Stranger than Fiction, Larger Than Life: the Finn Brothers song-by-song discussion thread

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Lance LaSalle, Jan 21, 2019.

  1. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    "Fifth Wheel", only available on Phil Manzanera's 45-track The Collection double CD, must be one of the more obscure tracks featuring Tim on lead vocals. It might be worth mentioning that the album features one other track with Tim on lead vocals - a live version of "Charlie" recorded at The Borderline in London in June 1993. This live version is the same as the one that's been released as bonus track on CD singles and on Tim's Live at the Borderline promo CD.

    As a track first released in 1995, the same year as ALT's album and the first Finn Brothers duo album was released, it seems terribly out of place alongside the music on those two albums. As an outtake from Southern Cross it makes a bit more sense and works quite well in that context. Musically, this is very dance-oriented and catchy salsa funk sung by Tim. Lyrically, it could fit in on the Tim Finn album, dealing with a relationship in trouble where the narrator feels superfluous while also aware of his own less positive sides. I think the verse "When you look at me / I got ego on my conscience / What I want from life / Is a matter for concern / Ever-selfishly I burn" along with the female spoken word ("I don't want to be your mother / I don't want to be your teacher / But when will you ever learn that all you think about is yourself") make the lyric interesting - without these verses it would simply be a song in which the narrator complains about feeling unloved by his partner. These verses give us listeners a glimpse into the other person's perspective and that the narrator acknowledges this to be true. The narrator himself is concerned with what he wants from life, that he is being very selfish. The lines "Politics begins at home / And every room is a danger zone" make sense in the Southern Cross narrative. Perhaps a frustration in this relationship is that the you person is politically active and wants to look at the big issues for the country while the narrator is too busy fighting for the relationship to show interest in the political events going on. (A bit like "In the paper today, tales of war and of waste / But you turn right over to the TV page" from another song which we have all heard once or twice). I think Tim sings these word very convincingly and gives the song some character.

    A quite good track that should have been on Southern Cross, preferably in place of the simply terrible "The Great Leveller".
    3/5.
     
  2. jimbutsu

    jimbutsu WATCH YÖUR STEPPE

    This is a good deal more listenable than the other tracks from this project, and definitely feels a lot more "Tim Finn" than some of them. That said, the talking in the middle thing annoys me in almost every song I hear it in (it's cool when Vincent Price does it), and this one is particularly jarring for some reason. Still, listenable and probably not one I'd leap up from my chair to skip if it came on.

    3/5
     
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  3. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    And Other Enz.

    The inclusion of "Charlie" on that collection seems really weird to me. I mean, that's not one of Manzanera's greatest hits at all, and though his work there is fine, he's not even the best thing about it, which is Tim's vocal, IMHO. That's concert is truly the last release with Tim's youthful voice still intact.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
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  4. HitAndRun

    HitAndRun Forum Resident

    This is an interesting song. However, I feel that a lot of the interest comes from the vocal melody and the singing by Tim. The backing vocals fit far better than the songs on 'Southern Cross'. Maybe. I haven't gone back and checked the whole album before posting that.

    The lyrics sound better sung than they do when I read them. I hope that wasn't Tim expressing where he was at that time. The spoken word bit sounds a bit out of place to me.

    Returning to the vocal melody, Tim has given this song a good melodic hook. The backing track doesn't match it in terms of quality. The backing track sounds a bit like a 'MIDI' song. The (presumably) synth horns sound a bit cheesy. The bass sounds a bit overly busy and intrusive in places. Enough to detract from the song as a whole. Something more organic and pared down might have been better.

    3/5

    A bit of a mixed bag.
     
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  5. robcar

    robcar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    "Fifth Wheel" doesn't have a particularly strong melody and also has some of the negative features of the other tracks from these sessions - too much involved in the mix. It's not as bad in this aspect as some of the others we've heard, but it's still pretty busy. I can see why this one was discarded at the time, only seeing official release later on. I really don't like the horns on this one and the music doesn't really seem a good fit for the lyrics.

    2.8/5
     
  6. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Our votes for "Fifth Wheel":

    1-0
    2-0
    3-4
    4-1
    5-0
    Average: 3.14
     
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  7. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Today's song is "Am I Big Enough", written by Tim Finn and performed by Jane Maddick. It was released as a single in 1988.

