STAR WARS: "Rise of Skywalker" **SPOILERS**

If TROS is the worst movie ever, then I take it you've not seen that many movies.

 

I just don't like the new movies. Not for me.

 

yes i dont like it too.

 

It's not even the worst "Star Wars" movie!

 

Since I've been obsessing over inconsistencies across the movies, here's a glaring one. If anyone can come up with a viable explanation other than "Lucas was sloppy", I'd love to hear it!

At the end of "Sith", we see that Yoda and Chewie are good friends. While it's unclear if Chewie ever met other Jedi, he clearly must've known about the Force and its powers.

In "Star Wars", Han openly mocks the Force, and Chewie seems to agree with him.

Wouldn't you think Chewie would tell Han that the Force is da bomb, yo?

 

If you were like me, 13 in 1980, there were two burning questions that consumed your life: why do girls...I'm just kidding!

The two questions were was Darth Vader really Luke's father and who shot JR?

Dallas was HUGE and that consumed everyone but it was resolved after a summer rerun off season, but it seemed long anyways.

The Darth Luke question consumed Star Wars fans and took THREE YEARS to resolve. It was absolutely shocking and Mark Hammill's horrified reaction and resigned face as he drops off the gantry to oblivion, only to be saved. I'm 53 now and it still is a visceral scene, and his questioning and searching as the Falcon flies off just adds to the feeling I had of desperation watching it twice in one afternoon in a theater in 1980. Han frozen in that stuff, how was that ever going to come out well??

Funnily, as I joked above, by the time Jedi came about to settle things, I was 16 and went opening night, gasp!, with my girlfriend. I can proudly admit I wasn't embarrassed to cry as Luke "saves" Vader. I mean he sees his dad's face one time for one brief conversation. I still cry today every time.

And now back to Rise commentary, I honestly liked it despite feeling manipulated on a lot of points, and I did cry many times throughout. Heck, I did during all three sequels as Han, Luke, Leia all left us. But horses in space, jeez God no...(insert Vader nooooo!)

 

Yeah,the horses on the Star destroyer was goofy as hell,but Star Wars has always had goofy stuff ever since the beginning,so you gotta sorta shrug your shoulders and go with it all. I mean,Star Wars began life as George Lucas' homage to Flash Gordon and Buck Rogers campy Saturday matinee serials,that was itself full of silly ,campy preposterous things.

 

It is a Star Wars movie. Not the best of the sequels but enjoyable nevertheless.

 

This all reminds me of the 1981 film Looker by Michael Crichton starring Albert Finney, James Coburn, Susan Dey and Leigh Taylor Young!

 

We still can't do what was shown in that film almost 40 years ago.

 

Attack of the Clones holds that title for me! lol

 

I would've said "Clones" for quite a while, but it's grown on me.

I'd now pick "Phantom Menace" as the worst.

I like all 9, however. "TPM" is just the one that drags the most...

 

At the end of Phantom Menace, I was still interested in what would happen next. The Last Jedi utterly annihilated my interest in Finn, Rey, the Resistance, etc...so it's gotta be the worst, right?

 

To you? I guess.

To me? Nope.

I wasn't wild about "Last Jedi" when I saw it opening night, but I came to like/appreciate it much more with additional viewings.

I think the only real reason we'd be interested in what happens next in "TPM" is because we know what happens next.

It's not like there's any real suspense. Will Anakin go to the Dark Side? Gee, I wonder!

It's interesting to see aspects of the story - even if Lucas had to retcon like crazy to make it fit, and he did so poorly - but I can't say "TPM" left me eager to see where the story would go since I already knew.

Also, like the original "Star Wars", "TPM" comes with a pretty self-contained ending. Neither movie really needs a next chapter, as both end with celebrations and could just conclude right there if desired...

