Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries

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  1. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    The Seeds Of Love [4CD/Blu-ray Box Set]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Additional personnel
    Production
    • Producers – Tears for Fears and David Bascombe
    • Engineer – David Bascombe
    • Additional engineer – Steve Chase
    • Assistant engineers – Heidi Canova and Lee Curle
    • Mixing – Bob Clearmountain (tracks 1 and 7), David Bascombe (tracks 2–6 and 8).
    • Art direction and photography – David Scheinmann
    • Oleta Adams' photo – Jeff Katz
    • Design – Stylorouge
    CD 1 – ORIGINAL ALBUM
    NEW REMASTER BY ANDREW WALTER AT ABBEY ROAD
    01. Woman In Chains: 6:31
    02. Badman’s Song: 8:32
    03. Sowing The Seeds Of Love: 6:19
    04. Advice For The Young At Heart: 4:50
    05. Standing On The Corner Of The Third World: 5:33
    06. Swords And Knives: 6:12
    07. Year Of The Knife: 7:08
    08. Famous Last Words: 4:26

    CD 2 – THE SUN
    45’s AND B-SIDES
    01. Sowing The Seeds Of Love – 7" Version: 5:43
    02. Tears Roll Down: 3:16
    03. Woman In Chains – 7” Version: 5:28
    04. Always In The Past: 4:38
    05. My Life In The Suicide Ranks: 4:32
    06. Woman In Chains – Instrumental: 6:30
    07. Advice For The Young At Heart – 7” Version: 4:49
    08. Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams Instrumental: 4:18
    09. Music For Tables: 3:32
    10. Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams Mix One: 6:22
    11. Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams Mix Two: 5:55
    12. Sowing The Seeds Of Love – US Radio Edit: 4:04
    13. Woman In Chains – US Radio Edit 1: 4:42
    14. Advice For The Young At Heart – Italian Radio Edit: 3:40
    15. Year Of The Knife – Canadian Single Version: 5:40
    16. Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams: 4:17

    CD 3 – THE MOON
    RADIO EDITS AND EARLY MIXES
    01. Year Of The Knife – Overture: 1:47
    02. Year Of The Knife – Early Mix – Instrumental: 8:50
    03. Sowing The Seeds Of Love – Alternate Mix: 7:22
    04. Tears Roll Down – Alternate Mix: 4:07
    05. Year Of The Knife – Steve Chase 7″ Remix: 4.29
    06. Badman’s Song – Early Mix: 7:56
    07. Advice For The Young At Heart – Instrumental: 4:56
    08. Year Of The Knife – The Mix: 06:55
    09. Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams – Mix One Edit: 3:43
    10. Sowing The Seeds Of Love – Early Mix – Instrumental: 6:40
    11. Woman In Chains – US Radio Edit 2: 4:19
    12. Year Of The Knife – Canadian Single Version – Instrumental: 5:40
    13. Famous Last Words – French Radio Edit: 3:07
    14. Woman In Chains – Reprise: 6:39

    CD 4 – THE WIND
    DEMOS, DIVERSIONS AND JAMS
    01. Rhythm Of Life – Demo: 5:12
    02. Advice For The Young At Heart – Demo: 4:52
    03. Swords And Knives – Demo: 3:51
    04. Famous Last Words – Demo: 4:12
    05. Sowing The Seeds Of Love – Demo – Instrumental: 6:06
    06. Badman’s Song – Langer / Winstanley Version – Instrumental: 7:30
    07. Woman In Chains – Townhouse Jam: 7:06
    08. Broken – Townhouse Jam: 1:37 Tears For Fears
    09. Rhythm Of Life – Townhouse Jam: 3:09
    10. Badman’s Song – Townhouse Jam: 8:17
    11. Badman’s Song – Reprise – Townhouse Jam: 2:50
    12. Standing On The Corner Of The Third World – Townhouse Jam: 9:09

    BLU RAY – THE RAIN
    STEVEN WILSON 5.1 MIX, ORIGINAL ALBUM MIX & NEW REMASTER
    Steven Wilson 5.1 MIX
    01. Woman In Chains: 6:30
    02. Badman’s Song: 8:32
    03. Sowing The Seeds Of Love: 6:19
    04. Advice For The Young At Heart: 4:55
    05. Standing On The Corner Of The Third World: 5:33
    06. Swords And Knives: 6:20
    07. Year Of The Knife: 6:55
    08. Famous Last Words: 4:11

    Original Album Mix (Bob Ludwig 1989 mastering)
    01. Woman In Chains: 6:31 (Original album master)
    02. Badman’s Song: 8:32 (Original album master)
    03. Sowing The Seeds Of Love: 6:19 (Original album master)
    04. Advice For The Young At Heart: 4:50 (Original album master)
    05. Standing On The Corner Of The Third World: 5:33 (Original album master)
    06. Swords And Knives: 6:12 (Original album master)
    07. Year Of The Knife: 7:08 (Original album master)
    08. Famous Last Words: 4:26 (Original album master)

    New remaster (by Andrew Walter at Abbey Road)
    01. Woman In Chains: 6:30 (New remaster)
    02. Badman’s Song: 8:32 (New remaster)
    03. Sowing The Seeds Of Love: 6:19 (New remaster)
    04. Advice For The Young At Heart: 4:55 (New remaster)
    05. Standing On The Corner Of The Third World: 5:33 (New remaster)
    06. Swords And Knives: 6:20 (New remaster)
    07. Year Of The Knife: 6:55 (New remaster)
    08. Famous Last Words: 4:11 (New remaster)
    -------------------------------------------------------------------
    We have looked at Song From the Big Chair, and unfortunately that's all the guys have for us so far. For me personally, it is really disappointing that The Hurting didn't get a 5.1 mix when it was reissued as a deluxe release, but I suppose that they didn't have the tapes.... a really young band, at a really busy point in musical history, debut album etc etc .... it is very possible that the tapes were never kept. I guess it is very possible that they were so happy to even be recording that anything to do with tapes and such could have been the last thing on their mind.... but anyway. It is disappointing for me, because it is easily my favourite thing the band did.
    Songs From The Big Chair was an enormous album for them and shot their musical star into the stratosphere, with one of the biggest albums of the 85/86 period. To some extent Seed Of Love was delayed by the success of Chair, and some bouts of perfectionism, mixed with a lot of other issues ...

    "As a band, we came from the programmed pop era of the early '80s and we had inherited a sense of structure that permeated almost all our music. The way we were working was becoming too sterile. We wanted to do something more colourful, something that sounded big and warm. You cannot get that from machines. You only get that with real musicians and real players."
    — Curt Smith

    The Whole process for this album began in 1986, and stretched its way across to 1989. The recording process started at the beginning of 1988, and lasted until halfway through 1989, and the album finally came out in September of 1989. Certainly there have been albums that have taken longer. The original album idea was started in 1986, with recording taking place with Clive Langer and Alan Winstanley (no relation, to the best of my knowledge) who both had good success in the eighties and nineties (most of the Madness albums, Hothouse Flowers, They Might Be Giants - Flood, Lloyd Cole And the Commotions, Morrissey) but the guys weren't happy with the way the album was going and scrapped all the tapes and started again.
    The song Seeds of Love was written in 1987, and the band had another go at putting the album together, but there was some contention starting and some long time member of the band left due to "creative differences" and the second attempt to make the album was also left ....
    I reckon there is a good chance that the success of the first two albums, and particularly Chair, probably left the fairly young men a little nervous that the follow up had to be something ultra special, so as there was no "Chair II" thoughts about it, and so that they would sell another large amount of albums. This is completely understandable, but sometimes in music you just need to put it out there, and allow yourself to be who you are, without the fear of the outside responses .... because they are unpredictable anyway.

    When Seeds was released there were many and varied opinions, and some of those opinions were likely based on how long it had taken to actually do this album. Everyone is a critic, and any sign of weakness or fear is always going to be jumped on. The responses spread the range of an astonishing piece of work and underdeveloped songs with overwrought lyrics. There was, I remember, also some "another English band tries to Pepper" kind of reviews/comments.

    I myself didn't mind the single, but at that stage I hadn't even bought Chair, so I never really did get around to Seeds. By 1989, I was seriously trying to launch a career for myself and gigging, but I was listening to all sorts of music that really wasn't very related to eighties pop music. I didn't hate it, I had just become bored with the sounds and the somewhat corporate neutering that had so much chart music sounding the same.
    Looking back years later, I enjoy a lot of the material that came out, I mean every year that I am very familiar with from about 1955 to current day, there are a plethora of great albums, in fact too many for me to even have heard, and certainly more than I could afford to own, but the late eighties was a somewhat lesser period for me, and so I was exploring other avenues.

    I say all that because when this arrived the other day I had never heard the album before at all. I had heard the single back in the day, and I thought it was pretty good, but it didn't interest me enough to go and buy the album.
    I have listened to the album a couple of times since then, and it is difficult to really feel I have had a chance for it to sink in, or become familiar. It sounds pretty decent, but this far down the line, it hasn't blown my mind or anything ... so that is a sort of contextual reference for where I am at with this album. My listens were also during the course of my day, so I may well have just not gotten inside the album, and perhaps this morning I will.
    I am looking forward to giving this a listen, because really, the huge layered production should really suit the 5.1 format, and even if the album isn't something I absolutely love, it should sound really very good.

    Anyway, sorry for the waffle, I just wanted to give some kind of context for the album, and where I am with it....

    Super Deluxe Edition has it for 50 pounds https://www.superdeluxeedition.com/news/tears-for-fears-the-seeds-of-love-reissue-coming-in-october/
    Amazon has it for about $59 https://www.amazon.com/Seeds-Love-4CD-Blu-ray-Box/dp/B089HXV7PQ
    Burning Shed has it for about 48 pounds The Seeds Of Love (Deluxe)

    Again this is a brand new release, so there are copies of this all over the place.

    5.1 Mix Steven Wilson

    It is nice to see Steven Wilson stepping out with things like Tears For Fears and Ultravox, and hopefully we can get some more diversity available in 5.1 ... the diversity is good, but if the big 5.1 mixers can get themselves doing some good work in wider fields, perhaps the bubbling under thing that is going on, can actually become the next big thing, as it should have been twenty years ago......

    The two 5.1 choices are dts hd master audio, and pcm 24/48. I'm going to go with the pcm.

