Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries

Barclay James Harvest - Everyone is everybody else
Nick Drake - A treasury

 

What is it about Ziggy Stardust that almost demands it be turned up to really hear it? It has a remote, ‘far away’ sound to it (to me), as if the mics were too far from the band and vocals.

A great album, for sure, and a nice 5.1 mix. Compared to all my other surround titles, it has to be played louder than most for maximum effect. And some of the songs that start out slow and quiet, end up being raucous.

Maybe it was intended that way....?

 

Well...it *does*say “To Be Played at Maximum Volume” on the back cover...

 

I’m really enjoying this thread. Some albums are really wonderful to be immersed in (T Rex’s Electric Warrior or Pink Floyd’s WYWH) and some I appreciate from a more analytical angle, focusing on the separate parts (Velvet Underground’s Loaded or Zeppelin’s How the West was Won). The Fleetwood Mac 5.1 mixes are a wonderful combo of both.

Really hope home theater systems revive 5.1 albums, the Beatles rereleases can’t hurt either.

 

If it hasn't been mentioned already here, I'd like to recommend the 2011 5.1 mix of Serge Gainsbourg's Histoire De Melody Nelson. It's my preferred version of the album by far.

 

I think the white album sound fantastic in surround. Better than pepper for sure ( which I didn't mind and was happy to get it). I don't think as a musical group the Beatles are at the top of the list that would benefit in surround, there are many others that I would put first, but still when done right it proves it can be a great experience.

Mirage is a album I really like, the surround is good but its not lossless and is bested by many other mixes.
But again. If artists are willing to put these out, thats great and most of the time I will buy them.
I bought the Mirage box set. you get just about everything for not so much money ( when it came out). Vinyl, CD, DVD. good stuff and plenty of options for listening.

 

I have been waiting forever for Electric Warrior to be in an affordable range. I guess next time I actually have some cash, I may just need to bite the bullet

 

After Rumours being done so wonderfully, the box sets were disappointing from an encoding perspective. The mixes are good, but one couldn't help feel they were an afterthought, to some degree. It was terribly disappointing the Tusk didn't get a dvd-a release in the box, as it was prepared for dvd-a and then discarded.

 

I'm going to have to pick this one up... thanks for bringing it to our attention. Great story about the US title! It's a shame they didn't release a lossless version of the Quad mix.

I fell in love with the early track Showdown, after it was used in the movie Kingpin. It really goes well with Bill Murray's crazy hair in that scene.

 

Selling England by the Pound


Studio album by
Genesis
Released 13 October 1973
Recorded August 1973
Studio Island Studios, London
Genre Progressive rock[1], art rock[1]
Length 53:50
Label Charisma
Producer John Burns, Genesis

Selling England by the Pound is the fifth studio album from the English progressive rock band Genesis, released in October 1973 on Charisma Records. It reached No.  3 in the UK and No. 70 in the U.S. A single from the album, "I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)", was released in February 1974 and became the band's first top 30 hit in the UK.

The album was recorded in August 1973 following the tour supporting the previous album, Foxtrot (1972). The group set aside a short period of time to write new material, which covered a number of themes, including the loss of English folk culture and an increased American influence, which was reflected in the title. Following the album's release, the group set out on tour, where they drew an enthusiastic reception from fans.

Critics and the band have given mixed opinions of the album, though guitarist Steve Hackett has said it is his favourite Genesis record.[3] The album has continued to sell and has reached Gold certification by the British Phonographic Industry and the Recording Industry Association of America. It was remastered for CD in 1994 and 2007. Several of the album tracks became fan favourites and featured as a regular part of the band's live setlist into the 1980s.