 

Gene Roddenberry

Season Three and cancellation

After Star Trek was saved from cancellation and the third season was commenced, Roddenberry promised to return to the show as line producer, if NBC promised him a new, more family-oriented timeslot of Mondays 7:30PM, but threatened to pull out if the network did not do so. Roddenberry grossly overestimated his value as perceived by network and studio, and since he did not possess the political and diplomatic skills – nor would he ever have – to deal with upper network or studio echelons (Herb Solow had always ran interference for Roddenberry and the network and studio, but the former had left the production by now), the network was only too happy to call his bluff. When the network finally doomed Star Trek to the "graveyard slot" of Fridays 10PM, Roddenberry, having stated at the time to a newspaper, "If the network wants to kill us, it couldn't make a better move." (Toledo Blade, 15 August 1968) and his bluff gone awry, felt that he had no choice but to back out from the series. With Fred Freiberger serving as line producer, Roddenberry – while keeping his title and salary of executive producer – relocated his office to the far side of the former Desilu lot (as it was now the Paramount lot), and, despite the written promise he had made to the cast and production staff on 28 March 1968 to the contrary, recused himself entirely from managing the show in its third and last year, having completely lost heart according to Solow and Justman. (Inside Star Trek: The Real Story)

Justman said that the decline of script quality was mainly due to the fact that "the Roddenberry touch" was gone. Exemplary of this was that Roddenberry could no longer be bothered to read or revise scripts, which he had done so vigorously in the previous two seasons, often to the chagrin of writers. He did made half-hearted efforts to make himself available, but only when Freiberger and the other producers specifically sought out his advise. However, sensing his non-commitment, even that little decreased significantly as the season progressed.

The Motion Picture and feature films

The Motion Picture began production in 1978, on which Roddenberry served as producer with director Robert Wise as uncredited executive producer. Production time and costs went highly over the expected, largely exceeding the pre-calculated budget, ending up with the final number of US$44-$45 million, which made The Motion Picture the second most expensive film at the time, after Superman: The Movie. Former Paramount studio executive Jeffrey Katzenberg described the project as "a runaway train". (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge)

Despite earning US$82 million in domestic gross revenue, the total gross came as a disappointment to the studio, considering the over-budget costs incurred. In one respect Gene Roddenberry was undoubtedly responsible for the over-budget expenditures, which largely stemmed from his incessant and increasingly vicious battles with the aforementioned Harold Livingston, together with Robert Goodwin the by Barry Diller appointed line-producers (already for Phase II with the express intent to keep Roddenberry on a tight leash, and over the by him preferred Robert Justman), made responsible for the script. Unable to let go of his vision of Star Trek – of which he was now zealously protective – and stubbornly adhering to storylines he himself, and nobody else, had conceived, Roddenberry was almost from the start at loggerheads with Livingston, resulting in a continuous series of increasingly vicious battles over story outline and script rewrites and re-rewrites, often performed surreptitiously by Roddenberry. The ongoing creative battle lasted for almost two years and proved to be particularly detrimental to the production, aside from entirely destroying the relationship between the two men. Having resigned no less than three times from the production, Livingston had later tersely stated on the occasion of his first departure, "By the time I left, Gene and I were ready to kill one another. I couldn't stand the son of a bitch, so I left." However, by early October 1978, Wise (thoroughly fed up with the production delays due to Roddenberry's inability to turn in a completed script), Shatner, Nimoy, and Katzenberg staged, what can only be described as a coup, and effectively removed Roddenberry from creative control, which was entirely handed over to the recently reappointed Livingston. From there on end, Roddenberry was executive producer in name only. (Star Trek Movie Memories, 1995, pp. 67, 97, 105-111)

While many other and more prominent factors interplayed with the overexeeded costs as well, publicly, the studio solely blamed Roddenberry – considered a thorn in their side since the days of The Original Series – for the failure, which provided a good opportunity for them to remove him from creative (movie) control once and for all. The studio publicity tactics, effectively deflecting any costs responsibility from themselves and Director Wise, worked like a charm; For the remainder of his life, the US$45 million Motion Picture price-tag stuck to Roddenberry's name like glue, as no sentence mentioning both him and the film was ever published without having the figure also quoted in the very same sentence. Yet, not everyone bought into the studio line, as Roddenberry was not without his staunch supporters, like the author couple Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens, who have claimed in their reference book The Art of Star Trek (p. 156) that, "(T)o be fair, the movie itself cost only $25 million to make. The extra $20 million or so represented all the cost Paramount had occurred over the years on all the other STAR TREK projects that were not made." As Reeves-Stevens' "25 million" were already taken up by the visual effects production and set construction alone, their statement should be considered as manipulative as those of the studio, albeit on the opposite end of the spectrum. (see: Star Trek: The Motion Picture: Costs and revenues)

