Stranger than Fiction, Larger Than Life: the Finn Brothers song-by-song discussion thread

Message to My Girl from the Red Bank show:

 

Weather With You from Red Bank:

 

And the last of the three videos I recorded at Red Bank, Sister Madly:

 

Loved those Crowded House posted videos, someone had great seats!! Thanks for sharing.

If we are sharing anyway. Found this in the world wide web:



It's called "A sit down with Tim Finn". 7 minutes of your daily Tim Finn dose right there.

 

Space Waltz!

 

That's a really nice article - and my goodness he is still a handsome fellow isn't he?

I wish I could read that article behind the paywall in The Australian!

 

That is so ridiculous seeing Elroy down the front on the snare with brushes trying to emulate Hessie but failing big time .

Peter Jones and Matt Sherodd had the good sense to never do that but Elroy being in Daddy’s band I guess the rules are different.

It all looks a bit desperate in that they are trying to recreate something that just is not there anymore but then again this Finn Family fun band version of “Crowded House “ is desperate so I guess it fits .

 

Hessie quit. Then he died. Get over it.

 

Curious why you say it's "desperate" - but not to argue. I'm just unsure what you mean.

I guess I consider Neil Finn's body of work to all just be "Neil Finn" at this point - regardless of what he's calling it. He plays songs from Crowded House, Split Enz, Finn Brothers, and his solo material at his solo shows, so going out as "Crowded House," to me is simply telling the audience that only his most popular band's songs will be played. It's like "setlist" is the only real difference between his various bands nowadays. He's been playing with his sons for decades and, if he was touring live as a solo act, I wouldn't be surprised if the band line-up was exactly the same as it is now - apart from, probaby, replacing Nick Seymour.

I've been a HUGE Neil fan since Crowded House's debut album, but only actually saw him/them for the first time on this current tour. They were really great and, apart from age, there was no sense of missing Neil Finn past his prime. Liam played a short solo set as the opening act and totally won the audience over with his surprisingly strong energy, musicianship and songs. I don't think this is the best incarnation of Crowded House, but, as I said, I don't really think of it as Crowded House. In my mind "Crowded House" is just the drawer in which Neil Finn has filed THAT particular pile of songs.

 

Oh really
I did not know any of that .

 

Of course you are entitled to your opinion but I don't really understand your negativity about this incarnation of Crowded House.

Having been at the Minneapolis concert I had zero impression that Elroy was trying to emulate Hessie. I mean, who could?

I think Sister Madly is a song where there is a certain audience expectation and it is well suited to having the band up front. I like seeing all the band members up front - it's actually one of the nicest things about a CH concert - because it reduces the barrier between the audience and the band and makes it feel quite intimate (with thousands of your friends!). Also, I tend to view this as a bit of a living tribute to Hessie. It's almost impossible for me to watch/experience something like this without thinking about Hessie. I think it's a lovely way of keeping him with them.

You seem to be a bit hung up on the idea of nepotism - OK - but if you could move past that, wouldn't you rather hear Crowded House live in concert than not at all? If Neil and Nick want to do it this way, who am I to say that it should be different?

Let's all try to live with a bit more positivity and kindness. The pandemic has shown many of us just how precious those commodities are in daily life.

 

Andy White is doing a gig in London on July 12th.
Andy White plus guests

EDIT: Sorry I knew there was something else in Peter Green's email and just re-read the message. Here is the other bit of important news...

"Neil Finn Book
Music writer Jeff Apter will release a Neil Finn book in August 2023. "Don't Dream It's Over: the Remarkable Life of Neil Finn". I'm sure it will be available online from all the usual places."

 

Ugh. I’ll buy it but I think Jeff Apter is a really nasty writer. (Ive read his horribly inaccurate Finn Brothers book and his Cure book.)

Why arent there other good writers making biographies of people i love?

 

I knew I had heard of the author before (in a negative context) but couldn't put my finger on it...

I'd like to think someone on Team NF would proof it for accuracy (@Jaffaman please tell me this is so...). So fingers crossed.
Mind you it does add to the somewhat eclectic Enz cornucopia we are receiving at the moment...and that is a good thing (even if we are all going to be lighter in the wallet for it).

 

Maybe he went over this thread. There is a lot of information and a lot of things hashed out over this thread, albeit not exactly in a linear naraative. But I'm not sure, having read a couple of his books, if accuracy is his chief motive, to be honest.

I feel like there's no excuse for the glaring inaccuracies that were in the Finn Brothers book and his nasty Tim vs Neil narrative that he forced the book into just sickened me. I just don't think it holds up to scrutiny at all. They are not the Davies brothers.

