STAR WARS: "Rise of Skywalker" **SPOILERS**

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Vidiot, Dec 20, 2019.

  1. JAuz

    JAuz Forum Resident

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    US
    Yeah, after the Christmas '77 debacle and the "empty box" of toy figures, you'd have figured that they'd never be caught unprepared like that again. So maybe it was on purpose. Not having toys does go along with the low key vibe of The Mandalorian. I know I had low expectations for it going in and I really enjoyed it.
     
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  2. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    Yeah, the Secret History of Star Wars book I often cite is full of this stuff. I'll give you another one: they have spaceships that fly, but for some reason in Empire, they had to land giant walking tanks (Imperial Walkers) to laboriously walk many miles over rocks and snow in order to get to the rebel base. Is this logical at all? Probably not, but it sure sold a lot of toys. More than once, I asked Lucas, "hey, how come this is such-and-such?", and he would shrug and say, "eh, we kinda thought it looked cool." And that was that.

    Showrunner Jon Favreau asked Bob Iger to delay the toy "Baby Yoda," because if there had been even one whisper in the fall toy season, it would've killed the surprise. Iger agreed, saying he wanted to support their filmmakers' creative intent, so this was deliberate.

    Disney CEO Defends No Baby Yoda Toys For Christmas 2019
     
  3. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Thanks for the link. The next time I see someone ranting about how "bah! Disney is milking Star Wars! It's only about making toys now and not fine art like it was when George was in charge!" I'll show them this link about New Lucasfilm's restraint with "Baby Yoda" toys.
     
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  4. Solitaire1

    Solitaire1 Carpenters Fan

    Although it might seem a bit strange, in this instance I compare The Stormtroopers to The Borg in Star Trek. The Borg quickly become immune to any high-tech weaponry you can throw at them. However, what always takes a Borg out (and they never seem to adapt to): a low-tech physical weapon like a club. In the same way, it could be that despite their armor they could be vulnerable to a physical force weapon like a rock (hit the armor in the face plate with a rock and it shatters and renders the Stormtrooper blind and vulnerable, and then hit what's inside with another rock).
     
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  5. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    Naaaa, it's just a bunch of bullspit they made up.
     
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  6. Solitaire1

    Solitaire1 Carpenters Fan

    I was going by what I saw in the episodes/movies. Shoot a Borg with a high-tech weapon and the rest soon adapt and the weapon is rendered useless. A Borg gets hit with a blunt weapon, down it goes...every time and rest don't adapt.
     
  7. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    I'm only talking about Star Wars, which is the topic of this thread.
     
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  8. Nothing but Star Wars
    Give me the Star Wars
    Don’t let them end...
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2020
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  9. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    Nothing but Star Wars!

     
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  10. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Hey...how did you get that exclusive that exclusive video of the party at Bob Iger's house the night Disney bought Lucasfilm?


    ;)
     
  11. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    Hollywood, USA
    You know, I'm not sure they were celebrating: I think Lucas did it with great reluctance (plus he was just tired of dealing with the mess of the day-to-day company business), and I think it was a risk for Disney.

    People who weren't alive in the 1970s don't understand the massive paradigm shift of Star Wars and what a huge deal it was. It's not something that could have been predicted or easily explained, because George Lucas is not exactly a fun, upbeat guy who's got his finger on the touchstone of pop culture. He has said only in his wildest dreams would the movie make a modest profit, but absolutely nobody expected it to be the biggest film in the history of Fox, let alone one of the biggest hits in the history of Hollywoo.
     
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  12. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
    True enough. I remember posting just a little over four years ago in the Force Awakens thread prior to it's release (or just after) that I didn't know whether to congratulate Kathy Kennedy and JJ Abrams or give them my condolences.

    Aside from the fan insanity that has occurred online though,what Disney era Lucasfilm have pulled off is pretty extraordinary. In the six years since the start of development of TFA,we've gotten FIVE full length feature films that have when averaged together have made over a billion and some change each. Yes,TFA massively overperformed and SOLO massively underperformed,but the rest have all (or will) make 1 billion each when is all said and done. I know,there are some that will dismiss that and say Star Wars should be making more per film, but no one in their right mind can call 5 films over 4 years of release making a total gross of 5 billion out of the gate a disappointment or failure.

    To put that in perspective...it took Marvel Studios 20+films and 10 years to reach that average,and as of this past September according to this chart they still haven't cracked the billion dollar average gross at the box office.