In what can be described as a ploy to tie-in the fan base as well as to defang Roddenberry, the studio gave him a contract, his own office and the formal title of "Executive Consultant" for the subsequent five Star Trek films, which meant that directors and creative staff could ask for his opinion on the projects, but his advice was not needed to be taken. Whether or not Roddenberry realized it at the time, by signing this contract, his creation was effectively taken away from him; Barry Diller finally had his pound of flesh. From the start, Roddenberry spent his time by incessantly writing unsolicited story outlines (over time he became increasingly single-minded, fixated on a time travel story involving the Kennedy assassination), script drafts, annotations, memos and the like, no one ever really read (but inundating the offices of subsequent production teams nevertheless), and continuously trying to reintegrate himself with the creative development of the subsequent five Star Trek films, only to be ignored by the studio and production staff alike. David Gerrold typified his new position as "an emeritus status", but added that he was concurrently from now on considered by the industry as "a has-been". (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge) And indeed, none of the directors and producers actually consulted for real with Roddenberry regarding their projects, especially Producer Harve Bennett (who loathed Roddenberry, but who became quite adept at routinely answering Roddenberry's memo tsunamis with noncommittal replies on auto-pilot) and Director Nicholas Meyer (with whom Roddenberry had a vicious run-in shortly before his death, over perceived racism in regard to the Klingons in Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country.), both responsible for the three most successful outings of the Original Crew films, Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home and The Undiscovered Country, which were the ones, somewhat unsurprisingly, that were most vehemently, but unsuccessfully, resisted by Roddenberry.

While acknowledging this state of affairs as "speculation", an opposing view was again proffered by the Reeves-Stevens' author couple, who have stated in their book Star Trek: The Next Generation - The Continuing Mission (p. 3) that, "(t)he real reason for Paramount's concern about keeping Roddenberry tied to each Star Trek film was that every executive involved with the productions shared the maddening knowledge that no one had the slightest idea why Star Trek was a success...except Gene Roddenberry. Without his input, there was always the chance that the next movie wouldn't capture whatever it was that made Star Trek so enticing." While Roddenberry supporters Reeves-Stevens' certainly did have a point where the studio executives themselves were concerned, their assertion was by he time of their writings already proven wrong by the directors, producers and screenwriters (most notably Performer/Writer/Director Nimoy, who most definitely had a thorough understanding of what made Star Trek "tick", arguably even more so than Roddenberry himself did) of the subsequent five movies, all of them, save the by William Shatner co-written/directed, Star Trek V: The Final Frontier, highly successful and produced without any creative input from Roddenberry, and each of them actually opposed by him in varying degrees of vehemence. Roddenberry being put out to pasture, it effectively was the Nimoy-Bennet-Meyer triumvirate that became the keeper of the Star Trek movie flame in the decade following The Motion Picture. (Cinefantastique, Vol 22 #5, pp. 39-42)