    Not much other information on this obscurity. The melody dates back to 1978 Nineez demos, on the "Catherine Wheels/Disembodied Voices" sketches;(how many songs did Tim write in 1978?) and was later again recycled in "The Lonely Lions" from The Magnificent Nose in 1994 and finally in the gentle folk song "Rest" from Say It Is So in 1999.

    You can hear it here:

    Jane Maddick - Am I Big Enough - Clyp
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2019
  8. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter


    I've been runnin' 'round with every boy in town
    Acting like some cheap romantic fool
    Knowing that true love don't have no second chance
    Hoping I'm th'exception to the rule

    You only feel the sun upon your back in the summertime
    You only recognize your feelings when you say? (maybe say'm?)
    I only wish I had one dollar for every time I let you down
    Am I big enough to beg forgiveness now?

    Something in me speaks of endless wandering
    Something in me needs a love that lasts
    Running in the place of faith and tenderness
    Hollow is the heart that runs too fast

    You only feel the wind upon your face i the wintertime
    You only recognize your feelings when you say(?)
    I only wish I had one dollar for every time I let you down
    Am I Big enough to beg forgiveness now?
    Am I Big enough to beg forgiveness now?



    Escapade all dressed up in cowboy hat and boots.

    This is good melody and the best one we've heard Tim writing for someone else to date. I can see why Tim would reuse it when it languished in obscurity. The 80s "pop-country" production is terrible, but I've heard much worse from this era, for example Dolly Parton's White Limozeen album, which may be the worst-sounding record I've ever heard.. The lyric is a good, solid competent one.

    Comparisons to the more well-known "Rest" are inevitable; the latter comes off as less dated and more heartfelt; this comes off as a solid piece of craft....but one which is actually wedded to an inspired melody.

    I'll give it a 3.2, docked a bit for the production. Pop 80s production can work for me, but not so much on country songs. At least this lacks the gigantically gated snare that you hear a lot on late 80s country production -- this sounds like a simple drum machine, and overall the sound gives gives me more of the sunny lemonade-y feeling of Escapade...

    I actually like the song a bit better than some of the songs on that one. Fits nicely on my growing playlist of Tim Finn written songs performed by other artists.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2019
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  9. robcar

    robcar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    This is another new one to me. I can’t say that I’m very impressed with it, either. The melody is okay but the arrangement, singer, and overall performance land it firmly in the mediocre category for me. “Am I Big Enough” just doesn’t contain anything that I find very memorable.

    2.6/5
     
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  10. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    I have never heard this song until today and I had never heard of Jane Maddick either. Apparently she won Starmaker, a well-respected talent quest for young Australian country artists, in 1986 (Keith Urban was the winner in 1990). She also won the 1987 New Talent Golden Guitar, for the song "Rainbow Chaser". That song and "Am I Big Enough" were both released as singles from her debut album "Still Chasin' Rainbows" released in 1988. Here is some info on the single as well as a press release for it which mentions the song was written by Tim:
    Jane Maddick - Am I Big Enough

    As for the song itself, it's interesting as an early version of the brilliant "Rest" on Say It Is So. I think the melody is very good even in this Escapade-goes-country style and she has a good voice. The production sounds very dated though, as if the song comes straight out of a cheesy low-budget 80s comedy movie.

    3/5
     
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  11. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    Actually, according to the credits for the LP on Discogs, this track has real drums played by Doug Gallagher and/or Mark Kennedy. The latter, a very experienced Australian drummer who has been in several well-known (in Australia) groups since the early '70s, actually auditioned for the job as a drummer in Split Enz in 1983. Paul Hester has said in some article that when he got to the auditions and saw that Mark Kennedy was there he relaxed as he was sure that Mark K would inevitably get the job, so Paul could just have fun and later be able to tell his friends he had auditioned for Split Enz.
    Other familiar names credited as musicians on this recording are Sam McNally (who played on Escapade) on keyboards and Wendy Matthews (Noel's Cowards) on backing vocals.
     
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  12. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Thanks!
     
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  13. HitAndRun

    HitAndRun Forum Resident

    It is a nice melody, but the production we have here simply doesn't compare to Rest. Even though Tim is slightly hoarse of voice on Rest, the production and performance sound much more natural and suitable for the melody to me.