    Woman In Chains
    Sound wise we instantly have a very broad spectrum. Nice sub assist, nice bright clean highs. This sounds really very good instantly. Very nice production.
    Bass, drums up front.
    Percussion either side in the rears.
    A synth comes on on the left side.
    Bvox either side in the rears.
    A guitar in either side.
    A nice feedback guitar kind of floats across the middle of the room.
    The coda to this song is really very good.
    The mix is very good and balanced. Nothing fancy, just a solid base, with some nice subtle mixing, that works from an immersion, and general listening perspective.

    Bad Man's Song
    We open with some faux-jazz drums and piano, and it is really very good.
    Then we bounce into a sort of pop-blues.
    Again nice sound.
    The drums seem unusual, but not bad. It seems like the kick is front left, and the snare is right rear, with the cymbals. It doesn't sound bad at all, it's just an interesting set up.
    This track has almost a wall of sound type production, and there is a lot of stuff going on all over the place.
    I think I am distracted by the snare, because it doesn't seem to always in the same place.....
    We have horns or horn samples in the side, organ, bvox etc.
    Very immersive, and very dense mix.
    Sorry but that's a really busy song, and hard to break down.

    Sowing The Seeds Of Love
    We get a kind of swirl intro, with some reverse reverb sounding drums in the rears.
    Keys left.
    Gtr right.
    A very dense chorus, that really does immerse the listener.
    Strings or mellotron left rear.
    Keys in the right rear.
    We have a thick layering of stuff in the bridge type section. We have an organ across the back. The horn was up front I think. Again this is a really dense production with an awful lot of bits and pieces.
    I have to admit I'm struggling to break this down satisfactorily.
    But I will say it is very immersive, balanced and engaging.
    I can hear the Beatles comparisons in this track. A bit of Walrus, a touch of All You need is love, and a dash of Penny Lane.

    Advice for The Young at Heart
    Percussive accents in the rears.
    Like a musical sustain all round.
    There are quite a few edited cymbal hits, that are sort of cut off, in the right rear.
    Tight backing vocal in the rears.
    The drums on here have been mixed in a very interesting way, and with the percussion it seems there are drums in all sorts of interesting spots.
    Either synths or strings in the sides.
    The density of this album, or my short comings are making this hard this morning.
    But this does sound very good, and is certainly immersive, and balanced.

    Standing On The Corner Of The Third World
    Keys left side.
    Chimes run across the back.
    Percussion front left.
    Little flickers of different instruments in various spots.
    The song mellows and we get percussion right rear.
    Piano flourish left rear, goes across the back.
    This is really a huge production of an album
    There are just so many little inserts that it is really difficult to relate because the elements keep changing.
    It is an enjoyable listen, and really well mixed, but the production is so dense, and changing that once you pinpoint a specific it is gone and something else appears somewhere else. My typing in general isn't that fast, and on the phone even less do lol.
    Anyway this is certainly an entertaining listen and an excellent mix. The fade has harmonicas alternating sides.....

    Swords And Knives
    Keys up front.
    Piano left.
    A more sparse opening, that gradually builds.
    We end up with percussion all round us again. String or synth strings .
    Gtrs are coming in from different spots. There is a specific guitar on the tight side.
    Various things all over the place.
    For some reason this morning, that's about as specific as I seem to be able to be.
    Again a nice immersive mix, that is balanced and interesting.

    Year Of The Knife
    We open with a Genesis style drum machine percussion front left. Crowd noise all round, and then the song kicks in.
    Lead guitar left side. Chords right side.
    Organ left side.
    Bvox in the rears.
    Effects all round in a collage style breakdown.
    Drones and strings effects all round.
    Guitar riff right side.
    This is a very high energy, extremely dense track.
    Again very immersive and balanced.

    Famous Last Words
    We get a pad and a piano, and some sfx.
    A mellow vocal up front.
    Unusual synth effect left rear.
    Pad strings in both rears, in fact sort of all round.
    Then we get the obligatory punch in.
    We get a nice dynamic drop, after a fairly intense wall of sound.

    Ok, firstly. If this is an album you love, I have no doubt that you will love the surround mix. The mix is kind of as intense as the music it shares.
    I must apologise for being unable to acceptably translate what I was hearing. I was sort of overwhelmed by how dense this album is. I think I read someone somewhere on this thread, or the dedicated Deeds thread, say that they spent so long doing this that it just got tinkered with so much over the years that it just got bigger and bigger, and more dense, or something along those lines.... and i can see that. There is so much going on, that examining it sort of defeats the purpose ... and seems quite impossible anyway.
    When I was listening to the stereo version during the week, it really didn't seem that dense, but I was just letting the songs wash over me, to try and absorb the feel of the album, and the album definitely has a feel. This album makes Bob Ezrin and Jim Steinman productions seem minimalist lol.

    This is an interesting mix by Wilson, because in parts it almost seems like he spread the drum kit all over the soundfield, and not necessarily in any kind of traditional way ... and it doesn't sound bad at all, it was just really hard to pinpoint exactly what was going on with it. Generally I can say "ok the drums are up the front, and they have good width and the toms may be in the sides and cymbals in the rears and such. Here we have a scenario where from what I could hear while trying to digest everything else, we have scenarios where the kick is in on channel and the snare is in the direct opposite channel and the cymbals are somewhere else, and then there are natural and electronic percussion sounds spread amongst that also.... it sounds very good, and it does sound balanced, but in the context of what I attempt to do here, it was just very difficult to share what exactly was going on.
    Then we have walls and walls of synths and guitars and strings, and other instruments all over the place, and in a constant state of flux in terms of where they come into the music and where they are in the soundfield. It was an intense listen, and I just couldn't find a way to share what was going on.... If someone else is mare able to do so, please do for the folks here.

    The album itself. As I say, it is very new to me, and I certainly don't dislike it, it is quite interesting, but it is quite grandiose, and a little over the top, and with everything being built around a big building and building track, it kind of feels a little sort of one paced.... but that isn't necessarily a criticism in the way it might sound, it is merely a sort of first impression of the way they have constructed the songs, and how overall it feels from my perspective as a newbie to it. I'm not trying to annoy the folks that love this, because as I say it is certainly not a bad album... it just may perhaps be a little overwhelming. I also can't discount the fact, that this kind of listen isn't a regular kind of listen, because essentially one is trying to break down the album track by track, and instrument by instrument to make sure that folks looking for surround are getting it, and so much focus was spent by me on trying to discern what was going on in the mix, that the album, and songs, almost seem like an afterthought.

    So again, my apologies, I feel like I did a terrible job of that.

    As I said at the start, I am certain anyone that is familiar with, and likes this album, is probably going to love this. I think anyone that is unsure, will certainly be entertained by the mix. It is certainly immersive and interesting. I get the impression that this album is one where you may well hear something different every time you put it on. the density just leaves you with so much to hear that you almost can't take it all in at once. so this may well be one of those album and mixes that really pays dividends over the long haul.

    I'm not really sure what else to say, and I am sorry for waffling so much, I am just trying to share my thoughts in a way that makes some sort of sense . lol

    A very interesting album, with a very good mix, but I am not sure if I personally like it or not at this stage.
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3501
    duneman, JulesRules, ti-triodes and 12 others like this.
  2. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Free Hand
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    [​IMG]
    Studio album by
    Gentle Giant
    Released     22 August 1975
    Recorded April 1975
    Studio Advision, London
    Genre Progressive rock jazz rock
    Length 36:50
    Label Chrysalis (UK)
    Producer Gentle Giant

    Free Hand is the seventh album by British progressive rock band Gentle Giant. It was released in 1975.

    It was the Gentle Giant's first album with their new label Chrysalis Records in the UK. It is noted for its high production values, and for a less dissonant, more accessible feel than their previous album The Power and the Glory. It was their highest-charting album in the US and the only one to reach the Top 50 on the Billboard Album Chart.[citation needed]

    In addition to the usual stereo version the album was also mixed in 4-channel quadraphonic sound in 1976. The 4-channel mix was not used until 2012 when it finally appeared on DVD with encoding in multichannel LPCM, DTS and Dolby Digital surround sound formats.[1]

    A 1990 CD re-issue in the US by One Way Records used an alternate stereo mix. This version revealed some different details in the musical and vocal parts. However, this edition may have actually been a reduction or variation of the 4-channel mix.

    Alucard/EMI re-released the CD in 2009, "from the original 1/4-inch tapes through 24bit 96k Hi-Resolution transfer."
    Additional Personnel
    CD-1 Just The Same 5:34
    CD-2 On Reflection 5:43
    CD-3 Free Hand 6:13
    CD-4 Time To Kill 5:08
    CD-5 His Last Voyage 6:27
    CD-6 Talybont 2:42
    CD-7 Mobile 5:00

    DVD-1 Just The Same 5:33
    DVD-2 On Reflection 5:42
    DVD-3 Free Hand 6:15
    DVD-4 Time To Kill 5:09
    DVD-5 His Last Voyage 6:26
    DVD-6 Talybont 2:43
    DVD-7 Mobile 5:00
    -------------------------------------------
    So far we have done Three Piece Suite, Power and the Glory and Interview.

    With the likely soon coming Wilson 5.1 of this album, I thought it may be nice to have a quick listen to this one. I'm a bit tired today, and Seeds was quite overwhelming, so I'm not sure if it is a good decision or not, but anyhow.

    I discovered these guys in the last 8-10 years, and luckily for me, just after I discovered them they started releasing 5.1 albums. There were some tapes missing and such, but apparently many have been found now, and we can look forward to Free hand, Interview and Missing Link in the hopefully, not too distant future. also, I really hope the debut album gets a standalone release. The box looked awesome ,but I have all the albums, bootleg shows don't interest me, and 200+ for an album I have part of in surround already, just seemed to be a little much from my perspective.
    I love these guys, but they are the type of band that takes a couple of listens to tube in to their frequency, but once you have they are just wonderful.
    Sadly we may never get In a Glass House due to lost tapes. It seems the Acquiring the taste and three Friends only have the tracks available on Three Piece Suite, So I really look forward to the three albums we are going to get, and hope that the others get found at some point.

    Anyway.
    I have read that there is debate over whether certain channels in this mix are incorrect, and I can't remember exactly what the scenario was, but I love this album, and although the mix could be greatly improved upon, I have enjoyed this when I have listened to it.

    Original Quadrophonic mix - Gentle Giant
    Remastered by Fred Kevorkian

    For the longest time this was completely unavailable, and I paid about a hundred bucks for it when it appeared ... yea, I know, I'm an idiot....
    Discogs currently has 4 copies available starting at about $46 Gentle Giant - Free Hand
    and I assume they are people cutting their losses while waiting for the Wilson mix to surface.

    The audio tracks here are dts 96/24 quad, ace quad, 96/24 lpcm stereo of the original analogue master.

