Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Cyclone Ranger, Jul 18, 2019.
Does anyone know the Effective Mass on these new arms?
Yeah, I just think I have to be reading that wrong...
I got one on Amazon for about $6. It’s not an insurmountable problem, by any means, it’s just a weird instruction.
They do. Somewhere on YouTube there’s a guy that compares a 40 stylus (an FG70) to the regular Shibata on a 2M Black. Looks weird, but it works.
Print a protractor from this site. There are several different ones you can try including the default Technics version. Read the instructions before printing.
Free Cartridge Alignment Protractors - Vinyl Engine
I find aligning with a protractor alone significantly more difficult than getting the overhang right with the gauge and squaring the cartridge up in the headshell with the confirmation of digital calipers. I then confirm with a protractor, which has so far always shown the overhang gauge to get the arc and null points right on. If someone has an easier time setting overhang using a protractor than I do, and can be sure it prints accurately, this is probably fine, but to me, it’s worth the $6 to get a gauge if one was not included. Although, if you have a digital calipers out anyway, you could probably do just fine opening it up to 52 mm and eyeing it up, too.
So there are options, it’s just weird that Technic wouldn’t throw that little piece of plastic in the box and give the same instructions they do for the other models.
I have the little piece of plastic, I just don't have a Technics to go with it yet...
What is sorta disturbing is that “we” can’t, or are uncomfortable with, taking measurements in the metric system...Holy Sit...It’s a hair over 2”.................
The metric system is not the problem, it’s squaring up the measurement so you’re not getting the distance at an angle... the gauge makes this more reliable.
That was the Jack n Coke talking...quite callous on my part, sorry.
Without access to a pair of calipers, the overhang gauge is quite nice.
Gotta figure 12/13g like all the other 1200's right? Just guessing.
Depending on the protractor (Technics Arc on Vinyl Engine for instance), the 52mm gauge will be in a totally different overhang and alignment. Same with any Baerwald protractor. The Technics gauge is designed for simple convenience and is closest to a Stevenson alignment. There is another good protractor on Vinyl Engine called the Hoffman protractor as well. Lofgren B is pretty close to the 52mm spec but the cart is angled in towards the spindle a bit to maximize alignment with the inner grooves. Unlike the simple dual nullpoint Stevenson protractors, the Arc protractors are not moved during the alignment process so you need to lock the platter from moving at all.
My new alignment template generator- Vinyl Engine
Free Cartridge Alignment Protractors - Vinyl Engine (scroll down for the Technics Arc protractor)
Well, the 52mm will be in line with the Technics alignment, which is close to Stevenson but with a different overhang, so it’s kind of just its own alignment. Of course, if you want to try a different alignment, you can, but a lot of people seem to think the Technics alignment sounds pretty good (I hear no reason to change it). Other alignments, as you say for Lofgren B, probably need the cartridge angled in the headshell, where as the 52mm Technics alignment lets you mount it square.
I’m not sure where I got it, but somewhere I printed an arc protractor for Technics alignment, and the arc and null points are on the nuts when aligned with the gauge. I’ll see if I can remember to dig it out when I get a minute.
Yeah, the Technics ARC on vinyl engine will put the cartridge pretty far forward in the headshell and angled towards the spindle. The Technics plastic gauge does give decent performance and is good for most. I use it with my lower costs conicals and 3600. Lofgren B with my Denon 103 and AT120eb. I heard an improvement with Lofgren B especially on the inner grooves. I've even heard some people say that they use the Technics gauge and then give the cartridge a nudge towards the spindle to clean up the inner grooves. Might just as well use the Lofgren B to get it right on.
I'm afraid that is wrong @Boltman92124 - you are correct that the platter needs to be wedged so it doesn't move but the protractor does need to move. Below is the correct process for setting overhang to hit the arc on such a protractor:
Rotate the protractor so the arc falls under the stylus at the outer edge.
Move the cart in the headshell to align with the arc at the inner edge. Keep the protractor still for this part.
Repeat until the stylus follows the arc at all points.
Yeah that's what I meant to say sort of. Slide the protractor under the stylus initially. The Technics ARC comes with specific instructions which instruct to align the ARC at both the furthermost inner and outer points("C" points) by moving the cartridge only. Repeat process until hitting both ARC spots. Then move into the inner null points and align . The protractor is not moved after the initial step of aligning
From the instructions-
- Adjust the cartridge overhang (move back and forth in the headshell) until the stylus is able to follow the arc between the "C" points.
- Without moving the protractor from step 6, place the stylus tip on the center of the grid where it crosses the arc. Align so that the cantilever is parallel to the grid lines by rotating it in the headshell without altering overhang.
-Check that the stylus still follows the arc precisely.
Ah, makes sense but I think they shoulda tweaked the arm so people could use more higher complaint carts that are in use today.
The Nagaoka MM line has better res freq numbers than the Ortofon 2m line with the Bronze/Black going even further in the wrong direction.
The Ortofon MC3 Turbo should really shine.
Sumiko’s won’t be an optimal fit or the Goldring line.
Benz Micro Gold/Silver will be close to the sweet spot
The Art9’s definitely out
AT VM95L is in the money also the AT VM 540ml.
Of course these are just based off res freq numbers which isn’t the whole ball of wax.
I have two Technics 1600 MK2’s with the same effective mass and took a weekend to run all the numbers on the different carts in the $1000 and below range. Did this after finding out the Ortofon Bronze wasn't the best choice for the arm.
Another problem people will discover is that they won’t really want to use a different headshell than the one that’s supplied. Most other headshells are heavier and will make the compliance even more difficult.
Plus the arm mass includes the Technics headshell (about 7g) I believe. I still don't understand how they measure it. "Effective mass". Obviously, the tonearm weighs much more than 5 or 6 G. The new Mk7 is my next turntable. Hopefully sometime later this year!
Technics never did this arrangement. They used the common plastic overhang gauge we know and love, never by 45 adapter.
I have the piece of plastic, and a SL-1500 to go with it. And a MCS (a Technics model under an assumed name). Easy tip for Technics owners. Want to make cartridge installation for most easy, buy an Audio-Technica AT-MG 10 headshell (Japanese gray market import, available on eBay). The second hole from the front on most cartridges, corresponds to Stevenson geometry.
And quite a few Rega products, especially lower end tend to deserve some honest criticism. As they have shortcomings until upgraded. In Technics' favor, I never had to buy a subplatter for one, never had to buy a power supply for one, this even applies to lower end Technics models by the way, some of which cost less than a P1. I am not necessarily a fanboy, but I do like reliable equipment, which performs well, is low maintenance, and just works and keeps working. Without fuss or frippery. And I can say the same positive things about my Pioneer PL 518, and the Realistic LAB 300 I also own.
Fair criticism. I myself have absolutely no use for Rega’s ‘lifestyle’ turntables, aka the P1 and P2.
Perhaps they’re a better value in the UK.
Maybe this was asked earlier in the thread, if so apologies. But how does the Pioneer PLX1000 compare (spec wise or tone wise) to the SL1200mk7. I know the Pioneer was basically a clone of an older SL model, but for $700 or less, seems like a pretty good value right now.
$999 and stack the next 15% or whatever Guitar Center coupon that’s mailed out next will get the price much closer to the PLX.
Don’t those coupons usually not apply to Technics TTs?
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