Most ironically, it was the least successful one, Shatner's much reviled fifth movie, The Final Frontier, which approximated Roddenberry's atheistic world view the most and which was very reminiscent of his own 1975 original The God Thing movie script, heavily reworked later on to become In Thy Image, ultimately the basis for The Motion Picture. However, not being written by him personally, the movie was vehemently resisted by Roddenberry nonetheless, going even as far as having his attorney Maizlish prepare legal procedures against co-writer Shatner. Legal procedures did not materialize however – his movies deal stipulations simply did not allow for them – , but a thoroughly chagrined Roddenberry ordained the movie as being "apocryphal", readily accepted by the more puritanical elements of Star Trek fandom. (Star Trek FAQ 2.0, chapter 13; Star Trek Movie Memories, 1995, pp. 283-284) Richard Arnold, who was working at Roddenberry's office at the time, was present when the first story outline was delivered to Roddenberry as a FYI, later explaining to Shatner why Roddenberry reacted as he did, "So when you came along, though it was years later, with very similar themes, Gene was really hurt. I think it hurt Gene's ego that you finally going to tell the story that he wanted to tell ten years earlier. You were about to succeed where he had failed. At the time, Gene's secretary, Susan was making matters worse by walking around the office stating things like "I can't believe it! He stole your idea. Bill's an *******. Bill's a bastard." So that did not help, and additionally, I know there was a fairly legitimate concern on Gene's part that your sense of humor [remark: in regard to the way the secondary cast was eventually portrayed in the movie] was a little different than had ever been visualized before." While Susan Sackett's reaction might be construed as personally motivated, she actually had, in all fairness, a point; Shatner himself has related how he had stumbled upon Roddenberry ten years earlier when the latter was busy writing The God Thing, and was on that occasion given a beat for beat expose on the story. Arguably, some of that may have had nestled in Shatner's subconscious. (Star Trek Movie Memories, 1995, pp. 46-49, 289-291) Though Shatner had already implied as much in his memoirs, Arnold's remarks confirmed that Shatner had not communicated with Roddenberry even once, during the entire production of the movie.

By the time The Undiscovered Country went into production, Roddenberry's stature within the movie franchise had whithered considerably, being only provided lip-service at best – that is, if people could be even bothered to make the effort at all – and was all-around considered a nuisance, to be lived with as an unfortunate fact of life, or as Richard Arnold has put the prevalent studio attitude at the time, "We're happy to use your name and your creation, but don't call us, we'll call you." (Star Trek Movie Memories, 1995, p. 367) Exemplary of this was, when Roddenberry expressed concerns about turning Saavik in to a traitor in the movie, feeling that she had become a too beloved character in his universe. When informed of this, Director Meyer (who had no love lost for Roddenberry ever since he came aboard for Wrath of Khan, which was so obtusely opposed by the former) derisively remarked, "I wrote the character of Saavik in STAR TREK II. That wasn't a Gene Roddenberry character. If he doesn't like what I'm doing, maybe he should give the money he's [making off my films] back. Then maybe I'll care what he has to say." Without bothering to get back to Roddenberry, Meyer pushed ahead, but eventually changed the character after all, for reasons entirely unrelated to Roddenberry's concerns. (Cinefantastique, Vol 22 #5, p. 31)

Essentially "bumped upstairs" to become stuck in the studio's equivalent of the "Bermuda Triangle", Roddenberry as Star Trek creator, was still compensated handsomely by the studio though, having profited little, if any, from The Original Series previously, save for the revenues stemming from memorabilia sales through Lincoln Enterprises and his Star Trek conventions attendance fees. (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge)

The Next Generation

In 1986, with Star Trek's 20th anniversary coming soon, and Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home hitting the theaters, then Paramount Television Group President Mel Harris decided it would be profitable to launch a brand new Star Trek series. Originally and obviously, studio executives wanted to create the series without Roddenberry's involvement, but eventually agreed that Star Trek creator Roddenberry should be on board for the project.

There were two overriding reasons for resurrecting Roddenberry from the studio's "Bermuda Triangle"; Firstly, long before the official announcement was made that a new Star Trek reincarnation was to be aired, word had already leaked out that this reincarnation was to feature an entirely new crew, and outraged "Trekkies" actually picketed the studio for what they perceived as blasphemy for even considering a Star Trek without the Original Crew, attracting media attention. Having Roddenberry aboard in an official capacity would at least allay some of their concerns. But secondly, and even more importantly, there were also legal issues to consider. While Roddenberry had surrendered all legal title to the original Star Trek, there was that one notable exception: his "created by" credit. No new Star Trek incarnation could ever be created without his consent in his lifetime. Not having him involved would have most assuredly resulted in his veto, and, contrary to the movies, this time he did indeed had a very strong legal base to block any and all development of a new Star Trek production. Simply put, the studio actually needed Roddenberry this time around. (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge)