    Just The Same
    Finger snaps right rear and front alternating.
    Piano front.
    Gtr right rear.
    Synth pad washes left side and rear.
    Drums up front.
    Bass up front.
    Synth lead across the front, with a little movement.
    In the change handclaps and guitar front with feeds.
    Vocal up front.
    With the syncopated nature of the arrangement, it really makes this rhythmically very interesting in surround.
    Nice mix and enjoyable, but left rear is not doing much in a bit of the song.

    On Reflection
    The layered vocals come from different angles and work together really well.
    Tuned percussion right rear and front.
    This is a remarkable track. The arrangement is quite amazing.
    After the opening piece of wonder we get Kerry Minnear singing a loping mellow ballad.
    The vocal is interestingly placed, front but sort of middle of the room.
    We have flute left side. Violin front left. Tuned percussion right rear.
    There are various really interesting interactions around the sound field here and it works really well.
    Then we get another interesting breakdown, that leads to an instrumental section.
    It is somewhat like a round with the different instruments playing variations on a melodic theme and the surround effect it really very good.
    Great track, very good mix.

    Free Hand
    The intro has interesting arpeggios surrounding us in all channels. They are playing with and against us on a very interesting fashion.
    Then we burst into a sort of GG rock track.
    Keys left side.
    Gtr right side and front.
    Drums front.
    We get a variation on the opening section, and again intertwining arpeggios surround us.
    Then we move into a sort of waltz.
    This track is wonderful and crazy at the same time.
    This mix is very good, but not remarkable.
    The track itself is wonderful.

    Time To Kill
    Unusual percussion sounds up front.
    Then a punch in.
    Keys, bvox left side
    Gtr right side.
    Then on the change bvox all round.
    Cymbals on the side.
    Drums on certain point are in the middle of the room for accent purposes.
    There's a lot going on here musically and mix-wise, and it works really pretty well.

    His Last Voyage
    Bass front left.
    Tuned percussion in various locations.
    Guitar left side and right side
    Vocal front.
    Nice mix. Again not amazing, but good.

    Talybont
    This is like a medieval dance.
    Percussion all round and the layering of instruments is very cool... almost Steeleye Span-like.
    Flutes/recorders guitars and keys all. round.
    This is an excellent mix, and is a really joyful, and different piece of music.

    Mobile.
    Another folk style intro.
    Violins in the rears and acoustic up front.
    Then we burst into a rock style variation.
    Drums front.
    Keys front and left side.
    Guitars right side, and left side.
    Some really interesting stuff here too.
    We get a break down with violins and guitars playing nice counterpoint melodies and then the keys adding another layer.
    This is another good mix, and certainly entertaining.

    This isn't the greatest mix ever, but it is interesting. It is sort of based in a modern type mix with the drums and bass predominantly up the front. There are some nice sections and some excellent sections, and then there are some that are ok, but not quite right. What this listen told me essentially, is that if Wilson is on his game the 5.1 mix of this could be quite incredible, because the way the music is written and arranged, really lends itself to some great surround mixing.
    As I said up there somewhere, with all the counterpoint rhythms and melodies, it is quite brilliant when it works on here.
    At the moment I wouldn't recommend getting this, because the 5.1 should be out soon, and if they follow the same layout as previous releases, I assume that the quad mix will be included.
    But I do love this album.
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3502
    ti-triodes, weekendtoy, jeffreybh and 1 other person like this.
  3. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Reference to the albums

    Aerosmith - Toys In The Attic
    Alice Cooper - Welcome To My Nightmare
    Alan Parsons Project - Tales Of Mystery and Imagination
    Alan Parsons Project - Eye In The Sky
    Alan Parsons Project - Ammonia Avenue
    Alison Krauss and Union Station - New Favourite
    Allman Brothers Band - Idlewild South
    Allman Brothers Band - Live At Fillmore East
    Allman Brother Band - Eat a Peach thanks @Galactus2
    Anathema - We're Here Because We're Here thanks @riskylogic
    Anathema - Weather Systems thanks @riskylogic
    Anathema - Distant Satellites thanks @riskylogic
    Anderson, Ian - Homo Erraticus
    Anderson, Ian - TAAB 2
    Argent - In Deep thanks @riskylogic
    Ayreon - The Source thanks @riskylogic
    Ayreon - Transitus thanks @riskylogic

    Band - Music From Big Pink ... I did this twice ... must occasionally sleep lol
    Barclay James Harvest - GoneTo Earth
    Bass Communion - Loss thanks @riskylogic
    Beach Boys - Sunflower
    Beach Boys - Surf's Up
    The Beatles - The Beatles (White Album)
    The Beatles - Sergeant Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band
    The Beatles - Abbey Road
    The Beatles - Love
    Be Bop Deluxe - Futurama
    Be Bop Deluxe - Sunburst Finish
    Beck, Jeff (group) - Rough and Ready
    Beck, Jeff (Group) - Orange
    Beck, Jeff - Blow By Blow
    Beck, Jeff - Wired
    Beethoven - 3rd Symphony Eroica
    Beethoven - 5th Concerto (Emporer) - Barenboim/Rubenstein
    Birdsong At Morning - A Slight Departure thanks @risky logic
    Bjork - Vespertine
    Bjork - Medulla
    Blackfield - IV thanks @riskylogic
    Blackfield - V thanks @riskylogic
    Black Sabbath - Paranoid
    Blood Sweat and Tears - Blood Sweat And Tears
    Blood Sweat and Tears - Mirror Image/New City thanks @riskylogic
    Blue Oyster Cult - Secret Treaties
    Blue Oyster Cult - Agents Of Fortune
    Bowie, David - The Rise And Fall Of Ziggy Stardust And The Spiders From Mars
    Bowie, David - Young Americans
    Bowie, David - Station To Station
    Bowie, David - Stage
    Browne, Jackson - Running On Empty
    Bruce- Jack - Shadows In The Air thanks @riskylogic
    Bruford - Feels Good To Me thanks @riskylogic
    Buddy Miles Express - Booger Bear thanks @riskylogic

    Caravan - In The Land Of Grey And Pink thanks @riskylogic
    Charles, Ray - Ray Sings, Basie Swings
    Church - Forget Yourself
    Clapton, Eric - Give Me Strength The 74/75 Recordings
    Clapton, Eric - Slowhand
    Clapton, Eric - Reptile
    Clapton, Eric - Back Home
    Cobham, Billy - Spectrum
    Cobham, Billy - Spectrum (Quad) thanks @-dave--wave-
    Coltrane, Alice/Santana, Carlos - Illuminations
    Crosby, David - If Only I Could Remember My Name
    Crowded House

    Davis, Miles - Sketches Of Spain
    Davis, Miles - In A Silent Way
    Davis, Miles - Bitches Brew
    Davis, Miles - Live Evil
    Davis, Miles - Tutu
    Deep Purple - Machine Head
    Deep Purple - Stormbringer
    Dekker, Desmond - Anthology thanks @riskylogic
    Depeche Mode - Some Great Reward
    Depeche Mode - Black Celebration
    Depeche Mode - Violator
    Depeche Mode - Delta Machine
    Derek and the Dominos - Layla and other assorted love songs
    Derringer, Rick - All American Boy and Spring Fever thanks @riskylogic
    Dire Straits - Brothers In Arms
    Donovan - Fairytale
    Doobie Brothers - Toulouse Street quadio
    Doobie Brothers - The Captain And Me
    Doobie Brothers - What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits quadio
    Doors - Strange Days
    Doors - Waiting For The Sun
    Doors - The Soft Parade
    Doors - LA Woman
    Doors - Best Of thanks @riskylogic
    Drake, Nick - A Treasury
    Dream Theater - Distance Over Time
    Dubliners - Definitive Transatlantic Collection
    Dukes Of Stratosphear - Psurroundabout Ride
    Dylan, Bob - Blonde On Blonde
    Dylan, Bob - Slow Train Coming

    Eagles - Hotel California
    Earth Wind And Fire - Way Of The World/Spirit thanks @riskylogic
    ELO - debut album
    Emerson Lake And Palmer - Tarkus
    Emerson Lake And Palmer - Brain Salad Surgery

    Fagen, Donald - The Nightfly
    Fahl, Mary - From The Dark Side Of The Moon thanks @riskylogic
    Ferry, Bryan - Boys and Girls
    Flaming Lips - At War With The Mystics thanks @riskylogic
    Flaming Lips - Yoshimi Battles the Pink Robots
    Fleetwood Mac - Fleetwood Mac (1975)
    Fleetwood Mac - Rumours
    Fleetwood Mac - Mirage
    Foreigner - Foreigner
    Foundations - Very Best Of
    Franklin, Aretha - best of

    Gabriel, Peter - Up
    Gallagher, Rory - Big Guns (Best Of)
    Gaye, Marvin - Lets Get It On
    Genesis - Overview of all thanks @MikeF63
    Genesis - Foxtrot
    Genesis - Selling England By The Pound
    Genesis - The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway
    Genesis - And Then There Were Three
    Genesis - Duke
    Gentle Giant - Three Piece Suite
    Gentle Giant - The Power and The Glory
    Gentle Giant - Free Hand
    Gentle Giant - Interview
    Gilmour, Dave - On An Island
    Grateful Dead - Workingman's Dead
    Guns And Roses - Appetite For Destruction

    Hackett, Steve - Voyage Of The Acolyte thanks @riskylogic
    Hackett, Steve - Broken Skies, Outspread Wings thanks @riskylogic
    Hackett, Steve - At The Edge Of Light
    Herbie Hancock - Headhunters
    Hancock, Herbie - Sextant
    Hendrix,     Jimi - Electric Ladyland

    Inxs - Kick
    Iron Maiden - Dance Of Death

    Jeff Beck Group - Rough And Ready
    Jethro Tull - Aqualung
    Jethro Tull - Thick As A Brick
    Jethro Tull - A Passion Play/ Chateau d'Herouville
    Jethro Tull - Minstrel In The Gallery
    Jethro Tull - Too Old To Rock and Roll ...
    Jethro Tull - Heavy Horses
    Jethro Tull - Stormwatch
    Jethro Tull - TAAB 2 thanks @riskylogic
    Joel, Billy - The Stranger
    Joel, Billy - 52nd Street
    John, Elton - Elton John
    John, Elton - Madman Across The Water
    John , Elton - Honky Chateau
    John, Elton - Goodbye Yellow Brick Road
    Johnson, Eric - Ah Via Musicom