    Marvel Cinematic Universe Franchise Box Office History - The Numbers

    Of course,that's not counting three animated series,a live action series,countless books,comics, video games etc. A lot of content and probably the most in any single period in Lucasfilm's history.

    Yeah there have been some misteps and will continue to be,but that's Hollywood. Given the company had to go pretty much from one man's vision driving it to what it is now with no training wheels is a gargantuan feat that easily could have collapsed into disaster. There have been some close calls and such,but overall, Star Wars and Lucasfilm's future is bright. Uncertain...but bright.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
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  13. The Hermit

    The Hermit Wavin' that magick glowstick since 1976

    It actually is... the fact I never want to see another new SW film or even hear the consecutive words 'Star' and 'Wars' in a single sentence for a long time to come is not only extraordinary but utterly unthinkable even a few short years ago...

    Hell, if they announced tomorrow a fully-remastered Blu-ray release of the OT theatrical versions, I'd have to think twice about even ordering it... that's how far the avaricious Mouse House has wrung that once-magic saga out like a damp rag for me.

    But hey... billions of dollars made... yay, that's what really matters, right :rolleyes:?

    P.S. I'm not having a pop at you, David, just so you know or took it as such...
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  14. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
    I was discussing Episode IX with someone yesterday at work and they made an interesting point I had not considered.


    In the same way the original Star Wars trilogy is really a stand alone followed by a duology,the sequels are a duology followed by a ( mostly ) stand alone movie.

    Yeah Episode IX has a few threads to resolve from VII and VIII,but honestly,the main conflict of the film (Palpatine and Empire 3.0)is introduced and resolved within the film,just as the main conflict of the original Star Wars (Grand Moff Tarkin and his ball of death).was resolved in that film. Darth Vader's survival is the lone thread at the time leading to a then potential sequel.

    Both Episodes V and VII introduced new threads,conflicts and characters that were resolved in VI and VIII. Both cases the felt like parts one and two of the same story.

    Episode IV is the prologue of the main saga . Episode IX acts as a coda of sorts.

    Episodes I-III is really the only trilogy that follows a classic trilogy three act structure.
     
  15. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
    I understand it wasn't a pop at me.

    And I also understand where you are coming from. While I'm not as completely turned off to Star Wars as you are right now, I actually am glad the main saga is done and we can take a few years break from Star Wars.

    I'm actually curious about the rumblings of what the "high republic" era might mean. I'm cautiously optimistic right now. I just hope whatever they do we get mostly new characters,new situations,new environments and a new dynamic. The whole rebels/empire thing has played out.

    But speaking purely from the business side of things ,which is all Disney cares about,this era has been a bumpy success.


    Time will tell how the Fandom fares at the end of the day.
     
  16. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
    One thing I will say @The Hermit, before the current movie and Disney Plus happened with access to the Mandalorian and the animated stuff I had previously overlooked and missed,I was almost in the same boat as you. My enthusiasm was dying for Star Wars. Not because I hated The Last Jedi. It was because the two year long temper tantrum from a lot of bitter, angry and immature manchildren really dampened my spirits.

    It was tiring to see,hear and read, and aside from this forum ,you couldn't escape it. The prequel whining and complaining was bad,but this was much worse, and even worse was the fact that both the left and the right decided to turn Star Wars as the latest battle in the never ending culture war,and that in of itself killed some of the magic for me. It was wearing me down honestly.

    Thankfully I enjoyed the Mandalorian,had fun with TROS and am enjoying going through the Clone Wars. So I've now got some of my enthusiasm back. It's still tempered from 2017 though.
     
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  17. Kevin j

    Kevin j The 5th 99

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  18. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
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  19. Brodnation

    Brodnation The Future Never Dies because Tomorrow Never Knows

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    Canada
    Chewie got his medal!
     
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  20. The Hermit

    The Hermit Wavin' that magick glowstick since 1976

    I hear ya loud and clear... but for me, I don't even care about any new SW content anymore - be it television or film - if I have to see the same old OT iconography and side-character alien races/droids recycled ad nauseum all over again (which I'm reliably informed the current series on Disney+ does), I'll be prone to Olympian displays of technicolor projectile vomiting!!!

