Steely Dan Analogue Productions 45 RPM & UME/Geffen 33 Vinyl Reissues

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MemoInPR, May 18, 2022.

  1. Otto Konrad

    Otto Konrad Forum Resident

    Location:
    Richmond, Virginia
    Yep thats what I mean by clean (looks AND sounds NM).

    A good playing VG+ is a lot less. But its hard to reliably buy those on Discogs, right? In practice Discog sellers use VG+ to cover a very wide range of condition. Better to shop in physical stores. And that takes time and patience. Which I admit I totally lack.
     
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  2. wpjs

    wpjs Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ny
    and yet they are super protective of copyright infringement.

    I also wonder- what is the condition of the original tapes so many years later?
    Still a strong argument to buy original first pressing vinyl.
    No confusion and tapes were fresh
     
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  3. YouCantWin

    YouCantWin Lacking in Some Direction

    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I admit that my primary goal is to get clean playing LPs and don’t really care too much about superficial marks, but I’ve had good luck on Discogs. And every time I’ve had a problem, the seller and I have come to a satisfactory resolution - sometimes a partial refund, sometimes a return. But, I only buy from sellers with unanimously positive feedback (or nearly so), and I buy based as much on description as on grade.

    But I completely agree that nothing beats shopping in person and grading for yourself. I’d take that over buying online every time.
     
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  4. Starquest

    Starquest ‎ ‎ ‎

    Location:
    Twin Cities, MN
    I don't get it either. None of it makes any sense at all. Gaucho reportedly cost a ton of money to make - you'd think the tapes would have been protected. But I guess someone thought the copy was sufficient, or nobody cared, or ??? I mean it was a long time ago and the entire operation was pretty coked up :D

    But with aja, clearly some original master tracks exist or existED. There's that youtube video from the late 90s of Becker & Fagen at a mixing board playing around with different tracks.
     
  5. RichC

    RichC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Charlotte, NC
    I went down an Aja rabbit hole recently (before the UHQR announcement) so here's my experience with seeking a NM press in 2022:
    1) Played the AAB (scratched B) copy I've had for years, realized the title track was noisy in the quiet parts, decided to upgrade.
    2) Found a Discogs guy selling off his dad's collection, said his AAB Pitman copy was noise-free and playtested it first.
    3) Paid $70 for his copy, but it WAS dead-quiet.... except a repeating tic for 15 seconds on "Deacon Blues." Don't know why it bummed me out, but it did. Mentioned it to him and he gave me a small refund, or offering to take it back for a full refund. I decided to keep it cuz, you know... pristine aside from one spot.
    4) Because I have the sickness, I kept checking local copies of Aja.... and found a true AB in a shop for $15. Cleaned it up.... Plays with a little crackle between songs, but no tics.... and the sound is better than the AAB Pitman with a P4 matrix.

    So ya never know. The $70 copy is 97% perfect, but I find myself preferring the $15 copy with more magic in the grooves, even though there's a bit more noise.
    Aja has never been an easy album to find a noise-free player, and that difficulty is magnified by all the slight sound variations in pressings. (Supposedly the Keel press is even better than my AB, but I've never seen one in the wild.)
    If I had to make an assumption about the upcoming UHQR, it's gonna have some truly black backgrounds (assuming they've solved their "Clarity" issues), offset by a mastering that's good but not to the level of the best original pressings. (Or "Hot Stampers," if you're Tom Port charging $350 for a Keel.) One's enjoyment of said UHQR will probably depend on what other pressings you have for comparison.... and how much you value a low noise floor.
     
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  6. YouCantWin

    YouCantWin Lacking in Some Direction

    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I find repeating tics to be especially annoying. There’s something about knowing that it’s going to happen again in a couple seconds that really takes me out of the music. Much more so than a stray tic or crackle.
     