    Kansas - The Absence Of Presence thanks @riskylogic
    Kenny Wayne Shepherd Band - The Traveller
    King, Carole - Tapestry
    King Crimson - In The Court Of The Crimson King 40th and 50th
    King Crimson Islands
    King Crimson - Lark's Tongues In Aspic
    King Crimson - Red
    King Crimson - Beat
    King Crimson - Thrak
    King Crimson - The Power To Believe
    Knopfler, Mark - Sailing To Philadelphia
    Knopfler, Mark - Shangri La
    Kooper, Al (with Bloomfield and Stills) Super Sessions
    Kraftwork - 3d catalog - Autobahn
    Kraftwerk - 3d Catalog - Man Machine

    Led Zeppelin - Song Remains The Same
    Lennon, John - Imagine, Ultimate Edition
    Living Colour - Collideoscope
    Love And Rockets - Seventh Dream Of Teenage Heaven thanks @riskylogic
    Lynyrd Skynyrd - Southern Surroundings

    Mahavishnu Orchestra - Birds Of Fire
    Manheim Steamroller - Fresh Aire 8 thanks @riskylogic
    Marillion - Script For A Jester's Tear
    Marillion - Misplaced Childhood
    Marillion - Brave
    Marillion - Afraid Of Sunlight
    Marley, Bob - Legend
    McCartney, Paul - The McCartney Years
    Meatloaf - Bat Out Of Hell
    Monk, Thelonius - Supreme Jazz
    Moody Blues - Days Of Future Passed
    Moody Blues - In Search Of The Lost Chord
    Moody Blues - A Question Of Balance
    Moody Blues - Seventh Sojourn
    Morrison, Van - Moondance
    Mussorgsky, Modeste - Carlo Ponti - Pictures At An Exhibition+
    Motorhead - Ace Of Spades
    Mozart - 40th Symphony
    Mozart - Rene Jacobs - Le Nozze Di Figaro (The Marriage Of Figaro)
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3503
    Jagger69 likes this.
  4. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Nektar - Journey To The Centre of The Eye Thanks @riskylogic
    Nick Cave And The Bad Seeds - Abattoir Blues/Lyre Of Orpheus
    Nick Cave And The Bad Seeds - Dig Lazarus Dig
    Nine Inch Nails - The Downward Spiral
    No Man - Schoolyard Ghosts Thanks @riskylogic
    No Man - Together We're Stranger Thanks @riskylogic
    Numan, Gary - Anthology

    Oldfield, Mike - Ommadawn
    Oldfield, Mike - Five Miles Out
    Oldfield, Mike - Crises thanks @Sordel 's overview
    Oldfield, Mike - Return To Ommadawn thanks @riskylogic
    Opeth - Ghost Reveries thanks @riskylogic
    Opeth - Deliverance / Damnation thanks @riskylogic
    Opeth - Pale Communion
    Opeth - In Cauda Venenum

    Pat Metheny Group - Imaginary Day
    Pineapple Thief - Dissolution
    Pineapple Thief - Your Wilderness and 8 Years Later
    Pineapple Thief - Versions Of The Truth
    Pink Floyd - Atom Heart Mother
    Pink Floyd - Meddle
    Pink Floyd - Dark Side Of The Moon
    Pink Floyd - Wish You Were Here
    Pink Floyd - A Momentary Lapse Of Reason
    Pink Floyd - The Division Bell
    Pink Floyd - Endless River
    Pixies - Doolittle thanks @Galactus2
    The Police - Every Breath You Take the dvd
    Porcupine Tree - Stupid Dream
    Porcupine Tree - Lightbulb Sun
    Porcupine Tree - In Absentia (deluxe version 1) - Update on fixed copy
    Porcupine Tree - Deadwing thanks @riskylogic
    Porcupine Tree - Fear Of A Blank Planet
    Presley, Elvis - 30 #1 hits
    Pure Prairie League - Two Lane Highway/If The Shoe Fits thanks @riskylogic

    Queen - A Night At The Opera
    Queen - The Game
    Queensryche - Tribe thanks @riskylogic

    REM - Green
    REM - Automatic For The People
    REM - Monster
    REM - Around The Sun thanks @riskylogic
    Renaissance - Turn Of The Cards thanks @riskylogic
    Return to Forever - Musicmagic thanks @riskylogic
    Rich, Charlie Behind Closed Doors
    Riverside - Love, Fear And The Time Machine thanks @riskylogic
    Riverside - Wasteland
    Rolling Stones - Goat's Head Soup
    Roxy Music - Roxy Music
    Roxy Music - Avalon
    Rundgren, Todd - Liars - Thanks @riskylogic
    Rush - Fly By Night
    Rush - 2112
    Rush - A Farewell To Kings (Wilson version)
    Rush - Hemispheres
    Rush - Moving Pictures
    Rush - Signals
    Rush - Snakes And Arrows

    Santana
    Santana - Abraxas
    Santana, Carlos - Miles, Buddy - Live thanks @riskylogic
    Santana - Lotus
    Shankar & Gingger - One In A Million thanks @riskylogic
    Simple Minds - Sparkle In The Rain
    Sly And The Family Stone - Greatest Hits
    Soord, Bruce - All This Will Be Yours
    Soundgarden - Badmotorfinger
    Squire, Chris - Fish Out Of Water
    Steve Miller Band - Fly Like An Eagle
    Storm Corrosion (Wilson and Åkerfeldt) thanks @riskylogic

    Talking Heads - More Songs About Buildings and Food
    Talking Heads - Fear Of Music
    Talking Heads - Remain In Light
    Talking Heads - Speaking in Tongues
    Talking Heads - Little Creatures
    Talking Heads - Naked
    Tangerine Dream - Phaedra
    Tangerine Dream - Ricochet
    Taylor, James - JT
    Tchaikovsky - The Nutcracker - Neeme Jarvi
    Tears For Fears - Songs From The Big Chair
    Tears For Fears - Seeds Of Love
    Temple Of The Dog - Temple Of The Dog
    Tesseract - Polaris thanks @riskylogic
    Thomas, Michael Tilson - Orff, Beethoven, Gershwin - Carmina Burana, An American In Paris, Rhapsody In Blue + more
    Thompson, Richard - Rumour And Sigh
    Tom Petty and The Heartbreakers - Damn The Torpedoes
    Tomita - Firebird
    Toto - IV
    Townsend, Devin - Empath
    Townshend, Pete/Lane, Ronnie - Rough Mix
    T Rex - Electric Warrior

    Uk - Night After Night
    Ultravox - Vienna
    Uriah Heep - Gold From The Byron Era
    Uriah Heep - Best Of vol II

    Velvet Underground - Re-Loaded

    Wakeman, Rick - Six Wives Of Henry The Eighth
    Waters, Roger - Amused to Death
    Wayne, Jeff - War Of The Worlds
    Weather Report - Tale Spinnin'
    Who - Tommy
    Who - Quadrophenia
    Wilson, Steven - The Raven That Refused To Sing
    Wilson, Steven - Hand. Cannot. Erase.
    Wilson, Steven - 4 1/2
    Wilson, Steven - To The Bone
    Wings - Band On The Run
    Wings - Venus And Mars
    Wishbone Ash - Bare Bones thanks @riskylogic

    XTC - Drums And Wires
    XTC - The Black Sea
    XTC - Oranges and Lemons

    Yes - The Yes Album
    Yes - Close To The Edge
    Yes - Tale Of Topographic Oceans
    Yes - Relayer
    Young, Neil - Harvest
    Young, Neil - Greendale thanks @riskylogic

    Zappa - Quaudiophiliac
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3504
    AXington and Jagger69 like this.
  5. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Ok, not super happy with my rundowns today, but I am sure some folks will step up and give us their opinions ...

    Here are some choices for next week.


    Graham Nash - Songs For Beginners
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3505
    Jarleboy, weekendtoy and Åke Bergvall like this.
  6. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Nine Inch Nails - With Teeth
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3506
    Juggsnelson, AZRunner and weekendtoy like this.
  7. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    REM - Document
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3507
    weekendtoy, PhantomStranger, frightwigwam and 4 others like this.
  8. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Sting - Nothing Like The Sun
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3508
    Jimbino, Jarleboy, frightwigwam and 1 other person like this.
  9. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Richard Thompson - The Old Kit Bag
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3509
    Åke Bergvall and goodboyfred like this.
  10. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Rick Wakeman - Journey to The Centre Of The Earth
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3510
    boggs, albertop and Joe McKee like this.
  11. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    XTC - Nonsuch
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3511
    Jarleboy, Åke Bergvall, zobalob and 1 other person like this.
  12. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Yes - Fragile
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3512
    Jimbino, MoonPool, boggs and 4 others like this.
  13. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Zappa - Halloween
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3513
    AZRunner, frightwigwam, ~dave~~wave~ and 2 others like this.
  14. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Opeth - Sorcerous
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 18, 2020
    #3514
  15. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Although Songs From The Big Chair comes into my all-time list at number 20, The Seeds Of Love has never quite captured me in the same way. Of course everyone remembers that song with that video (along with “The Road To Nowhere” and “Sledgehammer” surely one of the top three videos of its period) but I found the album rather lacklustre and I haven't listened to it in about thirty years. So let's see what some Steven Wilson magic dust can do.

    “Woman In Chains” seems lame, overproduced & middle-of-the road: the nice surround mixing does open it up a bit but it's not for me. “Badman's Song”, on the other hand, has that superb jazz piano opening. The heavy reverb on the vocals makes Orzabal sound a lot like George Michael from the same era, and the synth brass hasn't aged well. The guitar solo here is centred in the field. Once the piano comes back I'm a lot happier: such a bold choice for a mainstream pop album and the sonics on it are good as well, unlike the main part of the song which sounds saturated, with very little soundstage.

    “Sowing The Seeds Of Love” is why I'm here. The vocals are too low in the second chorus, to the extent of actually being a technical fault. (This isn't the first time that SW has messed up the vocals ... makes me wonder whether he has the centre channel boosted in his system when mixing.) The surround effects on the early part of the instrumental section of the song are fun. Nice when the organ comes in, and then the panning “sitaresque” guitar. For the most part the song sounds very much as it does in my memory but some of the sound effects on the outro are lower in the mix to the extent of being obscured. Okay overall, but not best-in-class.

    “Advice To The Young At Heart” is incredibly bland again, straying into Spandau Ballet territory. Not much surround interest unless you count the harp glissando that pans left to right. “Standing On The Corner Of The Third World” begins like something off a solo Sting album but suddenly we have Orzabal's voice with more reverb than one would have thought humanly possible. The drums are nice here in surround, as are Oleta Adams's piano again, Pino Palladino's bass and Jon Hassell's trumpet: a meh song nicely gingered up by sterling session contributions. The harmonica roaming around gives some additional surround data.