Roddenberry and his lawyer, Leonard Maizlish agreed on a deal with the studio, which included a "handsome share" for Roddenberry, according to Paramount Network Television President John S. Pike. Pike's "handsome share" consisted of a US$1 million dollar sign-on bonus, besides a considerable regularly salary, which consisted of US$9,000 per episode, multiplied for eight syndication runs, augmented with US$5,000 legal/administrative fee per episode for Norway Corporation. This amounted to US$77,000 per episode or over US$2 million per season. Additionally Roddenberry arranged a profit sharing deal, where it was stipulated that he was to receive 35% of the adjusted gross (not net as back in 1965, thereby avoiding the "Hollywood accounting" trap) profits derived from the series. Roddenberry celebrated his return to Star Trek by purchasing a new, US$100,000 Rolls-Royce. Incidentally, the studio declared The Next Generation "in the profit" on 21 January 1993, after his death, and announced the start of profit distribution, followed by a US$6.8 million disbursement (nicely conforming to the by Paramount President Brandon Tartikoff reported gross Next Generation profit of US$25 million in 1992) to Norway and Eileen Roddenberry the following month. (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge; Gene Roddenberry: The Myth and the Man Behind Star Trek, p. 220; Star Trek: The Next Generation - The Continuing Mission, p. 155)

Noted for his loyalty to co-workers he implicitly trusted (already evidenced by his time and again hiring of actors he had worked with before, for his numerous projects over the past decades), Roddenberry, back again at the helm, was determined to bring back as many production staff members from The Original Series as possible to develop and produce the new show, which he had actually already intended to do, and partially did, on the ten years earlier, but ultimately abandoned Phase II television series. These included producers Robert Justman, Edward Milkis, as well as writers David Gerrold and D.C. Fontana, all of them brought in first by Roddenberry in October 1986 to form the original production nucleus for the new series, to be followed by several others at later times. (Star Trek: The Next Generation - The Continuing Mission, pp. 9-11) Star Trek: The Next Generation premiered in September 1987 in first-run syndication with the two-hour pilot "Encounter at Farpoint". For all his Human fallacies and/or creative, political and interpersonal shortcomings, Roddenberry has also been renowned throughout his life for his more likable character traits as well as for his good-natured practical jokes, which occasionally back-fired on him. Affable and amiable to persons he himself liked and trusted, Roddenberry had an uncanny knack of endearing himself to people. This was exemplified by his glee to be reunited with his Original Series veteran friends, when he walked into the offices of Fontana, Milkis, Gerrold and Justman one day, early in the production of The Next Generation, and handed them a US$5,000 bonus each. To Justman, Roddenberry said on the occasion, "I want you to have it because you deserve it–even more." Though Justman left after the first season on the account of Maizlish, he had nothing but praise for Roddenberry himself, when he, also referring to the bonus incident, added, "It was wonderful working with Gene again, though. He was affectionate like he had never been before. Gene was really, really affectionate, almost as if — no, I think it was because he sensed that his end wasn't that far off, and he had a second chance at a relationship with me that never could have happened otherwise, and he wanted to make up for some of the disappointments he had caused me." Aside from Roddenberry "deserting" the Original Series in its third season, Justman was also referring to him not being invited back to Phase II – The Motion Picture, though Roddenberry had actually intended to do so. He was however, overruled by the studio, but, typically, Roddenberry could not bear to inform Justman of this himself, not returning his phone-calls when the latter reported for work. (Starlog, issue 228, p. 59; Inside Star Trek: The Real Story, 1997, pp. 432-433)