Genesis

• Peter Gabriel – vocals, flute, oboe, percussion
• Tony Banks – keyboards, 12-string guitar
• Steve Hackett – electric guitar, nylon guitar
• Michael Rutherford – 12-string guitar, bass, electric sitar
• Phil Collins – drums, assorted percussion, lead vocals on "More Fool Me", backing vocals

Production

• John Burns – producer, engineer
• Genesis – production
• Rhett Davies – assistant engineer
• Betty Swanwick – cover painting

1. "Dancing with the Moonlit Knight" 8:02
2. "I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)" 4:03
3. "Firth of Fifth" 9:36
4. "More Fool Me" ([c]) 3:10
5. "The Battle of Epping Forest" 11:43
6. "After the Ordeal" 4:07
7. "The Cinema Show" ([d]) 11:10
8. "Aisle of Plenty" 1:30
-------------------------------------------------
Not so long ago we did a Genesis album/song thread, and it was excellent. I went from being a fan, to a much bigger fan, as it gave me an opportunity to get into some of the albums that just hadn't been played enough. I have a habit of turning to the same albums when looking for something to play, and that obviously means some get the short shrift.
Amazingly Selling England was one of those albums. I think to some degree I was avoiding it because of "I Know What I Like", and the same folks that loved that, always had negative things to say about the later Genesis work ... yes I was being pig headed and obstinate ... I sometimes am ... I had also not had the "Battle Of Epping Forest" click for me, and as it is such a large part of the album, this album sat in the "I like it, but I feel like listening to something else pile". While doing the thread I grew a lot closer to many of the albums that had been sitting in the corner, though I still don't see why everyone likes Trick Of The Tail so much. I like it, but it is among my least favourite Genesis albums.
If you can get into the brilliant insanity of Epping Forest, this album is a must have album.
This album, although definitely part of the Progressive Rock movement, has a touch of the Kinks sentimentality ... a somewhat whimsical look back in time, with some somewhat obtuse references that manage to enhance the whole thing.
When the 5.1 box sets came out, back in 2007/2008, I had to get them. a) I loved surround mixes and b) each box had at least one album that I loved.
The discs were released separately as well, but sadly all options seem to be expensive these days.
As we had a late night of drinking and fun, the Mrs is sleeping, and as this album only just missed out a couple of weeks ago, I thought we could run through this one as well today.
I hope that is cool with everyone.

There was a lot of talk about changes to the mixes in these sets, and for some people it is a huge annoyance, and I understand that. I can only assume that due to the way the albums were originally done, that it was hard to replicate, so therefor changed a little. I don't think it actually is terrible, but I can understand it being annoying to those who were incredibly fond of the original mixes. I think for the most part these are really well done.... A lot of folks say that these mixes suffer from loudness war mastering, and that may well be true, I have never had any fatigue from listening to music, so for the most part again, it just doesn't effect me. I am not sure if the 5.1 mixes suffer from this or not, but I am sure that someone can give their two cents worth on these kinds of issues. I am someone who listens to songs, in an album form, and for the most part, I may enjoy good mastering, but would rarely be too perturbed by bad mastering ... I know I am a heathen and a fool ... Oh well.

the 5.1 mixes are credited to Genesis and Nick Davis, assisted by Tom Mitchell
The Mastering is credited to Tony Cousins

This is a little expensive currently starting at $75 on discogs for the sacd and dvd dts 96/24 edition (Japan)
Genesis - Selling England By The Pound
starting at 56 for the sacd and dvd dts 96/24 edition (Europe)
Genesis - Selling England By The Pound
There is a bluray version of this album, currently starting at $49
Genesis - Selling England By The Pound
There was also a version with just a cd and the dts 96/24 disc available, but I can't seem to find that at the moment.
The box set from Trespass to Lamb is starting at 200 Genesis - 1970 - 1975
You can look through the available boxes on this page if that interests you... as I say, I think the surround mixes are very good.
Genesis

Dancing With The Moonlit Knight
This is one of Genesis' many brilliant opening tracks.
Gabriel sings solo front and centre, and the song builds around the vocal.
Beautiful 12 strings left and right.
Cymbal taps in the left rear. A nice warm sub kick drum.
This such a beautifully balanced mix.
Rhythm guitars in the fast section are wonderfully balanced left and right side.
The backing vocal effect also has a great sound from both sides.
The doubled guitars and synth are beautifully balanced.
Some lovely interplay between the guitar and synth hitting from alternate sides just before the quite section near the end.
Wonderful swells from the keys filling the space.
This isn't trippy in a swirling whirling sense, it is just beautiful use of the space and the source material.