  7. Mang

    Mang Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ, USA
    I have memorized the clicks and tiks on songs from my early days of listening. Weird to hear them clean, but I got over it
     
  8. rashers

    rashers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ireland
    It’s worse than that. In that video the guys are playing the multitrack masters (which is what you really would want) - two tracks from those masters are missing. The original master tapes (ie the mix down masters) have completely disappeared with no trace at all. For new AAA reissues all that is needed is a copy of the master tape. There is usually a safety copy plus copies for other territories. Those tapes - say for Germany, Japan, UK etc. - may actually be in better shape than the original US masters. Perhaps the engineer kept a copy. Unfortunately, the absence of the multitrack masters makes it impossible to make surround sound reissues or, really, any form of remixing. That’s why there was no Aja SACD with surround layer.
    Modern remixing - such as what Steven Wilson has been doing for XTC, King Crimson and others - allows for a full remix in the digital realm. I think his remixes sound amazingly good and breathe new life into old recordings. Giles Martin is doing something similar - albeit in a much more difficult realm - with the Beatles.
    I love the 5.1 version of Gaucho (DVD-A and SACD). It would be amazing if, at some stage, a remixing engineer was allowed to produce an immersive mix of the remainder of the SD catalog.
     
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  9. TNhillbilly

    TNhillbilly Doctor Wu

    Location:
    Nashville
    Thing is, finding a NM with a roached jacket is normally pretty easy to find for a reasonable price. If you must have a nice jacket simply find a combo on Discogs that has a roached record and pristine cover. They’re dirt cheap and then you marry the two purchases. Record……..Jacket……..I now pronounce you husband and wife.

    That said, with a quick look on Discogs at this very moment there are 8 OG copies of Aja that are Media/Sleeve NM/VG+ or better and <$50

    These are all US pressings btw. Didn’t get into foreign presses
     
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  10. UncleHalsey

    UncleHalsey Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle, WA, USA
    @RichC your comments resonated with me regarding how an occasional tic here and there can affect enjoyment of Aja in particular. I was reared on the initial Aja CD release so I opted for the ones and zeros of the AF SACD sonic landscape instead of UHQR, as I fear I would obsess/spiral over any tic!

    I was reared on the cassette version(!) of Royal Scam so I expect the UHQR to be a massive upgrade.
     
  11. rashers

    rashers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ireland
    I had a good look at my Steely Dan / Donald Fagen vinyl collection today. Most of the SDs were bought decades ago - and not a single US original pressing amongst them. Not one! All pressed up in the UK or Europe. They sound good nonetheless. For what it's worth - of the multiple copies of "The Nightfly" - I would rank them 1. 1 Step MOFI (really exceptional), 2. 2012 Reissue (Bellman) - also in the cheap x-mas box, 3. Early 1980s European Pressing. The live version from 2019 is great. The DVD-A sounds really good as well.

    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Doop

    Doop Walking The Fine Line Between Stupid And Clever

    Location:
    Central New York
    Seeking a couple thoughts/opinions regarding these releases ...

    1) I don't have an SACD player now — I may purchase one at some point — but is it a safe bet that the CD layer of these releases w/Grundman mastering will be superior to the 1998-2000 remasters I now own? I think I paid less than $50 total several years ago for the first 7 albums — all brand new. I recall at least a couple were only $5 at my local record shop, and none were over $10. So pretty reasonable to gamble on at least one (CBAT), yes?

    2) A couple years ago, I paid a princely sum for a still-sealed copy of the Speakers Corners CBAT. Turned out to be a repress (it included an Autumn 2013 SC catalog, dated 2/2013). I'm considering parting ways with it, to fund the UHQR. However, I'm wondering whether the UHQR or even the UMe (if done well) could tank the resale value, which leads me to think I should sell it sooner rather than later. Yet if these reissues don't best it, then I may regret that choice. Aargh! Perhaps the fact that it's AAA will help it hold its value regardless?
     
  13. Chemguy

    Chemguy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Western Canada
    Just watched the Donald Fagen, Chad Kassem, Fred Kaplan YouTube conversation. Good stuff.

    It appears that we audiophile types have Walter Becker’s dad and Roger Nichols to thank the most!
     
