnum I and a Stereo 90 power amp.

    Yes, they are not made in China and that is a BIG selling point to me, with my equipment, as specially when it comes to tubes. But, even then I own many Emotiva products for that same reason. And Cary Audio and Zu and Decware and others for that same exact reason.

    If I want to speak to Rogue, I pick up the telephone. If I want to send in a product for repair, I call them and get an authorization and then I send it directly to them.

    It is important to have a thread title that is clear and concise and not click bait.

    Threads and posts in this forum are indexed by Google and other search engines.

    This is important because someone looking for some specific information out on the Internet can connect with that information, if the thread title is properly made so that it indicates as clearly as possible what the thread content is.

    This is also as a courtesy to other forum members.

    Anytime you see an "*" in the title, that means that a Gort has had to intervene to correct the title so that it makes sense descriptively.

    There are only so many Gorts and many more threads and posts and other issues that the Gorts must address.

    The better that member's comply with forum policy, the smoother the forum will operate. And the more effective tool the forum becomes for communication and a source for information.

    I wouldn't cross Rogue Audio off of your list based on any comments that have been made in this thread.

    First off you need to understand, that Rogue builds it's products to fill orders and not to fill shelves. If you have an issue, they will attempt to trouble shoot it with you over the phone or by email.

    If you need to send your amp to them, that is the way that it is. If that does not work for you, you are in the wrong hobby.

    Sorry for your frustration but this is higher end custom audio and it all goes with the game. When you have high end custom car or anything else, these same rules still apply.

    Anyone who has a tube amplifier as their primary amplifier needs to absolutely have a back up for it, be it another tube or a SS amplifier.

    Tubes are not only more complicated from an operational standpoint but they also represent technology that has been largely abandoned by the industry a full half century ago.

    Today good luck having something that is SS that is even a decade (or less) older.

    If it was fifty years ago, there would be many sources for tubes plus plenty of qualified technicians and repair shops in every little town.

    Unfortunately, this is not fifty years ago and when we make a choice to own tube products this unfortunately is what all of us must go through, if we want to participate in this hobby.

    The fortunate part is that you have a manufacture that is only as far away as Pennsylvania and we have UPS and FedEx locations pretty much everywhere.

    When you opt to go with quality tube amplifier's from any source, that means having a lot of transformer iron. The more iron the better the gear (all other things being equal). That is just the way things are with tube amps.

    I am not just staying this for your benefit, I am saying this for the benefit of anyone who might be reading through this thread and considering tube amplification.

    Tubes in the 21st century are not easy-peasy and they are never going to be.

    Those who go the tube route and have gone the tube route for a while already know that there WILL always be issues. You can either accept this and suck it up, or go SS, that are the choices that are presented to you.

    If shipping is an issue, best then to stick with class "D" amps, Emotive have some new Class "D" monoblock's, the PA1's that are 140-Watts into 8-Ohms, are 8 1/2" wide, cost $300-each, and weigh only 3-lbs. each. They come with a five year warranty.

    I have one of their 250-Watt class A/B amps and it out of warranty and weighs 72-lbs. if I have to ship it.

    All of these things are valid points to consider in this hobby and most of us have gone through these issues many times over.
     
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  24. h46e55x

    h46e55x What if they believe you?

    Location:
    Gitmo Nation West
    I don't dispute that you reported the issue in the long long ago. The question is, why did the decision to send the amp in take 1.5 years. Where you in contact with the company on a regular basis, or did the issue go cold for an extended period of time? It matters. I get that you don't really care if it "makes sense" to me, and I don't care that you don't care. Your story sounds incomplete and as the discussion became about a public campaign to force a company to give you what you want or face the wrath of your public shaming, you should care about how you are perceived.
     
  25. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    You seem to be the only only one confused about the situation. If you want to take the time to read the thread, you will have all of the information that you need.
     
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