In mid-Season 1, Roddenberry appointed Maurice Hurley as showrunner, and, while still being active overseeing the series, with his failing health, he eventually largely retired from daily production business. Hurley was responsible for keeping Roddenberry's "vision of the future" and his dictums for the show intact, and at first he did so, which however, led to conflicts with the writing staff, most notably Herbert J. Wright. "That's just the way it is. Star Trek is not like any other show because it is one unique vision, and if you agree with Gene Roddenberry's vision for the future, you should be locked up somewhere," Hurley declared at the time, "It's wacky doodle, but it's his wacky doodle. If you can't deal with that, you can't do the show. There are rules on top of rules on top of rules. There are some people who have a deep history with Gene, whose eggs are bruised easily. People get confused about who really is Star Trek, and that messes people's heads up. Star Trek is Gene Roddenberry and nobody else." (Starlog, issue 152, p. 29) Aggravated by the 1988 Writers Guild of America strike, the tail end of the first season and most of the second season was marred by infighting among the writing staff, in which Hurley had center stage. Mel Harris, who unlike all of his (preceding) studio executive colleagues, was a Roddenberry supporter (in public at least), had been on record stating, "[W]e had a hard time keeping writers on the show....[A] lot of the writers that were available [in 1986] were coming off of cop shows and...wanted to do bang-bang, shoot-tern-ups or car chases, let's have the space ship run around and...shoot the bad guys, and Gene had to go back in and rewrite many, many of the early scripts because they simply didn't fit the premises that were outlined in this bible."

The first season could be described as a huge turmoil and struggle for power, which were in no small part due to Roddenberry's ill health, aggravated by alcohol and substance abuse (when starting his work on the new series, Roddenberry had to be admitted for months on a weekend basis in October 1986 into a La Costa, San Diego, rehab center to kick his habits). Maizlish, arguably overzealously protecting his client's interests, convinced an ailing and increasingly paranoid Roddenberry that others were lurking to stab him in the back, and managed to get rid of all the Original Series veterans who initially worked on the show. Going as far as rewriting scripts without any Writers Guild of America license or permit, and secretly lurking into other people's offices, Maizlish was considered a main destructive force behind the scenes, and eventually got banned from the Paramount lot. (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge, Inside Star Trek: The Real Story) Whether or not Maizlish had his client's interests truly at heart, he had done him a great disfavor as the departure of the Original Series veterans had a profound effect on Roddenberry according to Gerrold, "Gene was crying because all of his friends were gone. It was because Maizlish chased them away." Considering the deep emotional attachment Roddenberry had for his Original Series friends, who were the very first staffers he had brought in to form the original October 1986 production nucleus for The Next Generation, has made Maizlish's attitude towards Gerrold, Fontana, Justman and Milkis all the more inexplicable. The now friendless Roddenberry was subsequently left dangerously exposed to studio politics at which he was notoriously inept. Already during the first two seasons of The Original Series, it had been Herb Solow who ran interference for Roddenberry and the studio, but once the former was gone, so was Roddenberry, and during the production of Phase II–The Motion Picture, Roddenberry again had his share of run-ins with the studio. (Inside Star Trek: The Real Story, 1997, pp. 371-375) "Gene didn't like Rick [Berman], at all. But Rick was installed on the show by the studio as a way to keep a control on the show...to keep the budgets in line, make sure that the scripts were done. Ultimately, Berman ended up in control rather than Maizlish because Berman played the politics of the studio more effectively.", Gerrold elaborated further.

And indeed, "keeper of the flame" Hurley too, came to revise his stance, as he increasingly found Roddenberry's dictums too "wacky doodle" himself – especially after he caught Roddenberry violating his own dictums during one of his script rewrites – , coming to perceive them as lacking in dramatic story telling potential. Inevitably, this led to vicious clashes between Roddenberry and Hurley himself during the second season. (William Shatner Presents: Chaos on the Bridge) Roddenberry, undoubtedly experiencing a severe case of déjà vu from his previous dealings with Harold Livingston during the production of Phase II-The Motion Picture, became deeply embroiled with Hurley as well as with other writers, who wrote stories he felt were not in concordance with his vision on Star Trek. From the third season onward, Berman (originally appointed as "Supervising Producer" by the studio, who, besides Harris, had all but forgotten Roddenberry's behavior during the production of The Motion Picture, to "watch over" Roddenberry's antics) and Michael Piller were made executive producers, and became responsible for running the series, and eventually the entire franchise.

