"Tales from Topographic Oceans" Being Remixed by Steve Wilson

My understanding is that the flat transfer is only on the bluray. I also would be playing the set on a non bluray player or in my B&O system in my car , so I guess I have to see how I like the remix as Bill suggests and go from there. I will also purchase it for the surround mix which is probably worth the price alone. Thanks so much for your replies.

 

Have you actually listened to the "flat transfer" on the bluray?

The old Atlantic CD (which I never really liked, even if I know it's somewhat popular here) positively destroys it.

The new flat transfer sounds like errors were made in Dolby decoding or something. Never heard a version with so much treble and so little bass. Putrid. Even Wilson's remix is better.

 

i must agree with you.

 

I don't think the flat transfer of the original stereo master sounds that great. I'm sure it would sound a lot better if say Steve Hoffman were to remaster it using the flat transfer as his source. Flat transfers aren't always that great as they really need some mastering by the "right' mastering engineer. That's why mastering engineers exist to take the flat master and use their magic to make it sound as good as possible. I actually think for Tales the old Atlantic set sounds better then the flat transfer.

 

Hear for yourself.

Orig. Atlantic CD first, then it switches to the new Wilson stereo remix. Nothing done except I had to lower the volume on the Atlantic CD a bit.

RSOG ORIG. ATLANTIC CD/WILSON REMIX - Clyp »

 

OK fair comment re: the flat transfer of the TFTO master tape, as I haven't listened to it as yet and compared with the original Atlantic CD which was my past favourite of all the TFTO masterings. When I get some time.......too busy with the Stand Up Elevated Edition and the Paranoid Super Deluxe.

 

I'm listening to the flat transfer now and it is a little bass light (but not excessively so), and sounds rather nice otherwise to me, but not as good as the remix.

 

Which original mix do you prefer John, and why?

PS - My copy should have arrived from Amazon by Friday a week ago. Usually things turn up in Australia a week or a few days early. So a week late is worrying. So if it doesn't turn up tomorrow I'll report it lost to Amazon and see what happens. So it may still be many weeks before I finally get a copy in my hands!

 

Thanks Tim. Is the switch at around the 14 second point? I kind of like the Atlantic better based on this short clip and will probably keep it as well as purchasing the Wilson set. Then I will make a final determination. The 5.1 mix has received very good reviews so far.

 

Strange but this was cheaper(BR) on Amazon UK sent to the US tha getting it on Amazon US

 

Because it's manufactured in the UK, maybe?

 

I'll be curious to your thoughts on the comparison when you get the chance .

 

Personally, I prefer the flat transfer over the original Atlantic CD. I guess I place more importance on the better top end reproduction in the flat master, than the reduction in bottom end. The remix is my preference over both. The original Atlantic is a bit dull and phasey, but up until now has been the best sounding version. Both the remix and flat master are better.

 

Publishing costs are less outside the U.S.

 

I was just gently reminded that much earlier in the thread, I made a slightly-snarky post about endless ordering and shipping threads, and so I wanted to come back to this and try and contribute something a little more positive.

I bought the TFTO remix, listened to it several times -- Wilson, original, Wilson, back and forth. Enjoyed it.

And THEN a week or two later, on a whim, I checked out a bunch of different Stravinsky CD's from my local library, to reacquaint myself with Stravinsky from the somewhat modest or basic knowledge I had about him. Was thinking, because of hearing the "Firebird Suite" intro so many times on Progeny set and knowing they were into him, and all of that, then Tales happened. So I went on a binge, a deeper dive into Stravinsky, and WOW. As the saying goes, I really "heard into it". Hearing little passages in things like "Les Noces" (The Wedding) and being like, "oh, that!" So Stravinsky and Tales...highly recommended for additional insights and enjoyment!

 

He's right about the harsh and overbearing drums though. I normally just edit out the last 7 minutes of Ritual when I transfer a copy onto my computer. Not the case with this new mix. I was actually able to listen to it this time.

 

I read on Henry Potts' website that Tales is the last Yes title Steven Wilson is going to remix. Hopefully this isn't true. Anyone heard anything?

Where are they now? - Yes »

 

I like the way both mixes sound, but I do agree with much of your objective analysis of the new mix. One of my biggest complaints is the lack of reverb.

 

Just listened to some of the SW remix for the first time. By way of comparing it to the original mix I played a couple of excerpts back-to-back with the 2003 Rhino remaster (which is the only incarnation of the original mix currently in my possession). The sections I chose were the five minute segment from side two commencing with 'Don the cap...' and the opening of 'Ritual' (up to 'Nous sommes du soleil'). To be honest, I'm underwhelmed...

On my relatively modest hi-fi system (detailed in my profile) the main points of difference are that the Rhino sounds distinctly more juiced up. The Rhino is noticeably louder (on my Arcam amp my normal listening level for Rhino TFTO of 37 had to be cranked to 40 for an equivalent volume level when playing the SW remix). In addition, the bottom end is slightly boosted on the Rhino and the treble is crisper and sharper. In fact, the main tonal difference between the two versions is that the treble on the SW remix is softer and smoother. Based on the fact that TFTO is a fairly densely produced album, which has a tendency to sound a bit woolly and congested, I actually preferred the Rhino. It just punches harder and suits my modest system better.

I thought I was going to write reams and reams on the SW TFTO remix, delving into countless passages of music and pulling out revelatory differences that forced me to re-appraise the whole album leading to some sort of 'Road to Damascus'-type situation. Sadly not. Maybe the SW Yes stereo remixes sound great on expensive equipment, but on my system they just sound muted and a bit lifeless. The conclusion I have come to is that a bit of 'soft compression' (as Eroc quaintly puts it) and some judicious EQ tweaking makes these old analogue tapes come to life on my system. No amount of SW digital-mixing-desk wizardry compensates for that.

I know that many people here hate the Rhino, but it is still my go to version.

 

Yes some of us do mostly headphone listening or just stereo and I would think 5.1 on headphones would throw me in a real topographic ocean.
Although I do have SW's CTTE, a needed curiosity and all the Tull's whose TOTAL presentation and sound are really wonderful.

Nonetheless having seen The Relayer tour and Yes a few times earlier than Relayer, the appreciation of the album nowadays seems higher than then.
People then loved side 4, and side 1 while 2 and 3 were questioned as being a bit excessive with usual flashes of Yes magic.

Having the Gastwirts and the Rhinos and the Marino I am pretty covered but 5.1 is beginning to temp me.
Great post and I still have 15 pages left.
Wow

 

I was listening to the SW mix on my headphones the other day and I do love how smooth and fluid it sounds, it is very easy to listen to

 

Not in 5.1 I bet. ?

 

I do zero 5.1 listening, and buy Wilson's remixes just for the new stereo mixes, and other than the ELP albums, I have yet to be disappointed by any of the Yes, Tull and Crimson mixes of his.

 

About the mastering of the remix, does is sound warmer, more natural and closer to vinyl than the Atlantic 7567-81325-2 CD from 1988? And how different it is? The changes are subtle?

About the song titles, "Dance of the Dawn", for example, is considered a subtitle to "The Revealing Science of God", or it's a second part of it, or even a second song altogether? I ask that cause in some places the TFTO songs are written like "The Remembering (High the Memory)" with the second name as a subtitle, and in some places they are written like "The Remembering/High the Memory" with the second name as second part or maybe another song.

Cheers.

 

I think you'll find that the remix has not been mastered or, if it has, it has been only very gently mastered. Steven Wilson's stereo remixes and surround mixes tend not to be mastered.