    “Swords and Knives” is a song I don't even remember but I briefly like the more electronic feel and the detailed surround effects until it gets going, when it's very much “more MOR”. At about the 3.40 we get the instrumental break, which is considerably more interesting, beginning with the delayed guitar panning first left then right. The cellos, rear-left, are good, as is the static instrumental phase that follows. An interesting track but a weak song which segues into “Year Of The Knife”. Now we get almost a Frankie rhythm track until the drums come in uptempo. I don't remember this song but I do remember liking it. The lead vocals are again too low: this is a serious flaw. Yes, the “see the mountains crumble” vocal interlude is genuinely exciting, though I could do without that midi cello sound in the right speaker. The spacey section into the loud guitar chords is nicely trippy. The reverb trails at the end into the note that opens the next song are a bit overdone.

    “Famous Last Words” has a simple opening with piano & vocals and effects rear right. Jon Hassell's trumpet is great and reminds me his work on David Sylvian's “Brilliant Trees”. Once the main song starts it becomes tuneless and bombastic: shame.

    Having listened to the album complete in surround I played “Year Of The Knife” from the Bob Ludwig remaster for comparison and the problem leaps out at you: the slick production style just works better in stereo. The album as a whole is style over substance and it's like one of the those optical illusions that only works when seen from just the right angle. It actually sounds very different in surround, and while there's something to be said for picking the layers apart, the details of the mix were just meant to give the impression of an overworked canvas; I'm not sure that you were ever meant to “concentrate” on any of the musical elements in the way that multichannel makes possible.
     
    Sordel, Oct 18, 2020
    #3515
    Jagger69, ~dave~~wave~, albertop and 2 others like this.
  16. MikeF63

    MikeF63 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Derbyshire, UK
    1st listen to Ultravox Vienna last night after your excellent review. I was very impressed with Steve Wilson's mix, one of his very best I think. In the past he has possibly been reticent to place a lot in the rears to avoid seeming too "gimmicky" (?) but this one gets it right, and with lots of "non-musical" sounds in the synths and heavily distorted guitar he does not disappoint in a thoroughly immersive experience.

    Ironically the title track is the least effective (to me) and has the most dated sound. Aside from Western Promise I always thought the first four tracks, the bulk of the original vinyl side 1, were the best. The lyrics are still a bit embarrassing (it was obviously ultra cool in the early 80s to put your headphones on and listen to synthesizer songs) but the song arrangements themselves and the performances stand up really well. I think I will reach for the 5.1 every time I fancy hearing it again.
     
    MikeF63, Oct 21, 2020
    #3516
    Lethrus, jamesc, Jagger69 and 4 others like this.
  17. Pauljw

    Pauljw Forum Resident

    Location:
    NY
    I received my G n R super deluxe box set and here are my thoughts on the new stereo mix and the 5:1 mix.

    The 5:1 was nothing that blew me away. There are members here saying Axel's voice was low in the mix and had to turn up the center speaker. I did not experience that. Sound was balanced all around and the 5:1 opened it up a bit. The mix could use more rear/side effects. I have dual subs JBL L8400P and had to turn the gain up on each one.

    The new stereo mix is much better then the original. Bass was louder and more in your face then the 5:1 mix so I turned the sub gains down to my normal setting and the results were awesome.

    Why did the mixer have the bass lower in the 5:1 and why he did not use the side/rear for a more "surround mix" I cannot answer. But a large majority of my 5:1 surround discs are the same and, IMHO, should not even be called "surround". Queen's ANATO still remains my favorite "surround" disc. It just blows everything else out of the water.
     
    Pauljw, Oct 22, 2020
    #3517
    mark winstanley likes this.
  18. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Undoubtedly a great mix, but there are a lot of others.
    I thought the Gnr mix was good, not amazing, but good.
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 22, 2020
    #3518
    Jarleboy and Hymie the Robot like this.
  19. Vaughan

    Vaughan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex, UK
    Have you heard the Talking Heads 5.1 mixes? Just awesome, and totally transform the music.
     
    Vaughan, Oct 24, 2020
    #3519
    Åke Bergvall, albertop, J_Surround and 3 others like this.
  20. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Document

    [​IMG]
    Studio album by
    R.E.M.
    Released     August 31, 1987
    Recorded March–May 1987
    Studio Sound Emporium, Nashville, Tennessee
    Genre Alternative rock
    Length 39:51
    Label I.R.S.
    Producer Scott Litt R.E.M.

    Document is the fifth studio album by American rock band R.E.M., released on August 31, 1987 by I.R.S. Records. It was the first album by the band to be produced by Scott Litt.
    Additional musicians
    Production
    • Bill Berry – production
    • Peter Buck – production
    • Mike Mills – production
    • Michael Stipe – production
    • Scott Litt – production
    • Steve Catania – engineering
    • Tom Der – engineering
    • Toni Greene – engineering
    • Gary Laney – engineering
    • Ted Pattison – engineering
    • Todd Scholar – engineering
    • Bob Ludwig – mastering at Masterdisk, New York City, New York, United States; remastered at Gateway Mastering, Portland, Maine, United States in June 1999
    • Elliot Scheiner – mixing on 2005 re-release
    • Jim McKay – photography
    • Michael Meister – photography
    • Sandra-Lee Phipps – photography
    • Ron Scarselli – packaging
    1. "Finest Worksong" – 3:48
    2. "Welcome to the Occupation" – 2:46
    3. "Exhuming McCarthy" – 3:19
    4. "Disturbance at the Heron House" – 3:32
    5. "Strange" (Bruce Gilbert, Graham Lewis, Colin Newman, Robert Grey) – 2:31
    6. "It's the End of the World as We Know It (And I Feel Fine)" – 4:05
    7. "The One I Love" – 3:17
    8. "Fireplace" – 3:22
    9. "Lightnin' Hopkins" – 3:20
    10. "King of Birds" – 4:09
    11. "Oddfellows Local 151" – 5:21
    ---------------------------------------------------
    This album would be the first time I heard the band. The One I Love and It's The End Of The World.... got a lot of play on radio where I was from. At The time I didn't get the album, but the band was now on my radar. I ended up getting the Green album as my first REM album, and although I know it is an unpopular decision, it is my favourite REM album.
    To be honest I think that the 5.1 disc of this album is actually my first exposure to the album, and so, of the big REM albums (because as popular as the former albums are with many, they weren't really all that big) this was my last to be purchased.
    I have generally liked the band quite a bit, and again, as unpopular with many as it is, the run from Green through to Monster is my favourite section of the bands career. Although I have heard Document a few times, I am not as familiar with it as those later albums, though to the best of my knowledge I did like the album. I actually only bought it due to the 5.1 mix, because the guys suffered from a bit of overexposure in my part of the world, and like many eighties bands, I had to sit them on the back burner for a few years.
    So far we have looked at Green, Automatic For The People, Monster and Risky did Around The Sun. Anyone that has the post Monster albums, please feel free to give the folks a rundown of them, I don't have them, and probably won't get them.

    This album was the last of their IRS albums, and that is why many don't like what came out later, because of course a major label means "sold out", and that just won't do.

    This album came out as a dualdisc, and a dvd-audio.
    It is available at
    Discogs from about $49 on dualdisc R.E.M. - Document
    and as a dvd-audio from about $59 R.E.M. - Document
    Amazon has the dualdisc from about $72 https://www.amazon.com/Document-R-M/dp/B000AQACO8
    Ebay has it from about $46 (scroll down) R.E.M. - Document (DVD Audio, 2003) for sale online | eBay

    5.1 Mix Elliot Scheiner
    Mastered by Darcy Proper

    I really don't know this album as well as I probably should, but lets see what we get this morning.
    The dualdisc has DVD-audio, dts and DD audio tracks.

    Finest Worksong
    We open with guitar, sort of filling the room. Drums solid and up front.
    Sfx in the left rear.
    Percussion in rears.
    This ends up being a good mix. It is a pretty straight forward track, and the mix reflects that. It sounds very good, and has nice width and immersion, but it isn't amazing.

    Welcome To the Occupation
    Gtrs either side.
    This comes across like the first track, but feels a bit more defined in the mix.
    Nice mix and immersion.

    Exhuming McCarthy
    A typewriter slides around to the left and the song has come in by the time it reaches the left rear, and it goes away.
    The riff/lead guitar is right side.
    We get a guitar either side again. Distorted left side, fairly clean right side.
    This track comes across really well, with more defined sections, that blend slightly less, and define the zone better.
    Nice immersion.
    The mastering seems very good.

    Disturbance At The Heron House
    Gtrs in the sides, one up front also.
    Also percussion in the sides and rears.
    A nice sounding track. I am much more familiar with this album than I thought actually.
    Sort of lead guitar forward of centre, and percussive gtr right rear.
    This mix isn't super aggressive, but it is very effective, it is immersive, and sounds really nice.

    Strange
    A piano slides across the back.
    We get the same basic mix set up here.
    It is a sensible mix set up, for an album like this, it keeps the instruments tight, but gives us nice width.
    The instrumental break has the lead on the right, and handclaps in the rear.
    Again, a nice mix that is not crazy and wild but solid, and immersive.

    It's The End Of The World....
    The same mixing approach is used here also.
    Bvox come in the rears.
    A nice immersive mix. I still like this song a lot.

    The One I Love
    The rhythm guitars in the rears/sides interact really well, because the arpeggios aren't exact.
    The second verse has a really nice dynamic, with the quiet arpeggio guitar sitting on the left until the grunt guitars come in.
    The lead guitar seems to be all around.
    I think this is the most distinct mix so far. Immersive. Nice.

    Fireplace
    Again we have the same basic set up.
    The sax is in front of the centre with feeds to the rears.

    Lightening Hopkins
    Percussive guitar? In either side rears, which is very effective.
    Then we move into the same set up as on the rest of the album.
    Percussion alternates in rears.
    Nice. Immersive. Effective.

    King Of Birds
    A couple of guitars open with one left of centre, and on left side. Percussion right rear.
    Essentially we have the same set up again.
    Nice mix, immersive.

    Oddfellows Local 151
    Feedback guitar floats across the front and then out to the middle.
    Rhythm guitar left side.
    After the vocals the feedback guitar is on the right, but floats around some more.
    Synth strings in rears.
    Feedback guitar on the right side plays some lead.
    Essentially the same basic mix.
    Nice, immersive and effective.