 

This is still the only Star Wars film I haven't seen. I just don't know if I can bring myself to sit through it after the awfulness of The Last Jedi. Watching one of my favorite franchises being destroyed has left me numb on the series.

 

Don't watch it. I wish I had been given that advice. This will be the first Star Wars movie that I will only watch once.

 

And I'd agree with that... I've said here ad nauseum that Clones could be, if not redeemed entirely then certainly strengthened considerably, via a comprehensive re-edit... some things - like Anakin's age, or the sterile digital cinematography, or the (largely) stilted acting, or the excessive CGI, etc - simply can't be changed and are now baked in, like it or lump it, but a tighter, shorter, more focused edit (of less than 130 minutes, certainly not one minute more!) could potentially shift that film from an overly-generous 6 to an 8 in ratings. It's scenes like this that show how good it could have been overall, the potential was/is there;



Menace on the other hand, with the exception of the still-impressive podrace sequence, is an irredeemable lost cause from beginning to end... the basic story is sound - as reflected in George's initial rough draft - but the resulting film is still one of the very worst, not to mention most lazily-executed from a directing standpont, franchise tentpole releases I've yet had the misfortune to witness... I wasn't expecting a masterpiece by any standard prior to release, but I at least hoped for a solid (if nothing more) new SW film... what we got was Ed Wood set loose with a hundred-million dollar budget and cutting-edge tech... Plan 9 from Outer Space for the multiplex generation!

That it was a SW film is the only reason it made more than a few bucks and lasted more than ten days at the box-office...

 

I'd really advocate that you give 'Last Jedi' another try.

Maybe you won't change your mind, but I think it's worth it!

 

The 3-way lightsaber battle at the end is great, but otherwise... yeah, it's a tough slog.

I'm enough of a "Star Wars" boy that I still enjoy it, but it's borderline boring at times!

 

Darth Maul Actor Says Return Of The Jedi Was A Much Better Ending Than Rise Of Skywalker

By Christian Bone

Sam Witwer’s become a fixture of the Star Wars universe, thanks to his turn as Starkiller in The Force Unleashed video game and, most notably, voicing Darth Maul in The Clone Wars, Rebels and Solo. He’s also a diehard fan of the franchise, too, and has recently shared his thoughts about the sequel movies. And other SW lovers may find themselves agreeing with his generally negative opinions. Particularly when it comes to Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker.

While speaking on a Twitch livestream (as transcribed by CBR), Witwer tried to be diplomatic about his thoughts on J.J. Abrams’ recent closer to the Skywalker saga, but admitted he just doesn’t see it as being part of the same story started by George Lucas.

“It’s um… look, if you like it, awesome,” the actor said. “It’s not as meaningful to me because I can’t really reconcile that mythology with George’s. But that’s just my opinion, you know? My personal take is I think a Star Wars where the moral of the story is ‘throw down your weapon, don’t hurt your family, love or fear.'”

Witwer did say that there were “some really great moments” to be found in Episode IX, but elaborated on a major gripe he has with the final fight between Rey, Kylo Ren and the resurrected Emperor Palpatine. To him, it doesn’t come close to the impact of the climax to Return of the Jedi.

“I think that’s superior than a Star Wars where you win by melting the bad guy’s face off. That’s just my thing… I don’t know that you can do a better ending than Return of the Jedi.”

It’s not a controversial view to say that Return is better than Rise – even Abrams would no doubt agree on that – but Witwer’s dismissal of the film’s ending as just being about melting the bad guy’s face off is pretty harsh. To be fair, that ending worked great for Raiders of the Lost Ark. But obviously Witwer is referencing the lack of emotional depth and coherence in the movie, which is a legitimate criticism.

Darth Maul Actor Says Rian Johnson Didn't Do His Homework On The Last Jedi

By Alex Crisp

Few mainstream Hollywood blockbusters provoke the level of constant debate Star Wars: The Last Jedi does. Two and a half years after its release and people are still weighing in on whether it was a bold reinvention of Star Wars canon, or a woeful defilement of its antecedents.