I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)
A fantastic surround landscape introduces this song into the spoken intro.
Again wonderful balance between the instruments, and again using the space really well.
Even as one of my less favourite songs from early Genesis, this sounds great, and the mix is immersive and interesting.
The Ending is great too.

Firth Of Fifth
The wonderful piano intro spreads from the centre to the right rear, with the higher notes on the scale to the right.
Again the cymbals have some rear action.
Again some really nice mixing of the guitars and keys.
Balance seems to be the order of the day in these mixes.
Gabriel's sweet flute is in the middle of the room.
Collins drums sound great.
The keys layering in the instrumental refrain sound fantastic, and it is all about balance.
Then we get Hackett's beautiful lead break, with the reverb feeding the rears for a wonderful sound. He reprises the keyboard refrain we just had, and then we have a wealth of depth in the mix as the keys come back in, and Hackett's soars again.
Majestic stuff this. A fan favourite, and it isn't hard to see why.

More Fool Me
An acoustic starts to the left. Collins comes in front and centre.
When the song kicks in we have lovely left and right side guitars.
We get lovely spread backing vocals.
Listening to this, i can hear why some olderGenesis fans thought Phil had thin voice. But this is a shadowofthe vocals that came later in his career. Istil think thisis very hood though.

Battle Of Epping Forest
We start with a march rising slowly almost sounding mono and then spreading around us beautifully.
Then the song kicks in
There is so much going on in this song, surround is where it should have always been.
I have to start this again, man this is cool!
That intro is sensational....
The little guitar riffs are beautifully left and right side rears.
The little clucking guitar effect sits wonderfully in the left rear.
We get the little synth break sitting in the middle of the room.
I was a little concerned i ay have overstated how much i like this mix, but i like it even more than that.
Listening properly, this mix is magic.
When we get to the little jig in the middle, the right and left side guitars again sound great.
Gabriel's vocals are fantastic, and he could be stood right in front of me.
Some folks think this is too wordy, but that is part of ats appeal to me.
I assume the bluray is the same mix.. get the sacd or the bluray, it is so worth it if you like Genesis at all.
At certain points it felt like my head was inside Banks' keyboard.
F'n magnificent.

After The Ordeal
A wonderful little interlude with acoustic guitar and piano.
Layered well and again, and filling the listening space really well.
Often seen as a piece of filler by some this is a magnificent composition. Genesis at their melodic best.

Cinema Show
The wonderful guitar intro slowly walks into the rears, and again that balance.
Terrible thing to say, but I'm glad the Mrs is having a nap.
We get to the la lala section and the vocals sound sensational.
For some reason i always think of the keyboard solo when i think of this song, but that is just a small part of it, this is great song.
The second half of the song is essentially the keyboard lead, but pay attention to how good the Collins, Rutherford, Hackett rhythm section is. The keys may be slightly too loud in the this, just slightly, nothing bad.
Then we get a part fade that leads directly into

Aisle Of Plenty
Essentially a reprise, but I think of it as just a part of Cinema show.
We get some Gabriel vocals coming from all directions, making great use of the layers.

Wow, to actually sit and listen to this mix properly. When we did the Genesis thread, I was listening to the songs, I did listen to the surround, but it was one of those modern distracted listens. Browsing SHF while doing it and that kind of thing. Do yourself a favour and shut everything out and just listen to the mix. This is a great album, and for me, surround is where it belongs.
Highly recommended.