    I find that a lot of country songs don't have enough melodic and harmonic interest to me, and this sounds a bit squashed in that way to me. The later 'Rest' handles that well with its simple arrangement making the melody sound authentic. Here, it sounds like more 'product', and apart from the lead melody there's not much. The lyrics are OK, but nowhere near Tim's best.

    2.7/5

    The melody alone is better than that, but we're going to get another chance to rate the melody in a much better context. Maybe I would rate this higher if I wasn't familiar with the melody in another context. Though, I don't blame Tim for re-using it - it's a good melody and it deserves its second, third, fourth, chances.
     
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  14. jimbutsu

    jimbutsu WATCH YÖUR STEPPE

    I like it as a novelty/curiosity. There's something so unmistakably Tim Finn about it - like I can absolutely hear him singing this song based on the style/cadence/whatever. It's a little country for my taste, but with a couple musical and lyrical tweaks this would have been 100% not the least bit out of place on Escapade, right down to the da-da-das...

    3/5
     
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  15. jcr64

    jcr64 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Indiana
    There's a decent song here, with a nice melody and some interesting lyrical lines (nothing profound, but perhaps a bit more complex than you'd expect from a song of this genre). The whole thing is undone by the production, which is pretty bad. But I'm glad to have heard it (and I look forward to the future discussion of Tim's reworking of the song).

    (I've been giving "Woodface" some serious re-listens in anticipation of our upcoming discussion--can't wait.)

    3/5
     
  16. Michael Rofkar

    Michael Rofkar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Santa Rosa, CA
    I like this song, and would love to hear Tim sing it. It reminds me of 80s-era Clive Gregson.
     
  17. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Our votes for "Am I Big Enough":

    1-0
    2-0
    3-6
    4-0
    5-0
    Average: 2.9167
     
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  18. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Today's song is "Long Hard Road", written and produced by Phillip Judd and Tim Finn.

    This brief reunion from the old friends was one of three songs from the soundtrack of the film The Big Steal, which had some music from Phil Judd, Phil Judd and Tim Finn, The Makers, Boom Crash Opera and some other Australian/New Zealand artists. The Phil Judd music (including the Finn/Judd songs) make up about 19 minutes of exclusive music, most of it synthy background type music. (The Schnell Fenster and Makers tracks appear on their own albums.)
    This song was also released on Other Enz compilation in 2000 or so.

    It's been a long hard road
    And it's a heavy load
    So take a long last look
    Down the long hard road

    Struggling with the weight on my back
    I heared(?) a lot about screeching tyres
    Wasn't for you, I'd pack it all in
    See(?) that getting left was half the fun
    Rolling with the punches and walking through fire
    Wasn't for you, I'd pack it all in
    The journey would be over before it could begin

    Out in the wilderness
    Searching for tenderness
    Looking for something I can't find
    Take a long last look
    Down a long hard road

    When the dream runs wild, it's all I can do
    Nothing is easily understood
    It's a twisting path, a rocky old track
    Mountains and valleys, no turning back
    Wheels go round the engine runs hot
    Driving me on, won't it never stop?

    Out in the wilderness
    Searching for tenderness
    Looking for something I'll never find
    It's been a long hard road
    And it's a heavy load
    So take a long last look
    Down the long hard road
    Down a long hard road!

    Look at all the strange things we do
    Coming from a different point of view

    It's been a long hard road
    And it's a heavy load
    So take a long last look
    Down the long hard road

    (When the dream runs wild, it's all I can do
    Nothing is easily understood
    It's a twisting path, a rocky old track
    Mountains and valleys, no turning back
    Wheels go round the engine runs hot
    Driving me on, won't it never stop?)
     
  19. Paul H

    Paul H The fool on the hill

    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    Oh yeah! Great! A song I know! Terrific!

    Oh yeah... um. 2/5.
     
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  20. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    This song sounds a lot like Schnell Fenster to me. I don't have lineup details, however. It's possible this is one of those "nearly Split Enz" line ups: Finn, Judd, Griggs and Crombie, with Michael Den Elzen.