    Firstly, I am much more familiar with this album than I had thought. I guess that's what comes of having more albums than most humans really need, but anyway.
    It is an excellent album, and contains many more excellent songs than I would have thought from a cursory glance. To some degree I think I got overloaded on REM in the nineties and I, to some degree, let them be, for a lot of years. Not quite the same over-saturation that I felt with the eighties, because I had less time for deep listening and was pursuing my own musical dreams, but enough that I obviously haven't listened to the albums as much as many others, with Green probably being the exception to the rule.
    This isn't one that you are going to play as a demo disc to amaze your friends, but really if we are listening to an album, that isn't, or at least, shouldn't be the objective. So what we have here is a solid mix, that uses the space well, but isn't so much a "wow five speakers!" kind of mix, but a nice balanced mix, that uses the space well, and stays fairly consistent across the album.
    Certainly there could have been more movement, and more separated sections, but in this instance I think that the songs have been made the main focus, and the thoughts that led to this mix have decided that a more straight forward and basic mix keeps the focus on the songs. I don't think this is a wrong approach at all, but I do think to some degree that it could have been more adventurous without damaging the connection to the songs.
    I think the REM fan would very much like this. We have a nice balanced immersive mix, and we also have a nice dynamic mastering ( i think my volume was at about 20) From my perspective I think the sound is very very good, and I see no reason why someone that likes this album wouldn't love the presentation here.
    I don't think this is for the person that wants their head spun around by wild slides and sweeps across the fields. Although there are a couple of moving bits, that is not the focus of the album or the mix.
    I reckon this is worth having for the REM fan.... I also see no reason why the fan of the later albums wouldn't love this. The music is a little less adventurous than later albums, but to some degree this may be the defining album for REM's most consistent style and sound across their career.

    for the record, for those interested in these sort of things, the dvd also contains the videos for Finest Worksong, The One I Love and End Of The World
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 25, 2020
    #3520
    TheAbsentMind, jamesc, jeffreybh and 8 others like this.
  21. riskylogic

    riskylogic Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central Virginia, USA
    The Magic Stag

    [​IMG]

    Studio album by Djabe
    Released 2020
    Recorded January 2019 to June 2020 – Most artists recorded separately on home equipment
    Genre Progressive rock, Jazz Fusion
    Label Esoteric Antenna
    Producer Tamás Barabás

    By my count, The Magic Stag is the 16th studio album by the Hungarian group Djabe. That’s not counting the four Djabe and Steve Hackett albums which The Magic Stag might also be counted as being among because Hackett is a collaborator on it too. Steve Hackett not only co-wrote the lyrics of the album's title track with his wife Jo Hackett, but he also plays guitar on seven of the album tracks and acts as narrator. The album also features guest Rob Townsend on tenor saxophone.

    The album is inspired by the work of the painter, Imre Égerházi (father of Attila Égerházi), whose painting works are on the cover and included with the album documentation.

    Personnel
    Djabe
    Tamás Barabás - bass
    Attila Égerházi - guitar, percussion
    Áron Koós-Hutás - flugelhorn, trumpet
    János Nagy - keyboards
    Péter Kaszás - drums, vocal

    Guest Musicians
    Steve Hackett - guitar, storytelling
    Rob Townsend - saxophone
    Malik Mansurov - tar
    Ferenc Muck - saxophone
    László Szabó - sitar, guitar
    Tibor Karvaly - violin
    Sára Kovács - flute
    Éva Kozma - koboz

    Track listing
    1. The Beginning of Legends
    2. The Magic Stag
    3. The Power of Wings
    4. Down by the Lake Side
    5. Far Away
    6. Unseen Sense
    7. Soaring Hills
    8. Two Little Snowflakes
    9. A True Hope
    10. Rising Horizon
    11. Uncertain Time
    _______

    I believe the CD + DVD version with the 5.1 mix is the one and only version of it. I ordered it from Amazon, but now they seem to be taking preorders.

    5.1 mix by Tamás Barabás

    “The Beginning of Legends”
    Starts out with bass drum mainly in the back. Could be another case where they are really mixed just to the back, but my subwoofers are in front. Then flute in the rears – alternating right and left. Very nice. Guitar and piano in front. Then 2nd guitar (might be the tar) in rear too.

    “The Magic Stag”
    Unlike the first song, this sounds like jazz with horn in front. The mix isn’t nearly as interesting – seems like mostly reverb in the rear. But there might different percussion in the rear than the drums that are in the front. Vocals seem to be in surround, which I don’t really like. Some flute in the rear again. Middle of the song has narration left front – that must be Hackett with accompanying guitar left rear, which I guess is Hackett too. The some piano right rear. There is stuff going on in the rears, but it’s not as discrete as the first short. Not as nice either.

    “The Power of Wings”
    Sitar in front, sax in back alternating. This is more like it. Then sitar moves left, electric guitar then horn come in on right. Bass and drums in front. Guitar solo in front. Favorite track so far – Mahavishnuesque. Sax and horn in surround – dominating rear speakers.

    “Down by the Lake Side”
    Another jazzy track with vocals. It’s another reverby mix too. Horn solo in front. The center channel is used, but it seems to be just another speaker in front.

    “Far Away”
    Starts out with synth in front, then lead bass in front – sounding like Stanley Clarke on this one. Drums also in front. Guitar on left, keyboards on right spilling into rears. Horn in surround but mostly front. Mean bass solo left front – good thing I have a subwoofer over there. Brief keyboard solo right rear. Finishes with synth in surround, guitar in front.

    “Unseen Sense”
    No vocals on this one, but it’s another very jazzy piece with bass and drums just a front, and everything else reverbing in the rear. Finishes with flurry solely in rear though.

    “Soaring Hills”
    Hills don’t soar, just saying. Bass, drums, lead guitar, horn all in front. There is a second guitar on left and keyboards on right that show up in rear. Some horn in surround too.

    “Two Little Snowflakes”
    Seems to have a Chinese melody. Piano, horn, lead guitar all in front. What I suppose to be the tar shows up in the rear again, some unique percussion too.

    “A True Hope”
    Bass and drums in front, just about everything else including horn, sax and guitar in surround. Nothing unique in the rear until near the end, when we get sax left rear then ocean noise and chimes in rear.

    “Rising Horizon”
    Wind noises in surround then “unknown folk singer recorded by Imre Égerházi” in 1973 – in center channel with Synth is surround. First time I’ve noticed the center channel being used. Then a plethora of eastern-sounding instruments, with some in the rear. Sounds really good. But about three minutes it changes over to a more-normal-for-them jazz piece with horn in front. Piano in rear. Guitar solo on right. Percussion pans in rear near the end.

    “Uncertain Time”
    Acoustic guitars front and rear. That always works for me. The electric guitar which seems to be right front and rear left, which seems weird. Low key bass and drums in front. Sax on right. Violin in surround. More sax on right. Acoustic guitar on left. Chanted vocals front right and left rear. Electric guitar in surround. Nice song, mix is little weird but it’s using the rears.
    _______

    This album is a mixed bag for me. About half the songs I’d characterize as plodding jazz which doesn’t interest me very much. I especially don’t care for the two early tracks with lyrics – the title track and “Down By the Lake Side”. But there are some songs that stand out like the opener, “The Power of Wings”,“Far Away” and “Unicertain Time”. The first half of “Rising Horizon” was pretty good too. Same deal with the surround. The first track had me thinking the mix might be pretty good, but the rest of it just OK with a few high points here and there. (1/2)

    The DVD also has some concert clips and a video that I covered on the video thread.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
    riskylogic, Oct 25, 2020
    #3521
    jeffreybh, weekendtoy and mark winstanley like this.
  22. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Halloween

    [​IMG]
    Live album by
    Frank Zappa
    Released     February 4, 2003
    Recorded The Palladium, New York City, October 27–31, 1978
    Genre Rock
    Length 70:22
    Label Vaulternative
    Producer Dweezil Zappa

    Halloween is a live album by Frank Zappa, released in DVD-Audio format by Vaulternative Records in 2003. It features recordings compiled from various shows at The Palladium, New York City in late October 1978—including a Halloween show on October 31—along with some video content from the same period.

    1. "NYC Audience" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 1:17
    2. "Ancient Armaments" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 8:23
    3. "Dancin' Fool" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 4:35
    4. "Easy Meat" The Palladium, October 27, 1978 6:03
    5. "Magic Fingers" The Palladium, October 27 & 31, 1978 2:33
    6. "Don't Eat the Yellow Snow" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 2:24
    7. "Conehead" The Palladium, October 28, 1978 4:02
    8. "Zeets" (Vinnie Colaiuta) The Palladium, October 31, 1978 2:58
    9. "Stink-Foot" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 8:51
    10. "Dinah-Moe Humm" The Palladium, October 27, 1978 5:27
    11. "Camarillo Brillo" The Palladium, October 27, 1978 3:14
    12. "Muffin Man" The Palladium, October 27, 1978 3:32
    13. "Black Napkins (The Deathless Horsie)" The Palladium, October 31, 1978 16:56
    Tricks Or Treats
    1. "Suicide Chump" (Black and white video) Capitol Theatre, October 13, 1978 9:31
    2. "Dancin' Fool" (Color video) Saturday Night Live, October 21, 1978 3:48
    3. "Radio interview" (Audio only) WPIX with Mark Simone, October 30, 1978 9:41
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    So far we have done the Quadiophiliac album, which to the best of my knowledge is the only other album available in surround. I do highly recommend the Roxy Movie though, because it is just marvelous.

    The Zappa in surround thing is really disappointing to me on so many levels, because we know that Zappa was a fan of surround sound, and did mix a lot of his stuff in surround, at least for his own pleasure. I also believe that Overnight Sensation and Apostrophe were released in Quadrophonic in 73/74.... Sadly I believe the gentleman running the Zappa vaults, Joe Travers? is loathe to have anything remixed into 5.1, as he feels it would be messing with the Zappa legacy.... I completely understand this perspective, but by the same token, I sincerely believe that Zappa's interest in the format is a pretty much a solid fact that can't be denied or overlooked. At the very least it would be nice to get the original Quad albums released, so that those of us who love Zappa, and surround sound can have what little there is available as a standard release.... I do believe that there are other tapes in the Zappa vaults that have surround sound mixes, because my limited understanding is that he liked to experiment with these sorts of things, and I seem to remember reading somewhere that he liked playing around with the idea.... anyway.
    Quadiophiliac was some stuff they found that Zappa had mixed in surround.

    This album Is taken from, mainly, the 78 Halloween show, but also incorporates some tracks from shows leading up to the Halloween show. Some folks think that too many of the more popular tunes were picked and that this was a mistake, and perhaps that is the case, but at this stage of the game I think us Zappa fans will take what we can get, and in surround, that is sadly way too little.