 

Reference to the albums

Jackson Browne - Running On Empty - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Ray Charles - Ray Sings, Basie Swings - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Jimi Hendrix - Electric Ladyland - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Sly And The Family Stone - Greatest Hits - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
The Allman Brothers Band - Live At Fillmore East - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Gentle Giant - The Power and The Glory - Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Alice Cooper - Welcome To My Nightmare Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Yes - Close To The Edge Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Queen - A Night At The Opera Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Bob Dylan - Blonde On Blonde Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Emerson Lake And Palmer - Brain Salad Surgery Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
The Flaming Lips - Yoshimi Battles the Pink Robots Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
David Bowie - The Rise And Fall Of Ziggy Stardust And The Spiders From Mars Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
ELO - debut album Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries
Genesis - Selling England By The Pound Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries

If the mood takes you, please feel free to give us your summary of any of these albums that we have done. For our purposes here, please try and give us information about the mix, in as much or as little detail as takes your fancy.
If you feel so inclined, review the album, and the mastering or anything else about the album that you feel drawn to.
Cheers,
Mark

 

The seven nominees for next week are here Surrounded On Sundays - 5.1/quad reviews and summaries

 

I love Genesis, but when it comes Selling England.., or any of the Nick Davis 5.1 mixes of the Genesis catalog, I grit my teeth. I know a lot of guys consider the surround mixes the best part, but to me they have the same harshness that makes the stereo versions unlistenable.

 

Like I said in my intro, I know some folks feel that way, but I love them. It's all good

 

I feel the Genesis surround mixes (or at least those I have: the Gabriel era albums) are really good regarding mixing. I remember listening to the coda on "Dancing With The Moonlit Knight" in 5.1 for the first time and feeling truly surrounded. Such beautiful music and use of space, like @mark winstanley pointed out.
Unfortunately, the mastering is not particularly laudable, especially for the stereo remixes, which are truly unbearable (everything's loud all the time). Anyway, despite the mastering flaws, and some original elements not being available, I enjoy the multichannel Genesis releases (honestly, those DVD's are the only reason why I never sold the 1970-1975 box set).

 

The Quadrophenia (The Who) blu ray is probably the best multichannel version of any album I've heard

 

I was listening to the sacd's, i know I'm not as sensitive to mastering issues as most, but are they likely to be anydifferent to the dvd's?
Has anybody checked?... i probably could, but i don't trust my judgement on those types of things these days.

 

ELO first is excellent and very discrete now where the F are all their other albums?

 

We'll be getting to it. It is good.

 

My thoughts exactly, perfect albums for surround

 

I have many multichannel discs and Quadrophenia is not one of the better ones. Love the album but was disappointed by the multichannel mix.

 

Yea, it's good, not great.
But the interesting thing about surround mixes, is how varied the expectations, and acceptable types are, in different people's minds

 

Great mix but a little light on the bass. I still love it though.

 

Well, that's unfortunate to hear about Quadrophenia. That one always seems to be a bit on the pricey side, so I haven't pulled the trigger on buying one yet.

There's an authorized Cure concert release from the early 2000's called 'Trilogy,' where they perform the entire albums of Pornography, Disintegration and Bloodflowers on two nights in Berlin. It's on DVD, no Blue ray to my knowledge, and has a 5.1 mix on it.

But I really don't know why they bothered with a surround mix, as there's hardly any use at all of the back channels. For such moody and atmospheric albums, they could have really enhanced the experience. And yet it sounds like 'amateur hour at the mixing console.'

Without hearing the surround mix of Quadrophenia, this Trilogy release is way at the top of the disappointment chart for me.

And yes, I realize it's a bit of apples to oranges, between a concert video and a studio album, but they both can fall into the 'what could have been' category.

 

Sadly I always expect concert 5.1's to be a little disappointing to me. So I am rarely disappointed. Having said that though when I get a thoughrful one, it is always a pleasure.
Trilogy is, or at least was on bluray.

We will go through Quadrophenia at some stage... I certainly don't dislike it.