P3-XD is amp independent, if I repeat this with my own experiences. So, maybe you would not 'gain' anything with any Sugden, side note, my 'cheap' Sugden A21 S drives pleasantly P3s.
I think P3s always sound good, but in my experience the amp definitely changes the overall sound. With the a21se, the midrange punch is much more present than, say, with a Yamaha 801.
Balanced components is something to search for ... I might have only good amps ...lucky me, tubes base and SS ...
Yes but the Dartzeel copies are both high resolution and very organic/easy to listen to.And about 5% of the cost of the real thing!
I ran the A21 (not the SE) and yeah, it really does that. I had a Bryston B60 with 3x the power of the Sugden but it sounded puny compared to the A21, which produced a lot more body and weight and was more pleasing to listen to overall. But you have to consider the speakers. The A21 could not drive every speaker that I tried it with. It succeeded with about half the speakers I used; the other half it simply didn't have enough power to drive properly. I sold the Sugden a while ago so I never did try it with my P3's. I think @Art K tried the combination of Sugden with the P3ESR and did not like it because there was too much energy in the midrange and it got fatiguing. I decided to move to the Unison Unico Nuovo from Sugden because of the extra power and ability to run different speakers (plus the hybrid design is cool because it gives you the option to do some tube rolling). It didn't feel like I was giving up much in terms of what the Sugden did well but the Unison excelled in other areas, the most notable being imaging. I would not hesitate to buy a Sugden again, but it ultimately depends on what speakers I end up with. The P3 sounds really great, but I think I'd like something larger in the long run.
Totally. But that's really true about every amp. Some people love the A-S1200 with the Model KLH 5s. I can only take that match in small portions. The high frequencies just get to be too much. This is actually why I started looking at the Sugden again--I'm curious if it will tame the KLH 5s. I loved the a21se with the P3s instantly. The mids just popped. Holographic, energetic, musical. With the IA-4, I was more aware of the upper mids, which was still nice, but for me less enticing.
That is fair enough. Generally I do not like copies either but in the case of older designs on which the patent has expired I do not see a problem.I have used an Usher R1.5 for years and that was a copy of a Nelson Pass Threshold design.Nelson Pass has commented on those amps and said that anybody is free to use that design because the patent has expired and that if anything the Usher build quality is better than the originals. Also I reckon companies like Dartzeel and some of the other super high end Swiss makers that are marketing to the wealthy one percent and trying to create an elitist product by outrageous pricing are fair game.And they are operating out of a rogue country that generates wealth through money laundering,tax evasion and other ways of hiding ill -gotten wealth from that same wealthy one percent.
How much is the replica? Btw, I'd add that if I made my audio choices based on the politics and history of the country of origin, I'd probably be limited to singing in the shower.
Around US $1000 including delivery for the Weiliang/Breeze Audio version with the four large Sprague caps.Which is what I have.
Has anyone compared the Sugdens to Primaluna integrated amps? I don't have the option of auditioning the latter in person, unfortunately.
Basically, right now I'm trying to decide whether to get a Sugden to warm up the KLH 5, an Evo 300 to mellow them out, or Harbeth C7 to ensure a warm presentation in general.
from the Audio Note guy! Man, I hope to own some audio note gear one day, but the shiny black, the awful gold knobs and a font that have gotten me kicked out of graphic design school…not a fan. The insides however! I’m with you on the Dagostino, though I can appreciate it as a finely made object.
I love the Dagostino Black/Copper Amps...not the Silver. I agree the AN amps look like crap. For that kind of money they should resemble something like Shindo. Nobody's coming over to your house and seeing an AN amp and going WOW. They think its just another cable TV box!!
I decided on Harbeth c7s instead. I'll get one of the Sugden another time. Thanks, everyone, for your input.
They have a sweetness and richness in the midrange that you normally associate with tube amps operating as triodes.Very refined silky treble like high end Japanese SS amps [Accuphase].Bass is a bit less damped than typical SS amps-slightly more tube amp like.Which is what you would expect from a medium output impedance /medium damping factor amp.So they are best used with genuine 8 ohm speakers rather than 4.They have excellent deep 3D imaging. They do not sound much good without a good active preamp -sort of lifeless and lacking dynamics.They work really well with my Supratek preamp. They will make the vast majority of mid priced stuff sound crude by comparison but might be a bit subtle for some people.They are more about music than sonic fireworks and almost the antithesis of "hi fi" sounding.
A couple of days and three weeks to decide . I hope that these nice sounding components will enchant you for a good while. IA-4 + C7 must match quite well. Happy listening . Even if my pair of C7ES3-XD doesn't "beat" my pair of P3, I do enjoy music with them a lot. With my C7, Lavardin ISx ref or Jadis Orchestra amp shares the Harbeth with Monitor Audio alternatively.
I went with the c7s over the 30s primarily because I think the 30s do a lot of what the P3s do, whereas the c7s are sufficiently different to bring noticable variety to my chains. The a21se and c7 didn't match as well as the IA-4 to my ears. I think with the P3s and 30s I might prefer the a21se, though. I'm really curious to hear the Sugden with the KLH 5s.
The wait for a Sugden is 4 months. So, I'm rethinking the whole thing. Has anyone here compared Sugden to Marantz?
Have a mediocre amplifier now or wait 4 months for an amplifier worth waiting for. 4 months? I wish I could get Audio Note amplifiers that fast!