    It's a decent, hook-laden Phil Judd track that, even with Tim's superior vocals and melody skills manages to have that grating edge that Phil Judd songs (post The Swinger, which is a bona fide pop album) have. The lyric is good, but again when I read it, it makes me worry about old Phil, much like his lyrics worried me in the Split Enz years. He seems to be likening life to a journey, a sort of nightmare which one can't ever wake up from, a runaway car that can't be stopped until it crashes and burns.

    The backing track, with it's pounding, relentless drums and layred, razor sharp guitars underscore the lyric in my opinion. But it's not necessarily pleasant to listen to; but pleasant to listen to is not really what Phil Judd does.

    I like the track; and I think it borders on being a great electro-art-rock track. 3.7/5

    As a side note, the version on the original Big Steal soundtrack is much, much much better sounding than the horribly mastered Other Enz version, which makes the track much more abrasive than it has to be. It's not necessarily easy to come by, though.

    The video shows the return of Tim and Phil's manic/mad characters. Man, is that video funny. From the dorky costumes to the manic, unfocused dancing. It's like they injected crack and turn ed the cameras on.
     
  21. BeSteVenn

    BeSteVenn FOMO Resident

    I really want to like this track, but I just can't. Tim was about to do many great things in the next few years, but this isn't where that phase of his career began. 1.5/5
     
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  22. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    The "Long Hard Road" single (and the The Big Steal soundtrack album) was released in October 1990, the same month as the first Schnell Fenster was released in Europe (a mere two years after it had been released in Australia). Also, the Split Enz albums were released on CD for the first time (except for True Colours and Conflicting Emotions which had been released on CD earlier) and it was announced that Tim had joined Crowded House, with the new album and a world tour to follow in 1991. Ah, it was a very good time to be a fan of the Enz-and-related gang!

    I've always loved this song. It really sounds like a fabulous blend of Schnell Fenster music and Tim's singing and lyrics. It has great energy and I think it's very catchy too. I've never read any article in which Tim or Phil have commented on this song, so I don't know for sure who did what in the writing process. The lyrics, to me, work on many levels. First off, this was a song commissioned for the movie The Big Steal and from what I've read the main character in the movie is a young guy who in order to impress the girl he is in love with feels he needs to have a Jaguar and gets involved in some dodgy (illegal) business. I haven't seen the movie myself but from what I've read about it I think the lyrics relate to the character's experiences. The lyrics also work well being sung by Tim (and Phil, a bit), it's easy to imagine that Tim's and Phil's musical journeys, from the start of Split Ends, through many ups and downs career-wise, has at times felt like a long, hard slog and I guess at times they have felt they've been looking for something they can't find (worldwide success a la The Beatles, for instance), perhaps not always appreciating what they have achieved (a long career with records released all over the world, artistic credibility). And I think everyone - whether they are artists or not - can sometimes feel like that about their life. So, for me, this song gives me an idea of what the movie's main character is like, it makes me ponder Tim's and Phil's musical journeys and I also think the song works very well out of its context. When Tim sings this, I totally believe every word.

    I love both Schnell Fenster albums (and Phil's soundtrack works and his more recent batch of solo albums) and I love Tim's works, and this song is excellent in my opinion. The video clip is fun too.

    Apparently, The Big Steal was both a commercial and critical success in Australia. At the AFI (Australian Film Industry) Awards in 1990, it got nine nominations and won three awards - Phil deservedly won the award for Best Original Music Score.

    I give "Long Hard Road" 5/5.
     
  23. Paul H

    Paul H The fool on the hill

    Location:
    Nottingham, UK
    Sincere commiserations to our NZ friends after the rugby semi. I know how much the All Blacks mean to New Zealanders and I know how gutted you'll be. If it's any consolation, the English feel like this every time we fail at a football World Cup. Watching the haka still gives me goosebumps every time though :cheers:
     
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  24. jimbutsu

    jimbutsu WATCH YÖUR STEPPE

    I really like this - it "cooks" a little more then I expected it to, and I can honestly see coming back to it on purpose.

    4/5
     
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  25. HitAndRun

    HitAndRun Forum Resident

    I think this is a decent song. I like the up-beat style, and the outro in particular works for me. Like others, I think this sounds more Phil Judd than Tim, but it's nostalgic to hear Tim singing with Phil again. Tim's vocals are clear as a bell on this. The lyrics are fine.

    It's not a career standout for either of them, but overall this is good.

    3.7/5
     
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