Sinatra / Reprise Sound Quality and General Discussion: "...Great Songs from Great Britain" (1962)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by AaronW, Aug 31, 2007.

Page 6 of 14
  1. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    paulmock, Mar 27, 2017
    #126
    kennyluc1, rangerjohn, MLutthans and 1 other person like this.
  2. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    How about some pics from the Great Songs from Great Britain sessions?

    First up, two photos that, when viewed together, give a decent idea as to the layout of the studio.
    Pic one - Here's a shot posted on the Daily Mail's site recently, looking toward one end of the studio at Bayswater:
    SinatraCTS_Studios_in_London_in_1962_recording_the_album_Great_Songs-a-246_1442594904108.jpg

    Pic two - looking the other way, from a John Barry film score session for a Bond film, You Only Live Twice:
    YOLT.JPG
    From this site:
    <<The primary music studio was housed in a converted banqueting hall previously owned by the Whiteley's Gentleman's Dining Club. With an ornate moulded ceiling, the venue had also doubled as a parade room to show off the latest fashions from Europe. The internal dimensions of this studio were 40 feet across, 85 feet deep and 26 feet high. The room had a natural reverberation of 0.8 seconds and seated about 65 musicians.>>

    More shots from the Sinatra sessions:
    SinatraCTS13408697_1690321607851769_329861419_n.jpg
    Time for a tea break:
    SinatraCTS1a51a0f490878d9127b7c0dcd8c6bd13SHTV.jpg
     
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #127
    MMM, Pieter Kozak and paulmock like this.
  3. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il
    That may be Jack Daniel's that they're drinking, which was very hard to get in the UK back then. The producer presented FS with a bottle at the first session. "You did your homework!" FS supposedly said.
     
    rangerjohn, Mar 27, 2017
    #128
    MMM, Pieter Kozak and MLutthans like this.
  4. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Notice in the last pic in Bayswater, they had the audacity to use actual glasses from which to drink the Daniels. No Capitol paper cups to disguise the contents over there. No shame, I tell ya!:shake:
     
    paulmock, Mar 27, 2017
    #129
    CBackley, rangerjohn, MMM and 2 others like this.
  5. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Neumann M49 microphone on Sinatra, by the way; same mic as many a Tony Bennett recording for Columbia in the 1960s. (CBS-owned studios seemed to have a quite an inventory of M49s.) Lots of techie stuff here: Neumann M 49 | RecordingHacks.com .
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #130
    MMM, rangerjohn and paulmock like this.
  6. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    I think if his voice had been in better shape, we might have heard the great qualities that techies have talked about over the years re: those mikes.
     
    paulmock, Mar 27, 2017
    #131
    MLutthans likes this.
  7. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Now THIS ONE is totally and completely off-the-wall...but just imagine if Mr. S had gone back to these recordings circa 1966-67 and decided to redo his vocals over these charts. Hmmmmmmm......
     
    paulmock, Mar 27, 2017
    #132
    rangerjohn likes this.
  8. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Again quoting this site:
    <<The 12 input grey Telefunken console had, initially, one speaker placed above it until stereo came in and two large speakers adorned the wall. The console had three sets of EQ on rotary potentiometers. Outputs could be grouped to left, centre, right or "spare". >>

    Probably something quite similar to this Telefunken mixing console:
    TelefunkenConsole.jpg
    Or this one, that is in pieces, sadly:
    Telefunken incomplete.jpg
    Hi, mid, low EQ:
    TelefunkenIncomplete2EQDetail.jpg
    Another similar-vintage Telefunken possibility:
    KERWAX-00815KLANGFILM SIEMENS KLR060TelefunkenDetail.jpg
     
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #133
    Pieter Kozak and kennyluc1 like this.
  9. kennyluc1

    kennyluc1 Frank Sinatra collector

    Location:
    Peekskill, N.y. 10566
    Fantastic !!!
     
    kennyluc1, Mar 27, 2017
    #134
    MLutthans likes this.
  10. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Can anybody shed any light on the availability of this album through the years in the UK? Was it in print only for a short time in the 1960s? I ask because in the USA, the vast majority of Sinatra titles on Reprise were more-or-less "permanently in print" throughout the LP era. Was that the case with this title in the UK? (I don't think so, but would like to know.)
     
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #135
  11. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Regarding this Italian stereo release:
    [​IMG]
    I think there is some incorrect information floating around on the interwebs. Discogs lists this as a 1965 release. I've also found a 1970 reference. Kudos to the SFF, where I think the more-or-less correct info is provided:
    Screen shot 2017-03-27 at 8.30.17 PM.png
     
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #136
    Bob F and rangerjohn like this.
  12. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    ^^^^^I think that is the final time the UK edits were issued (for the album as a whole).
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
    MLutthans, Mar 27, 2017
    #137
  13. kennyluc1

    kennyluc1 Frank Sinatra collector

    Location:
    Peekskill, N.y. 10566
    I HAVE THAT LP
    THIS RECORD ACTUALLY CAME OUT IN THE 70'S BUT THE LABEL HAS THE 1965 DATE ON IT
     
    kennyluc1, Mar 28, 2017
    #138
    rangerjohn and MLutthans like this.
  14. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    I distinctly remember buying that as a "new" reissue from Gary Doctor in Buffalo in 1978 or 1979. It may have been released in '76 or '77 but the collectors/sellers here in the US (at least the two big guns in NY state) did not offer it until 2 or 3 years later. I no longer have my copy of it as it is now in the safekeeping of @DLant.