    One thing about the prequels is how they (largely) forged their own design and iconography paths... the fact none of the designs in that trilogy hold a candle to Joe Johnston's brilliant and still-iconic design work on the OT is neither here nor there... the fact is George Lucas actually wanted the PT to stand on it's own terms... unlike the Disney films, which have been nothing short of slaves to the OT in their desire to instill that sense of nostalgia in the audience, and subsequently sacrificed their own identities in the process... to say nothing of the frankly ludicrous schedule Disney gave Lucasfilm for the production of the trilogy as whole.

    I'm tagging along with the family tonight to give TRoS - and by extension the franchise overall - one last whirl... if anyone's interested, I'll give my final thoughts tomorrow once I've slept on it... but what I do know is this is absolutely the last time I go see a new SW film in the cinema... maybe a little bittersweet, but truthfully, I'm just glad the damn thing is over... and that's not how SW used to make me feel; a sad indictment of how Iger has destroyed the legacy of the saga more than George ever could have or did.

    Alas, I really do wish George had held to his promise that Episode III was the final SW film... it would have ended on a really high note...
     
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  21. David Campbell

    David Campbell Forum Resident

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    Luray, Virginia
    Well George did...until he sold to Disney and decided to throw in three treatments that depending on who you ask were fleshed out stories or one page bullet points.

    The thing is ,as I've said before, regardless of who bought Lucasfilm or whomever took over the company upon George's retirement or death, more Star Wars movies were inevitable. While some fans may have maybe preferred that Disney just bought the property and then acted as stewards of the then existing lore and maybe limit new content to animation, Television and other media while leaving the films as they were,that was an unrealistic expectation. Star Wars may have begun as a close ended finite story from George's point of view,but once George was out of the picture that finite story would inevitably transition to an infinite one in some way. It was going to happen no matter what.

    Of course,there was always many possible courses to take to get there,which is another argument. I of course enjoyed most of the output on film since the series returned in 2015, but hindsight is 20/20 as they say and knowing what we know now as opposed to then, it would have been best either to start the new era either with this high republic stuff or did the sequel trilogy we saw set further apart from the OT and further limit or all together eliminate the presence of Han,Luke and Leia. However,it is what it is I guess. The sequels are what they are take or leave them,love em or hate em.

    I of course am interested in your thoughts on TROS. I'll brace myself for your review whenever you decide to give it! ;)
     
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  22. mpayan

    mpayan Forum Resident

    Some are saying that, in light of the sequels, retrospectively the prequels are now considered not as bad to them as they once thought.

    I decided to rewatch at least the one I remember as being pretty good. “Revenge Of The Sith”. I kind of forced myself to watch it, tried to keep an open mind and invite whatever good thoughts I had back when I first saw it at the theater.

    Yeah..uh no.

    It was really worse than I recall. From the opening barrage of ships and fighter planes and flying drilling mini satellites it was ridiculously overwrought with CGI. Nearly cartoonishly so. The interactions and reasoning behind conversations was nonsensical mishmash.

    The super hero abilities that R2-D2 exhibited were over the top. The droids and whatever those other wide shoulder robots were called were anything but menacing. What were their purpose exactly? They couldnt kill ****. They made Stormtroopers look like death machines.

    The relationship between the main characters was simply uncomfortable.

    The storyline was good. The execution, horrible.

    George just went nuts with throwing anything and everything into the movie. Hell The Transformers movies had less CGI. Worse than I recall and never to be revisited again.

    So no, the sequels did all the sudden make the prequels seem even a bit better to me.
     
  23. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    I'm not invested enough to hate or love Last Jedi. I thought it was OK, I thought it had some good moments, but it was also very uneven and a little weird. But it didn't kill me. I don't take these films personally: it's just a movie. It doesn't affect my day-to-day life.

    I liked Rise of Skywalker more, but then it was intended as a triumphant story where the bad guys are defeated by the good guys, and everything is all wrapped up. I'm not sure if I want to see any of the last few Star Wars films again -- to me, they don't have the staying power of the old movies. It was good to see them once or twice, but that's enough for me.
     
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  24. Grunge Master

    Grunge Master 8 Bit Enthusiast

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    Michigan
    I suppose the bottom line (for me, anyway) is, did these last three movies improve upon the previous six movies? Did this trilogy make the 'Skywalker Saga' any better? I think the answer is a resounding 'No'.
     
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  25. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

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    Eh, I think each subsequent Lucasfilm Star Wars project was less amazing than the one before it. Though I do think that Empire was the best of them all.
     

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