    This album was produced by Dweezil
    5.1 mix Joe Chiccarelli
    I'm not sure who mastered it.

    DVD-A 5.1 Surround 96K/24
    DTS 5.1 Surround 96K/24
    PCM 2.0 Stereo 48K/24

    On discogs from about $24 Frank Zappa - Halloween
    On Amazon from about $49 https://www.amazon.com/Halloween-Frank-Zappa/dp/B00007L9O0

    Memory tells me that this is well mixed in terms of hall ambience, but aside from an unusual drums solo section it isn't a dizzying mix of wild sweeps and swoops, but it is a long time since I have listened to it, with my deep love of the albums I revisit frequently, and also some of the excellent sets that have been released by the Zappa business in recent years. so I am looking forward to having a re-listen to this one.

    We open with NYC Audience and the audience swells around whole we here some preliminary guitars and keyboard noodling, following by a drum check/noodling, and then we move into Ancient Armaments
    I have volume set on 19, so we have another well mastered album, and the sound is really nice.
    The drums sound great, and that shows that Dweezil and Joe, know Frank well enough to do this, because drums were very important to Frank.
    The drums do wash into the sides, giving is a nice wide representation, that sounds really good.
    Opening with a Zappa lead is a good thing, because to the best of my knowledge, post Mothers shows, particularly eighties shows, generally did, didn't they.
    The ambience here is beautiful, and it works really well in the mix, even if the bulk of the music I'd represented up front.
    I think it is a very natural sound.
    It gives us a real in the audience kind of feel.

    Dancing fool
    Tuned percussion right side.
    Keys left side.
    Again the drums have a fairly wide field.
    I turned my volume up to eighteen.
    This is a really nice mix, and we have use of the sides, and it really does give me an enjoyable mix.
    There is some solid sub on the bass guitar.

    Easy Meat
    I much prefer this version of Easy Meat to the Tinseltown album.... which for me is a lesser Zappa album.
    Again nice wide drums. Also some instruments just onto the sides, again creating a nice live immersion feel.
    The lead guitar is again a big part of this track, and if memory serves, most of the album.
    We get a nice clear level for the lead guitar, and in many ways, this album is a nice partway between a Zappa album, and the Shut Up and Play, and Guitar albums... and that suits me just fine. Zappa really was a master guitarists in his own style.
    To me this sounds great. Again the drums roll into the sides

    For the record most of these tracks are from a Zappa Build Reel, and I assume that means Zappa constructed this to some degree. Perhaps @gd0 can give us more details, as he is much better versed in Zappa than I.

    Magic Fingers
    Again keys and percussion seems to be in the sides. Really nice sounding mix, to me at least.
    We get quite a few little bits in the sides and rear, and this is much better than I remember.

    Don't Eat the Yellow Snow
    The short version.
    Again we get some stuff in the sides, and again I enjoy this mix... I sort of wish we had the complete Snow Suite, but alas, again, I'll take what I can get.

    Conehead
    Here we get a track that didn't make it to an album until 1981, but Zappa frequently did this.
    This is a little slower, and a slightly different arrangement, but the song is basically the same.
    Again nice wide drums.
    L Shankar takes a violin lead, just in front of centre with feeds into the rears.
    Again nice sound.

    Zeets
    Is essentially a drum solo, and we get a fairly wild and crazy mix that is certainly in all channels.
    I guess it isn't extremely natural sounding, with the drums bouncing and circling, and making full use of all speakers, but it is entertaining and fun, in my opinion.
    We end with a keyboard line across the middle.

    Stinkfoot
    We have keys on the left side, and again we have the nice wide drums.
    We get Frank talking and reminiscing with an audience member he remembered from the old days.
    We move into another nice Zappa lead.
    It starts in a really understated way, but really nice touch, and then we get a really melodic and rhythmically interesting Zappa lead.
    Again this is not an all channels dizzying surround-fest, but it is a really nice full sound.

    Dinah-Moe Hum
    This is actually a pretty nice mix here, with the keys in the sides, and a nice immersive sound.
    This seems to be a favourite of most folks, I certainly like it, but it isn't really a favourite.
    We get percussion in the sides during the monologue, also some sfx, keys and bvox.
    It really works nicely.

    Camarillo Brillo
    This is a high speed version of the track. Again we get a nice wide mix with keys and such in the sides.
    This again works nicely for me.
    The track is probably a little too fast, but is a nice alternative live version.
    We get the regular live slow down accented breakdown, and this is extremely effective.

    Muffin Man
    I love the Bongo Fury version of this... it is actually one of my favourite lead guitar outros of all time, and the arrangement is perfect.
    Here we don't get the story intro, we move straight into the guitar riff. We get a verse, and then launch into a really nice piece of gtr that tears ot up well, and does justice to the track.
    The lead guitar has an immersive effect all of it's own here.

    Black Napkins/Deathless Horsie
    We have basically the same kind of mix we have been getting...
    Nice wide drums, keys in the sides, and a big center of attention guitar.
    This album really highlights Vinnie and Frank, and the rest of the instruments play strong support roles, holding the grooves together.
    About seven minutes in we get L Shankar leading with the violin, and the backing is almost Outside Now.
    Then we get Frank and L sort of dueling and playing in unison, to very good effect.
    This is a beautiful dreamy kind of section.
    L is just left of front left, and Frank is just right of front right.
    We close with Frank introducing the band members, as was often the case.

    I really enjoyed this disc. I seem to remember when I first heard this, being sort of over zealous for some brain melting Zappa surround, as it was the first one I had, or was aware of, and after some rather amazing surround discs prior, this felt like a let down. I was particularly perturbed by the drum solo at the time, because it seemed slightly tacky .... however, the value of distance and expectations being removed, I really enjoyed this disc today, and it is much more likely to get spin time on the player.
    I think this is a very well put together concert, and for a concert, it actually has a pretty good immersion factor. Certainly the bulk of the music is in the front, but it isn't solely in the front, and there are enough interesting uses of the field to make it worth having. It is also a very good concert replica (being from different nights) and I find it to be a much much better show and disc than I initially felt.
    The sound quality seems to be very good to my ears, and it is certainly not mastered loud.
    I would imagine this disc would appeal to fans of the Guitar series, as we get a lot of guitar here, and that is never a bad thing with Frank, but it is also well balanced with actual songs, for those that find the Guitar series a little too guitar heavy.
    I feel that if this disc is approached from a concert perspective, the listener will enjoy the 5.1 mix, as it is a very good sounding disc, and although not intensely immersive, it is immersive, and we do get some action outside the front of the field, but it is probably worth it just for the show to be honest.
    I am very happy with this one.
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 25, 2020
    #3522
    ti-triodes, jeffreybh, weekendtoy and 4 others like this.
  23. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    Fragile

    [​IMG]
    Studio album by
    Yes
    Released     26 November 1971
    Recorded September 1971
    Studio Advision, Fitzrovia, London
    Genre Progressive rock[1][2]
    Length 39:52
    Label Atlantic
    Producer Yes Eddy Offord

    Fragile is the fourth studio album by the English progressive rock band Yes, released on 26 November 1971 by Atlantic Records. It was the band's first album to feature keyboardist Rick Wakeman, who replaced founder member Tony Kaye after the group had finished touring their breakthrough record, The Yes Album.

    The band entered rehearsals in London in August 1971, but Kaye's reluctance to play electronic keyboards led to his departure from the group. He was quickly replaced by Wakeman, whose experience with the electric piano, organ, Mellotron, and Minimoog synthesiser expanded the band's sound. Due to budget and time constraints, four tracks on the album are group compositions; the remaining five are solo pieces written by each band member. The opening track, "Roundabout", became a popular and iconic song. The artwork for the album was the band's first to be designed by Roger Dean, who would design many of their future covers and stage sets.

    Fragile received a positive reception upon its release, and was a commercial success, reaching No. 4 on the US Billboard Top LPs chart and No. 7 on the UK Albums Chart. An edited version of "Roundabout" was released as a single in the US in January 1972, which reached No. 13. Fragile has since been certified double platinum by the Recording Industry Association of America for selling over two million copies in the US. It has been remastered several times since its release, some containing previously unreleased tracks.

    Production
    • Yes – production
    • Eddy Offord – engineer, production
    • Gary Martin – assistant engineer
    • Roger Dean – artwork, photography
    • David Wright – colour photo of Bruford on drums
    • Brian Lane – bank loan arrangement
    1. "Roundabout" Jon Anderson, Steve Howe 8:29
    2. "Cans and Brahms" (instrumental) Johannes Brahms, arr. Rick Wakeman 1:35
    3. "We Have Heaven" Anderson 1:30
    4. "South Side of the Sky" Anderson, Chris Squire 8:04
    5. "Five Per Cent for Nothing" (instrumental) Bill Bruford 0:35
    6. "Long Distance Runaround" Anderson 3:33
    7. "The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)" Squire 2:35
    8. "Mood for a Day" (instrumental) Howe 2:57
    9. "Heart of the Sunrise" Anderson, Squire, Bruford 10:34
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    So we move on to Fragile. So far we have looked at The Yes Album, Close To The Edge, Tales Of Topographic Oceans and Relayer..

    Fragile is the last of the Yes albums that I have in surround at the moment. I know that Magnification is available in 5.1 on dvd-audio (Yes - Magnification ), but it never really interested me.
    For me The Yes Album through to Big Generator is all that really interests me. So if anyone has Magnification, please give the folks a run down, so they can make some form of informed opinion about whether they would like it or not, running at about fifty bucks.

    I sincerely hope 90125, Going for The One, and some others get, the 5.1 treatment, but it seems like the motivation, or possibly the realistic belief that the other albums may not sell as well, has put anything like that on the back burner, if considered at all. I know that many think the 90125 was some kind of sellout from being a progressive band, but I think that fails to see how very well written and structured the songs are. It is certainly not a pop album, although it had success, there is some fantastic stuff going on with that album ... anyway.

    Fragile was the follow up to the successful The Yes Album, where I think the band truly found their identity, even though they continued to move slowly through different variations of what Yes could be. Fragile was a top ten album in Holland and the UK and the song Roundabout did well as a single in an edited form ... although I am not sure I ever heard the edited version... edits have never really interested me.

    There are two 5.1 mixes of Fragile, but don't stress ...
    In 2002 there was a 5.1 mix released, and it was really quite good. I am not sure who mixed it, because I no longer have that dvd-audio, but the 2015 Steven Wilson mix includes the original 5.1 mix anyhow, for those that like to compare and contrast.

