"Streaming has killed the mainstream"

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Purple Jim, Dec 28, 2019.

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  1. manco

    manco Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Don't assume everyone in the world cares about music. I know people who couldn't care less. SHF is very much a case of selection bias.
     
  2. Hot Ptah

    Hot Ptah Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    When I was in high school in 1970-74, the shared musical experiences and signposts for most of my 375 classmates were Three Dog Night, the Carpenters, Helen Reddy, and AM hits like “It Never Rains in Southern California,” “Indiana Wants Me,” “Me and You and a Dog Named Boo,”’”Don’t Pull Your Love Out On Me Baby,” “Sooner or Later.” The Rhino Records “Have a Nice Day” series captures the cream of a much larger crop of similar hits known to the mainstream.

    Then there were the eccentric weirdos like me and some others with their oddball music like The Band, Jethro Tull, Jeff Beck, the Vanguard 2 LP set “The Great Blues Men” and other artists and groups that almost no one ever heard of. I even went back and listened to Dylan’s 1960s albums which probably ten people in my class had ever heard.

    There was no shared experience with signposts at my high school of about 1,400 students, except a poor quality mainstream of boring music.

    The supposed golden age of everyone knowing and liking the same stuff never existed.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2019
  3. Musical Chairs

    Musical Chairs Forum Resident

    Seems to me that the breakup of everything into niches predates streaming. Streaming may have accelerated the trend, but it is also a response to what was already going on.

    Ironically, a recognition of the value of niche markets is probably for the time being the best thing for those of us who prefer physical media.

    I type this while I stream World Party's box set on Amazon, some 400 miles away from the CDs I normally play.
     
    Eric_Generic and Hot Ptah like this.
  4. schnitzerphilip

    schnitzerphilip "Modern Dad" Unlocked Award

    Location:
    NJ USA
    It’s been a long 20 years.

    Artists stopped trying to make great albums. Instead they just released some singles and some filler, working with their labels and pacing themselves for maximum revenue.

    At the same time, listeners had more choice than ever, with libraries of thousands of digital files, we got used to making playlists and listening to our music that way, less reliant on the artists vision, more focused, no filler.

    Streaming takes that to a whole new level. Machine learning creates playlists for us, customized for what we like. The majority of listening is now concentrated on Moods. Songs for a rainy day, songs for yoga, songs for a long drive, songs for concentration. The album doesn’t matter. Artists practically don’t matter. When we want to hear Steely Dan it’s far more interesting to ask to hear songs like those from Steely Dan; its a mix of artists that sound similar and therefore are fresher and newer.

    Tempo, tone, instrumentation, meaning, those consistent elements become important. The mood, not the artist. The flow, not the album.

    It’s a whole new experience.
     
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  5. the pope ondine

    the pope ondine Forum Resident

    Location:
    Virginia
    yeah that sounds horrendous.
     
  6. gudnoyez

    gudnoyez Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa
    Streaming has its place, let's say I just listened to Miles Davis Bitches Brew, and I'm I'm in the mood for some more but have listened to most of my physical copies of Miles and yearn for some Miles I don't own but don't have the time to go searching for it finding something new ordering it and waiting for it's arrival? Wait a minute I'm paying for a Tidal subscription and own a streamer it's all good.
     
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  7. Jimmy Agates

    Jimmy Agates CRAZY DOCTOR

    At least it's not another Beatles thread - be thankful...
     
  8. Remote Control Triangle

    Remote Control Triangle Forum Member Rated 6.8 By Pitchfork

    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Good article. Well written. Echoes a lot of my own observations. There are some weird "time-warping" effects from all of the ease and convenience provided by these new tech companies. I still find it bizarre. And yes, I do stream. I can't say that I'm much of a fan though. It's never as satisfying for some unknown reason.
     
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  9. Hot Ptah

    Hot Ptah Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    I stream daily and I do not use streaming for anything like what you have described. I listen to entire albums. Sometimes I am in the mood for a specific song by a specific artist. But I never use streaming for computer chosen mood music.
     
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  10. schnitzerphilip

    schnitzerphilip "Modern Dad" Unlocked Award

    Location:
    NJ USA
    That's the first phase of streaming. Leaning back on the old paradigms, the old rules. Genres lead to Artists lead to Albums lead to Songs. I did that at the beginning too.

    But after awhile, you realize that you've got 45 million songs at your fingertips and you don't know how to get to them and it's an untapped resource. So by asking for "Acoustic Afternoon" or "Peaceful Piano" you are exposed to new music alongside the songs you already have indicated you like. You've got Billy Joel and Elton John as always, but now you've got some new piano men being offered and its amazing that you really like their songs too. It's the magic of streaming. The ease by which discovery happens and how fresh it makes your favorite genres sound.

    Used to be, I would say "Play the album Aja by Steely Dan", was my go-to when I needed to concentrate on a project or just wanted some chill sounds while cooking. Now, I say "Play Deacon Blues by Steely Dan", and when that song starts to play I say "Play more like this" and then I get 3 hours of Steely Danesque music, but from artists like Boz Scaggs, Doobie Brothers, Santana, etc. most of which I am loosely familiar with but whose songs as a group are fresher than just listening to Aja for the umpteenth time.
     
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  11. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    There is no such thing as relaible gatekeepers (unless you reside in the mainstream because the "reliable gatekeeper" define the mainstream)
    A lot of good music has always gone unheard.


    Here we go again & once again this may be correct for what you are listening to but not for me.





    Get out of the mainstream. The good stuff resides on the back roads & on the dirt roads.
     