    If that was an actual 1965 release, then the cover is definitely a reissue as that is a shot from 1974 "Ol' Blue Eyes is Back".
     
    paulmock, Mar 28, 2017
    #139
    MLutthans and DLant like this.
  15. DLant

    DLant The Upstate Gort Staff

    Location:
    Albany, NY
    It certainly is kept safe with me. I should pull it out and spin it this weekend. Thanks again for sending it along!
     
    DLant, Mar 28, 2017
    #140
    paulmock likes this.
  16. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    FWIW, I have zero doubt that it's NOT from 1965, for the reasons that are stated over at SFF, already posted:
    [​IMG]

    I suspect that the ℗1965 date on the label may relate to a discussion at the SFF regarding the mono and stereo UK release dates:
    ....and then there are these comments related to the ℗1965 date (click [....] for link to SFF):
    From what I've found online (not always 100% reliable), the mid-70s Italian "Sinatra in London" LP contains all of the original UK edits, but (as born out by photographs and by posts here) bears a ℗1965 designation on the label. I have to wonder if perhaps it was the intent to ship WEA Italiana the re-edited (℗1965?) German/Holland/(later)Japanese tapes (or dubs thereof) for LP cutting, but the original 1962 tapes (or dubs thereof) were shipped accidentally.
    :shrug:
    As I pointed out before, *if* the yada yada on the internet is correct, that mid-70s "Sinatra in London" Italian release is the last time the UK edits were issued. Based on notes from Bernard Vogel, the only releases of the 1962 UK edits were:
    •1962 UK originals
    •1965(?) Holland release
    •c. 1976 Italy "Sinatra in London" release
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
    MLutthans, Mar 28, 2017
    #141
    rangerjohn and paulmock like this.
  17. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Speaking of Vogel...whatever happened to his International Main Event website? Cannot find it online anywhere. Seems like the link expired or something.
     
    paulmock, Mar 28, 2017
    #142
  18. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    By the way, I've found no evidence on my own to indicate a later initial stereo release date in the UK (compared to the initial mono release date). It *appears* that it was issued in mono and stereo simultaneously, but I don't know for sure. Quoted comments above by our own fantastic @Ronald Sarbo indicate there was a delay of some sort in the stereo release.
     
    MLutthans, Mar 28, 2017
    #143
  19. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    My error...should be 1973.
     
    paulmock, Mar 28, 2017
    #144
  20. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    The exact release date in the UK for the original album (Reprise R-1006) was Monday, October 22, 1962. (The BBC program with spoken intros by Sinatra was broadcast the previous Sunday evening.) The release was reported in the International News section of that week's issue of Billboard (Oct. 27, 1962; page 31):
    From the Sinatra: London box set, I've put together a playlist for the album with the BBC bonus introductions interspersed:


    And this is the session material from the box set:


    It's not clear to me that there was a delay before release of the stereo version (R9-1006). Pye did not print new album cover slicks for the stereo issue. Instead, they affixed small blue "Stereo" stickers to the front and back covers; the one on the back included "R9" to cover over the original printed mono "R" catalogue number prefix:

    [​IMG]​
     
    Bob F, Mar 28, 2017
    #145
    AaronW and MLutthans like this.
  21. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    Frank Sinatra - The Main Event
     
    Bob F, Mar 28, 2017
    #146
    paulmock likes this.
  22. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    One more small release date detail for OCD sufferers: Although Great Songs from Great Britain (R/R9-1006) was planned to be Sinatra's sixth LP release for Reprise, it actually followed All Alone (R/R9-1007) by two weeks. The latter album was released in the US, October 8, 1962. Therefore, the catalog numbers should not be used for a strict chronological sequence listing.
     
    Bob F, Mar 28, 2017
    #147
    CBackley, bozburn, paulmock and 1 other person like this.
  23. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Location:
    Massachusetts USA
    The Sinatra: London box set contains a great 5″ × 14″ removable foldout photo which shows a wide-angle view of the studio. You can see it briefly at 1:03 in the unboxing video:

     
    Bob F, Mar 28, 2017
    #148
  24. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA, Salina, KS, Los Angeles, CA
    Oh, cool! My copy should be here in a couple of days. (I broke down and bought the London box, the Italian "Sinatra in London" LP, and the German Great Songs from Great Britain LP for the sake of this comparison. My pocketbook is not happy about that, but I had questions for which I was not finding answers where comparisons were concerned.)
     
    MLutthans, Mar 28, 2017
    #149
    CBackley, bferr1, paulmock and 1 other person like this.
  25. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    paulmock, Mar 28, 2017
    #150
    Bob F likes this.
Page 6 of 14

Share This Page

molar-endocrine