    Here is the track list for the 2015 bluray/cd (there was also a dvd/cd)

    Definitive Edition CD
    2015 Stereo Mixes
    CD-1RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:33
    CD-2Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:40
    CD-3We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:40
    CD-4South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson8:01
    CD-5Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:36
    CD-6Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:32
    CD-7The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:38
    CD-8Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe2:58
    CD-9Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:39
    Additional Tracks
    CD-10Roundabout (Rehearsal Take, Early Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:09
    CD-11We Have Heaven (Full Version, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson2:22
    CD-12South Side Of The Sky (Early Version, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson5:12
    CD-13All Fighters Past (Steven Wilson Mix)2:32
    CD-14Mood For Another Day (Previously Unreleased Take)Written-By – Steve Howe3:04
    CD-15We Have Heaven (Acapella, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson2:01

    Definitive Edition Blu-Ray Disc
    2015 Stereo Mixes     (LPCM Stereo 24/96)
    BR-1RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:33
    BR-2Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:40
    BR-3We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:42
    BR-4South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson8:02
    BR-5Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:35
    BR-6Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:31
    BR-7The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:39
    BR-8Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe2:58
    BR-9Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:26
    2015 5.1 Surround Mixes (24/96 LPCM & DTS-HD MA)
    BR-10RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:33
    BR-11Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:40
    BR-12We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:42
    BR-13South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson8:02
    BR-14Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:35
    BR-15Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:31
    BR-16The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:39
    BR-17Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe2:58
    BR-18Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:26
    Original Stereo Mixes (LPCM Stereo 24/192, Flat Transfer)
    BR-19RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:35
    BR-20Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:43
    BR-21We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:40
    BR-22South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson7:54
    BR-23Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:39
    BR-24Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:30
    BR-25The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:40
    BR-26Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe3:02
    BR-27Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:27
    Additional Tracks (LPCM Stereo 24/96)
    BR-28Roundabout (Rehearsal Take, Early Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:13
    BR-29We Have Heaven (Full Version, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson2:20
    BR-30South Side Of The Sky (Early Version, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson5:12
    BR-31All Fighters Past (Steven Wilson Mix)2:33
    BR-32Mood For Another Day (Previously Unreleased Take)Written-By – Steve Howe3:02
    BR-33We Have Heaven (Acapella, Steven Wilson Mix)Written-By – Jon Anderson2:02
    Blu-Ray Exclusive (LPCM Stereo 24/96)BR-34Roundabout (Early Rough Mix From Fragile 2003)Written-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:36
    BR-35South Side Of The Sky (Early Take)Written-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson6:22
    BR-36Roundabout (Heaphones Mix For Vox Overdubs)Written-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:33
    2015 Stereo Instrumental Mixes (LPCM Stereo 24/96)
    BR-37RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:33
    BR-38Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:40
    BR-39We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:42
    BR-40South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson8:02
    BR-41Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:35
    BR-42Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:31
    BR-43The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:39
    BR-44Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe2:58
    BR-45Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:26
    Original 5.1 Mix (From Rhino DVD-A Release, LPCM & DTS-HD MA 5.1 Surround 24/96, LPCM Stereo 24/96)
    BR-46RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:37
    BR-47Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:42
    BR-48We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:30
    BR-49South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson8:08
    BR-50Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:37
    BR-51.aLong Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:31
    BR-51.bThe Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:41
    BR-52Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe3:02
    BR-53Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:29
    BR-54America10:33
    Needle-Drop (A1/B1 UK Vinyl Transfer, LPCM Stereo 24/96)
    BR-55RoundaboutWritten-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe8:36
    BR-56Cans And BrahmsArranged By – Rick WakemanComposed By – Brahms*1:43
    BR-57We Have HeavenWritten-By – Jon Anderson1:39
    BR-58South Side Of The SkyWritten-By – Chris Squire, Jon Anderson7:41
    BR-59Five Per Cent For NothingWritten-By – Bill Bruford0:38
    BR-60Long Distance RunaroundWritten-By – Jon Anderson3:31
    BR-61The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)Written-By – Chris Squire2:39
    BR-62Mood For A DayWritten-By – Steve Howe3:00
    BR-63Heart Of The SunriseWritten-By – Bill Bruford, Chris Squire, Jon Anderson11:25
    BR-64Roundabout (US Single Edit)Written-By – Jon Anderson, Steve Howe3:30
    BR-65Long Distance Runaround (US Single Edit)Written-By – Jon Anderson3:17

    So really, I should probably just about be able to leave it there, because unless you just don't like Yes, how can one knock back all those options of ways to listen to this album on one bluray .... but anyway, I made it this far so lets press on :)

    Discogs has 13 copies of the bluray starting at about $21 Yes - Fragile
    and one copy of the dvd-audio from $28 Yes - Fragile

    Just buy a decent bluray player guys, it is passed time....

    5.1 mix Steven Wilson

    We have dts hd master audio and 5.1 lpcm 96/24

    Roundabout
    The swell slowly slides to the rears, and the acoustic guitar is beautifully crisp and clear up front
    The harmonic chords left side.
    Keys and synths come in in the rears.
    The bass is up front.
    The chorus guitar comes in the right rear, and the arpeggio synth left rear.
    The fill keys are across the back.
    Wilson has really thought hard about this mix, and it is beautiful.
    The change comes on with heavy percussion in the rears.
    This really is a great mix, and even if he had flubbed the rest, worth getting just for this.
    The organ in the breakdown is across from front right, to rear left.
    Percussion crescendo and ritard left rear.
    Acoustic back up front, keys right rear.
    Mellotron comes in with vocals up front.
    Some other stuff going on, but now we have Wakeman leading on the left side.
    Guitar riff left rear, the another right rear, then back to the organ.
    This is beautifully done in every aspect. This song was already full of life but this mix just lifts it to the heavens for me.

    Cans And Brahms
    We are surrounded by various keyboards.
    All nicely balanced and working together (going for the one)

    We have Heaven
    Guitars either side.
    Vocals front, and right rear.
    Big splashy percussive sound right rear.
    Various vocal takes surround us, as the mix grows and grows.
    This is an interesting experiment.
    We get a creaky door right rear that slams front right and then feet run across the front and back

    South Side Of The Sky
    A deep thud front right, and wind swirls around us then some nice drum mixing.
    Guitar left side. Organ right side.
    This is a very layered, somewhat complex arrangement and we have a very full and balanced mix.
    A change comes in, and piano comes front left, then it spreads across the front.
    Choked cymbal left rear.
    Vocals all round.

    I know it's irrelevant, but I always loved this album cover too.

    Nice spread of drums, with the Tom's spread to the right side.
    Another very balanced mix with really nice immersion...
    A drone comes in and we move into the opening styling again, and the huge layered sound returns.
    You can hear the band experimenting... and these experiments led to the very focused masterpiece that Close to the edge is.
    We get reverse guitars whooshing around, and Yes has a psychedelic edge right here.

    Five Percent For Nothing
    Drums front left. Organ right side. Guitar left side. A collage of sound.

    Long Distance Runaround/The Fish
    I love this riff.
    Squire lays down s killer bass up front, and layers of guitars all over the place.
    Then the straight staccato beat comes in.
    Gtr right rear.
    Piano front.
    Riff guitar front left.
    Arpeggio riff feels like it is in the rears.
    Delay guitar bounces all around us.
    Then percussion all round, and percussive instruments either side.
    Arpeggio riff gtr circles us.
    With unusual synth burbles front right.
    Another somewhat psychedelic mix and piece of music.
    Excellent mix and immersion. Great stuff.

    Mood For A Day
    Acoustic guitar up front.
    I can't quite pick up if we are in the middle of one guitar, or if we have subtle layers... I think we are in the middle of one guitar.

    Heart Of The Sunrise
    We open with a virtual heavy metal guitar, bass and drums up front.
    Then atmospheric synths in the rears.
    Then we transition into a great groove.
    The drums and bass here are simply beautiful.
    Spring-like synth or mellotron across rears.
    This whole transitioning start is simply wonderful, and it sounds great.
    However comes in with a riff-like lead, and then we burst into that opening again.

    For the record, this is again beautifully mastered, or transferred. Volume at 19.

    A really nice guitar comes in. Anderson sings his gentle, high pitched vocal in the centre.
    Then the feel changes. Pay attention to the bass.
    Swells on across middle.
    Keys come in in the back.
    Mellotron front.
    Again the mix is wonderful, and transforms with the music.
    Great balance, and immersion. Another wonderful Wilson mix.

    This is really another essential bluray surround mix.
    I am not the biggest fan of the album as a whole. I find the album a little unfocussed and kind of broken up. It is a series of individual experiments, mixed with some masterful band works....
    The thing is though the band works are magnificent, and the mixes are superb.
    That isn't to say that the little bits of experiments aren't good, they are just quite different and obviously one persons style or thing, rather than focussed band efforts, if that makes any sense.
    So far as albums go, I think Close To the Edge is the pinnacle for the band in terms of seventies albums, with Topographic probably coming in second for the brave adventurers, but this is solid, and the mix just makes it essential from my perspective.
    For me all the main era Yes surround mixes are pretty much essential for the surround listener, unless they particularly hate Yes.
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 25, 2020
    #3523
    Jimbino, Jagger69, Åke Bergvall and 9 others like this.
  24. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Location:
    AR. (Aussie in the U.S.)
    I'm going to leave it there today. I am battling this Meniere's again, and it gets pretty tiring trying to compensate for it. I am more confident about this weeks run downs than last weeks though. Sorry that it sometimes interferes.....

    Anyway

    Next week - Halloween is on Saturday, and Halloween means little to me, but it is my 52nd birthday, and some friends want to come over and party. So I know me, and I will likely tie one on, so I am not going to put up choices this week, because I can't guarantee that I will be able to wake up for next week. If I do, I will certainly run through something.

    Cheers guys, have a great week.

    Mark
     
    mark winstanley, Oct 25, 2020
    #3524
    frightwigwam, Jagger69, Åke Bergvall and 5 others like this.
  25. gd0

    gd0 Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies

    Location:
    Golden Gate
    Ehhh, not really; I don't have that specific info. But it's a good bet that your description is on the money. It's obviously not a complete show, and seems deliberately compiled to be mostly popular songs with vocals. Not a big favorite, partly for that reason and partly for the surround mix. I'm sure we're hearing much the same thing, but my take is less generous than yours; ie, this is a deliberate hall ambience mix (except the drum solo of course) which is a little underwhelming to me. Nonetheless, squeaky clean production and superb tonal balance. And of course fine performances as we've all come to expect by now.
     
    gd0, Oct 25, 2020
    #3525
    Åke Bergvall, ~dave~~wave~ and mark winstanley like this.
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