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  12. schnitzerphilip

    schnitzerphilip "Modern Dad" Unlocked Award

    Location:
    NJ USA
    The Beatles, and other legacy groups, are in trouble on streaming. Too much activity is coming from their greatest hits packages, not the original core albums the majority of the songs originate from. Sinatra is a good example, almost all of his best songs point to greatest hits compilations, no one is going to discover September Of My Years or Only The Lonely and all the great album tracks found within.
     
  13. schnitzerphilip

    schnitzerphilip "Modern Dad" Unlocked Award

    Location:
    NJ USA
    The article talks specifically about the 'mainstream' and that's the place I'm a listener of as well as my wife and 4 kids. I'm telling you, the artists have let us down and we listen to playlists when we want an album-like experience.

    There's nothing wrong in that. It's merely an example of how streaming is different. And, in this case, encourages getting out of the mainstream and into niches. Instead of my daughter listening to the new Ariana Grande album, she's listening to a whole bunch of young female artists making similar sounds, many of them artists she's never heard of before. It's a scary time for Maroon 5 or John Mayer. There are thousands of artists making that kind of lite, acoustic, upbeat, optimistic music and they are fed on mood playlists adjacent to them. Those mainstream artists are losing their monopoly on those types of moods.
     
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  14. Jimmy Agates

    Jimmy Agates CRAZY DOCTOR

    Oh well...they had their day 50 years ago!!
     
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  15. drbryant

    drbryant Senior Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    “Occasionally, your streaming selection will coincide with large numbers of other people – the waning flickers of the monoculture drawing you all to the same spot. But mostly your journeys through the library of sound are solitary and asocial.”

    A couple of years ago I stood in awe as 90,000+, sitting “in the round” at Wembley Stadium, sang Bob Dylan’s “Make You Feel My Love”.

     
    Vinyl_Blues likes this.
  16. Gaslight

    Gaslight ⎧⚍⎫⚑

    Location:
    Northeast USA
    I read the article.

    Maybe it's this way for the article writer. Or the OP and some others there. But not for myself. I've stated this numerous times here, but to say again...it's a tool. You can use it for discovery and keep things under control...or you could fall into the rabbit hole and get lost in it. It's your choice.

    That's internal of course, which the article used as well as examples. As for the lack of a mainstream - I definitely see things fragmenting but I'm not necessarily concerned about it as I didn't care much for the mainstream when I was a teenager either. As long as my musical path stays focused and, so far so good.

    I know the OP, as a counterpoint, has issues with music discovery - this comes up pretty frequently. If he's unfocused I would simply recommend taking small portions. Don't eat the whole pie at once.....plus you'll just get a stomachache.
     
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  17. Gaslight

    Gaslight ⎧⚍⎫⚑

    Location:
    Northeast USA
    Same.

    The length of time using these services I mean...not your concerns on there being too much music / no gatekeepers. I think we're in a golden age of music consumption right now.
     
    schnitzerphilip likes this.
  18. drbryant

    drbryant Senior Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    So what explains a group like BTS, a pop group from Korea, selling out multiple nights in stadiums in LA, NY, London, Paris, São Paulo and Tokyo? How do 50,000+ teenage girls in Wembley Stadium learn enough Korean lyrics to create a massive singalong BEFORE the concert even begins.

    For over fifty years, a foreign language song on the pop charts was a once every 2-3 years novelty. Until the rise of the internet, no radio programmer in the United States would have added a foreign boy band to their heavy rotation, or any band that did not sing in English. The writer may complain about isolation, but the internet, even in 15-second Tik Tok bites, has opened up a world of music - ask anyone under 18.

     
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  19. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Worth repeating. The consumer has never had it so good.
    Not such good times for the artist from an economic point of view.
     
  20. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Maybe the gatekeepers have been getting it wrong for 50+years.
     
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  21. Anarchrist

    Anarchrist Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Downunder
  22. Gaslight

    Gaslight ⎧⚍⎫⚑

    Location:
    Northeast USA
    BTS doesn't count

    (not rock music)
     
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  23. Greenalishi

    Greenalishi Birds Aren’t Real

    Location:
    San Francisco
    Really interesting article. Kind of sums up intuition. Thanks for article.
     
  24. Hot Ptah

    Hot Ptah Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    I think the following idea could be just as valid as the article we are discussing.

    I believe that in the 1960s and 1970s, a great many people did not really like the common mainstream music which they had access to. They found the mainstream kind of boring and longed for more. They had limited opportunities to explore music more adventurous and unique than Top 40 hits radio. Maybe they visited someone with a great LP collection once in a while. Maybe they infrequently traveled to a college town or larger city and found the music variety on the FM radio stations to be a real treat.

    But these frustrated music lovers of the 1960s and 1970s were never able to explore the niche music, album music and more adventurous music they found interesting in small exposures. They could not fit buying a lot of LPs into their budget. Their significant other had no interest in music and pressured them not to spend money on albums. They did not have good record stores where they lived. They did not know how to easily find out about which albums would be good to buy.

    So they gave up, listened to the Top 40 radio with minimal interest, and became part of the population for whom music is not important.

    Now people like that can stream and explore. The solid wall of common mainstream taste is crumbling! But it was never truly solid to begin with.
     
    Rob C, rischa, BeatleJWOL and 6 others like this.
  25. Spencer R

    Spencer R Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oxford, MS
    And back when there were reliable gatekeepers, brilliant artists ranging from Judee Sill to Big Star to Nick Drake and on and on and on weren’t let in the gate.
     
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