Sinatra's "Popping P's": Why aren't they corrected or softened?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by wave, Oct 31, 2010.

  1. Doug Sclar

    Doug Sclar Forum Legend

    Location:
    The OC
    IMO, that was one of the best mics of all time. I had a client who bought got one in the late 70s without a power supply. Everybody said it was worthless without the original supply, but I built a solid state supply for it and it sounded absolutely amazing, perhaps better than with the soft tube supply it originally came with.

    Unfortunatley he stuck it in the bell of a trombone and blew the diaphraghm. :shake: At that time there was no place we could find to get a new one or have that one repaired, so he never used the mic again. Not sure what actually happened to it, but what a mic it was.

    I'm back in touch with this old friend now, so I should ask him about this mic next time we talk.

    As for the popping, most of us now have the means to remove these types of things on a one by one basis if we really want to, so I'd always prefer them to be there. The option is for the mastering team to shave the lows, which could affect more than just the pops. The fact that they are there is evidence that the overall frequency response is probably not compromised.
     
  2. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    I don't believe in taming or eliminating the "P" pops into the mic. It pissed me off when they did it on the the stereo "Help" on the Beatles remasters too.
     
  3. Tone

    Tone Senior Member

    Sinatra and a Neumann U47.

    A 'duet' that's hard to beat.
     

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  4. yasujiro

    yasujiro Senior Member

    Location:
    tokyo
    Great photo!
    It's a Telefunken in USA BTW.
     
  5. Tone

    Tone Senior Member

    :righton::wave:
     
  6. yasujiro

    yasujiro Senior Member

    Location:
    tokyo
    The first US buyer of U47 was Stephen F. Temmer of Gotham Audio, who was followed by RVG and Les Paul.
     
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  7. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    ....and I'm pretty sure it's actually a U48, not a U47.

    Matt
     
  8. Tone

    Tone Senior Member

    You may be right..... (box in the background of the photo says U48) ...... Great discussion on the subject here...... http://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/569350-sinatras-60-year-old-u47-still-use.html


    "as far as I know, Capitol "only" owns a number of U48. Perhaps they are sometimes being referred to as 47's because that number is more popular. Technically, the behaviour of both mics in cardioid pattern is almost identical, virtually interchangeable. So it does not matter much, anyway.

    When I was at Capitol (and I spent some time inside their mic locker), I have only seen U48s...

    Here is one of the pics I took in there. The stickers on the shelf and on the mic boxes all read "U48", ranging from #1 to #6. I can't remember all of my conversation with the technical engineers taking care of the mic collection, as this was almost two years ago. But I am pretty sure, they would have told me if there would have been a "special U47".



    .
     

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  9. stevemoss

    stevemoss Forum Resident

  10. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Glass half empty or half full? One could argue that a U48 is a "U47 minus," meaning that it can't switch to omni! :)

    They are essentially the same mic, with one being cardioid/omni and one being cardioid/figure-8.

    Matt
     
  11. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I don't know the inner details of the mics, but it's kind of odd that there wasn't a model that could switch between all 3 patterns; the M49 with that capability predated the U48.

    Larger pic. Looks like U47 to me on the plate, but a bit too small to tell with certainty. The model number should be on top with the serial number below.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    I've exchanged some pretty wordy e-mails and PMs with fellow forum members on the U47/U48 debate, and haven't been able to come up with a definite answer, although it appears as though any currently-available paperwork on the Capitol inventory only shows U48s, and that the old shipping receipts that have surfaced indicate only U48s. Here's the rub, though, and it may be way off base, as I'm working off of memories from 20+ years ago:

    Back in the early '90s, a wonderful guy (who I'm sure some here know) named Juergen Wahl, who worked for Neumann for many, many years, showed me a list of the mics in the Capitol locker, but my memory is that it was not "just a list." Rather, it showed what their mic inventory was in 1956 when the Capitol Tower opened, then there was an update for 1966, 1976, and 1986, and my 20-years-plus memory is that there were U47s on the older lists, but maybe I've smoked too much hookah in the intervening years, and my brain cells have rotted. (In other words: I wouldn't swear to there being U47s on the old lists, but I think there were!) It does seem odd to me that in 1956, when "stereo" was almost a code-word for "spaced omnis," and when Capitol was recording Stokowski in stereo in September of 1956 at Goldwyn with 3 spaced U47s omnis (who owned those, then?), that they would not have U47s in their inventory.

    Matt
     
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  13. action pact

    action pact Music Omnivore

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  14. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    There's also the question of when the U48 became available. According to Wiki:

    I'm wondering if the U48 was even available for the first several years of Capitol's existence.

    Also, Matt, do you have any idea what the current mics look like? The one pictured in the GS thread has a satin cage, while many vintage shots I've seen show shiny cages. One post in that thread *claims* U48s only came with satin cages.
     
  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    ^^^^No, Lukpac, I'm sad to say I don't know. :-(

    Matt
     
  16. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    FWIW:
     

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  17. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Does the album come with a U47?
     
  18. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    :laugh: Now THAT would be a sought after LP in "still sealed" condition!

    Matt
     
  19. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Apparently it's neither a U47 or a U48, and ProAudioGuide.com is clearly a stickler for details (see caption):
     

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  20. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    U67? Clearly that's an M67.
     
  21. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

  22. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I think the <sarcasm> formatting got lost...
     
  23. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Ah....we don't do sarcasm in Seattle. We're a very dry people.
     
  24. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Obviously...from a very dry city.

    Homer: Oh, look at me! I'm making people happy! I'm the Magical Man from Happy-Land, in a gumdrop house on Lollipop Lane! Oh, by the way, I was being sarcastic.
     
  25. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Here's that shot from the Riddle LP again (recycled from a few posts up, basically, but a new scan from my LP cover):
    RiddleU47-.jpg
    See that faded red marking on there, right above "in Germany"? Looks like maybe "50" or "5D"? Notice similar marks in these photos:
    ColeCapitolMelroseU47.jpeg Frank SinatraCapitol1Striped Mic50.jpg CapitolU47UpClose.jpg
     
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