I'm reading Never Enough The Cure book now, because the official Cure book is long out of print and I don't really know if accurate or not, but there's just a nasty turn of phrase he has that I dislike: like he can't resist taking a shot at his subject matter whenever he can. I mean, he's not a bad writer otherwise: it is very readable.

 

I have both of Jeff Apter's book, Never Enough and Together Alone in PDF form. I kinda agree with Lance on this, both books are kinda bitter, as the real life conflicts are quite heighten in both books. The accuracy in both books are quite scattered.

But to be fair, his books are quite readable and he does have some interview skills, considering that he was able to interview some people who has bad relationships with the subject matters (e.g Malcolm Green)
I think he must have done something right in the Finn world, why else would he have received approval for another book about the Finns?

P/s: @Lance LaSalle, I also have Lol Tolhurst's book. His book gave me another source to double check Mr Apter's book. And the pre-1989 events kinda checks out for me, but Lol wrote it quite diplomatically.

 

These are not authorised biographies. Anybody can write a book about any famous figure.

 

I don't think so. But I have never seen any live vids with Peter Jones or Matt Sherrod playing Sister Madly like that. I know they can play, maybe they just weren't ask to do that?

 

Well, why couldn't anyone in the Finn or Cure camp veto the release? I don't know whether they should sue the author, but that seems kinda like disproportionate retribution for me.

I don't know for sure whether it's unauthorized or not, considering that there are a lot of interviews, especially with the subject matters. Does it still counts as unauthorized or it is now authorised?

 

They simply can't veto it.

Neither Neil nor Tim nor Robert Smith were interviewed in his books. When he quotes them, he is quoting some magazine article or something, someone else's interview. (Although he does conduct his own interviews, of course, with some peripheral figures.)

I suppose that they could try to have a court send a cease and desist order, but having biographies written about you is part of what happens when you are a public figure. They would not succeed.

They would have a case in a lawsuit if the book was outrageously slanderous in a way that damanged their careers, or implied criminal wrongdoing but I wouldn't call the books outrageously slanderous at all: I'm sure the publishing companies make sure nothing like that ever gets out.

They aren't slanderous, they are just told in a certain way to fit a slightly sordid narrative that Apter himself has made up. I don't know.

Maybe I should write my own books.

 

Approval by who? I have a few of his books, and agree with Lance's opinion about Jeff Apter's previous book Together Alone. I doubt very much that Neil, or anyone on Team NF, has given the approval to this new book, but I'd be happy to be proven wrong. The publishing house has probably been happy with the sales of his previous biographies.

Having said that, I do like Jeff Apter's book about George Young, Friday On My Mind - The Life of George Young. (Admittedly, apart from the music, my main sources of knowledge about George Young are other unauthorised books in which he is mentioned a fair bit, i.e. AC/DC biographies) He (Apter) has also published separate books about Malcolm Young and Angus Young, so maybe that means the upcoming Neil book will eventually be followed by an equivalent book about Tim?

 

For what it is worth, here is the page about the upcoming Neil book on Jeff Apter's own web page:

Portfolios

I have to say it disturbs me to see that there is a factual error in the second sentence: "In February 1980, 21-year-old Neil Finn wrote 'I Got You' , which became the signature song and the biggest hit, for the Kiwi band Split Enz, co-founded by Neil's big brother Tim several years earlier." -- True Colours was released in January 1980, so obviously Neil didn't write I Got You in February 1980.

It also seems the book will tell about perceived conflicts in Neil's personal relationships: "Neil has endured his share of challenges. There was massive conflict with his older brother, especially when Tim was briefly invited to join Crowded House in 1990" /... / "...a marriage to wife Sharon that has somehow lasted more than 40 years."

Ugh. Not sure I am so keen to read this book.

 

Yeah. Ugh. There is no reason for me to read it, really. I am interested in reading things about Neil since 2006 but I have already read most interviews available. I doubt that there will be any new light shed that wasnt better done in Something So Strong.

 

As far as unauthorized biographers go, I think that the best is probably Peter Ames Carlin, he is a much better writer than most (kind of a Tom Wolfe wannabe, though) but he mainly focuses on the music, I think and uses that to frame his narrative. He does write with a florid eye for detail and includes a lot of inner dialogue that I suspect comes largely from his imagination, (albeit plausibly) but he only does that to paint the scenes vividly, not to shape the narrative.

 

I would like to read it. I hope someplace other than Booktopia will sell it as they only deliver to Australia and NZ.