Now, another figure (not too grandiose a term) has given their Last Jedi piece. Sam Witwer is known to fans for voice roles in multiple sub-franchises, including The Clone Wars, The Force Unleashed and Rebels. In a recent Twitch stream (reported by CBR), Witwer gave his refreshingly candid views on the film, and on Rian Johnson’s handling of its subject matter, saying:

“Last Jedi, to me, felt like a movie made by a guy who hadn’t quite done his homework. I think Rian Johnson’s a talented guy, but Bruce Lee didn’t develop Jeet Kune Do without learning Kung Fu first. You can’t reinvent Star Wars without knowing Star Wars first.”

“[He] didn’t — for me — make a compelling argument for why Luke didn’t go and help his sister.

Witwer then emphasized:

“This is just my opinion, guys. There were a lot of things in The Last Jedi I found compelling in a Rian Johnson filmmaker point of view. They just didn’t fit into Star Wars. I don’t think he did his Star Wars homework. The themes, what it’s about, what the characters are about.”

I dearly hope the overlords at Disney don’t reprimand him over this. His criticisms are of Johnson, not of employers Walt D. It’s also good to know someone, albeit a minor figure in the extended franchise, felt confident enough to speak openly about the movie. I suspect we’ll be getting Last Jedi takes until the end of time, too.

 

I don't think anyone at Disney is going to reprimand him. As with Mark Hamill, he is just stating respectfully his honest opinion. Ultimately his opinion boils down to "The original trilogy is better than the sequel trilogy ", which is not a controversial opinion. Even those that like the sequels would ever argue against that opinion.

I'd be more worried about the loony toxic fringe of the fandom that has already taken his words out of context in the same way they took Mark's out of context as a bludgeon to use to try and prove their own opinions as some fact. Sam has had to clarify on Twitter that he didnt hate either TLJ or TROS or thought they were bad movies,he was just stating his opinion about a couple issues he had with them as a fan, without attacking Abrams or Johnson as people or film makers. Something most of said fringe loony fandom fail to do.


He's since had a few Arguments with some of the infamous fandom Menace asshats who initially took his criticisms of the TLJ and TROS as validation of their opinion that everything Disney had done with Star Wars is trash or some SJW agenda to kill all white men (or whatever the latest conspiracy they are running with) and thus, he's had to block them.

Fact is,actors have opinions. Disney isn't going to reprimand anyone. As long as the actors don't start attacking the people in charge personally and stick to criticisms over creative choices, Disney doesn't care. Nor should they.

 

Rise is the first Star Wars movie I didn’t see in the theater. Not sure if I was in the theater as a baby for Empire, but yeah. I was born in 1979. I waited for it to be available on Disney Plus.

I’m so glad I waited because this movie sucked so bad I wanted to die! It is a serious pile of corporate focus group Schitt. It’s basically Phantom Menace on really bad coke. The kind cut with baby laxative and god knows what else.

At least George Lucas was executing his singular vision with the prequels, as flawed as they were. The sequels (7 and 9 at least, I though 8 was fairly bold) were made by a cut rate Spielberg with really weak scripts with totally rehashed plot elements. These are everything I hate about modern movies. Too self aware, no breathing room in scenes. Everything is just constant rapid fire. Too much plot. Phoned in emotion. Ugh.

 

I just bought the 3D Blu-ray, mostly because I'm a completist. I enjoyed it at the theatre, though I agree with a lot of the criticism people had. Looking forward to seeing it again, but will first watch Episodes VII and VIII.

 

I completely agree. I did not like the turn TLJ took but it has aged better with me. I still don't like it but compared to TROS, which I rewatched with my kids last night, it's a total POS. I was keeping my criticism to a minimum, but both my kids were noting all the recycling and thefts from other movies. For example, when the emperor was stealing Rey and Ben's life-force, my 9-year old said, "Who does he think he is, a dementor?" It was hilarious hearing them pick it apart. My 12-year old daughter said there was only one memorable line: that bit about the resistance not having a "navy" of ships, and the first/last order guys saying, "It's just people" or something like that. We laughed a lot.