  14. Starquest

    Starquest ‎ ‎ ‎

    Location:
    Twin Cities, MN


    Watching now. Always loved Fagen's permanent "meh" disposition :D

    I don't think I'd want to see him and Chad in the same room. It could get ugly.

    In fact, Chad's lucky that Walter ain't around. He could easily wind up a character in a future Steely Dan song, and not a sympathetic character if you know what I mean.
     
  15. Fagan seemed so blasé about these audiophile records but I’m sure he’s happy about them being done this way. Adding to his bank account. But. Maybe that just his personality.

    I realize why it wouldn’t have been mentioned but I would have love to hear him chat about the digital versions coming out too.
     
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  16. VQR

    VQR Recovering AAA-holic

    Location:
    ...
    I only got an AB copy of Aja relatively recently, about half a year ago, and got a copy that plays NM for $35 with the cover real close to VG+, barely just VG. Definitely not a trivial amount of money, but I imagine with some patience on Discogs or a local store, a lot of people could still get pretty clean copies.
     
  17. Starquest

    Starquest ‎ ‎ ‎

    Location:
    Twin Cities, MN
    That's exactly how I would expect him to react. In fact I think a lot (most?) artists would react that way, sometimes they don't get the complete geeking out over their music or they don't experience it that way. They don't sit at home listening to their own records. "Oh, you're reissuing my 50-year-old album on some weird vinyl . . . uhh . . . ok . . . ?"
     
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  18. rashers

    rashers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ireland
    1. If you have a decent DAC it is possible to rip the DSD layer using an old Sony Blu-ray player and stream the music on your home network. The SACD may or may or sound better than the remasters - one thing is for sure - these tapes are 25 years older than when last used. The last set were mastered specifically for digital - I personally like them but they do sound different to the records. Absolutely zero information has been given out about the digital mastering chain from Analogue Productions. I once saw a video where Kevin Gray was showing off his equipment and the interviewer pointed out a box: what’s this? Paraphrasing him - we run a chord into that to make a simultaneous digital recording for SACD. Not a huge amount of effort. This is not a Bob Ludwig style DSD remaster; perhaps that is a good thing. Perhaps not. DSD has a significantly greater dynamic range than vinyl. Done well it sounds incredible.
    2. Speakers Corner use new stampers for each run of represses (personal communication after enquiry about “Crime of the Century”). There is no reason why your repress (or mine) should sound any different from their first press. Also it is 33rpm - you can listen to the record as it was meant to be heard. It absolutely will not lose value as a result of UHDR.
     
  19. WaltDon

    WaltDon Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    I see clean AB 1006 copies available in shops here (Colorado) frequently for $25-$35
     
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  20. You mean they don’t fixate on one note on side two track three ?
     
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  21. Myke

    Myke Trying Not To Spook The Horse

    ...then make a 90 minute video on You Tube so it can all be repeated word for word ? :laugh:

    Not you Mazzy, you I haven't unsubscribed from. But another YT host ? Oh yeah, had to...all he seems to do is come on a few hours after another host's broadcast, and repeat it all as if we might've missed it ????? :buttkick:
     
  22. Thank you but I also have my own style of BS too but I rarely take any of it too seriously.
     
  23. Myke

    Myke Trying Not To Spook The Horse

    No idea where this comes from, but if you knew via the other videos they already have been in the same room, and got along great.
     
  24. kitt1987

    kitt1987 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ohio
    I am just curious how quickly AP will sell through their UHQR pressings, I am sure some titles will sell faster than others but like others I am on the fence given the price point. As has been said a AAA 33 RPM release would have been “Goldilocks.” I may bite on one of the releases and decide from there if I want to continue with the rest. Would have been fantastic for the casual fans if AP would have reissued the original Greatest Hit set and squeezed in “FM” somewhere. Despite all this I do feel we are all fortunate that this project is well underway and is happening in any case.
     
  25. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    Keep in mind that Fagen has sort of a sardonic outlook on life, given his lyrics. This is not a sunny guy.
     
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