The Ballad of Mott the Hoople and Ian Hunter - Album by Album thread

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by onlyconnect, Oct 16, 2016.

  1. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion Thread Starter

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    Good interview with Ian Hunter here, quite a lot about the early years:

    Why Ian Hunter is the Ultimate Rock Boy in the Band »

    "It was chaos," Hunter recalls of the live shows. "What would happen was there was more or less an army that went 'round everywhere we played. And they would get onstage with us. It was their band as much as it was our band."

    Tim
     
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  2. elborak

    elborak Forum Resident

    Better to get the superior Two Miles From Live Heaven.

    I always wondered why this lyric was, apparently, self-censored on Brain Capers when "The Moon Upstairs" already dropped an F-bomb. I can't believe they were considering it for a single...
     
  3. The Panda

    The Panda Forum Mutant

    Location:
    Marple, PA, USA
    Hehe, you should hear what Ian did to Rock and Roll Queen in Paris. It was even broadcasted but I guess no one knew English.
     
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  4. jerrygene

    jerrygene Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    The turning point toward notoriety and greatness.
    All the future and past elements were in motion here.
     
  5. eelkiller

    eelkiller One of the great unwashed

    Location:
    Northern Ontario
    Yeah the original was on Windsong IIRC and the reissue is supposedly identical. Either will do just fine, the cheapest I could find lately was on Discogs.
     
  6. fab432

    fab432 “To the toppermost of the poppermost, Johnny!”

    Location:
    Toronto
    Interesting interview but I wonder if the writer knew the song title was "All the Way FROM Memphis"

    Getting into Mott the Hoople at a later date means I missed all the early releases. This was unfortunate because as I went back into the catalouge I was expecting something similar to where I was but that was not the case. It was different still good but different. Therefore it took me much longer to really appreciate how good the early material is. That was certainly the case with Brain Capers.
     
    onlyconnect likes this.
  7. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Same with me, it's not quite the glitter/glam of the Mott album. Often it is the same with other artists as well. One needs to be open minded to appreciate very different earlier eras of groups or artists.

    But the payoff is there in this case. I love finding classic albums that rate so high, yet are never on those Mojo lists of top 100 albums. Obscure titles are fun.
     
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  8. Braincapers

    Braincapers Forum Resident

    Can't go wrong with Braincapers 'the last bit of good luck...or bad luck' they had
     
  9. Tim S

    Tim S Senior Member

    Location:
    East Tennessee
    Probably not, he actually came up with this incredible clunker: "It was his proverbial burning bush on the road to Damascus."

    :eek:

    It's ok to not know the Bible all that well, but if that's the case, then either don't try and use examples from it, or at least check the ones you do use.
     
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  10. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion Thread Starter

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    Fairfield Halls Croydon 13th Sept 1970

    [​IMG]
    1.Ohio
    2.No Wheels To Ride
    3.Rock 'n' Roll Queen
    4.Thunderbuck Ram
    5.When My Mind's Gone
    6.Keep a-Knockin'
    7.You Really Got Me

    Stockholm, Sweden 16 Feb 1971
    1.Long Red
    2.The Original Mixed Up Kid
    3.Walkin' With A Mountain
    4.Laugh At Me
    5.Thunderbuck Ram

    If you have been following this thread, you will know the gist of what went wrong in Mott the Hoople’s Island years (or at least one aspect of it), which is that the band was immensely popular live but lacked success in record sales. One likely factor was that the albums, excellent though they were in many ways, lacked the energy of the concerts, at least up until Brain Capers.

    The obvious solution would have been to record a live album, and in September 1970 exactly that was planned. Two shows were recorded at Fairfield Halls Croydon, where Mott were supporting Free.

    The concerts were a little over-energetic and the tapes were deemed unusable due to connections being inadvertently pulled from the mobile 8-track machine borrowed from The Who. However, Keep a Knockin’ was salvaged from the tapes and included incongruously on Wildlife, the band’s softest album.

    The band’s biographer Campbell Devine remarks, “Over 20 years later, reappraisal of the Croydon tapes reveals the scrapping of the recordings to be a considerable misjudgement on Guy Stevens part, as the tracks survive unscathed, intact and almost wholly useable in Island’s archive.”

    In 2007 Angel Air released Fairfield Halls Live 1970, though only 7 of the 12 tracks on the CD are actually from Croydon. Even so, it is powerful evidence for what a fantastic show Mott put on in this era. “This group’s about to wreck your mind completely, absolutely,” says the announcer – could it be Guy Stevens? The performance opens with a muscular cover of CSNY’s Ohio, with Mick Ralph’s reedy voice a good substitute for that of Neil Young. Next up is No Wheels to Ride from Mad Shadows, then the concert takes off with a performance of Rock ‘n’ Roll Queen that makes the studio version seem slow and tame.

    The group is warmed up now, and moves into the excellent Thunderbuck Ram, sounding as thunderous as it should, and described as “a number off the Bumpers album” – Mad Shadows was yet to be released.

    Things calm down a tad for When My Mind’s Gone, but not for long, as Mott closes its short support set with Keep a Knockin’ in a different take from that included on Wildlife. There is also an encore, an eight minute instrumental version of You Really Got Me from the first album.

    Tacked on to the CD are five songs from a Stockholm concert in early 1971. The funny thing about this event is the polite applause from the audience, who clearly were not engaging with the music in the way that Mott expected. “It would be nice if you helped us, don’t sit all tight, loosen up!” says Hunter, without much success. It’s still a high quality recording and an energetic performance, including a cover of Mountain’s Long Red, Walking with a Mountain from Wildlife, Laugh at Me from the debut album, and another strong performance of Thunderbuck Ram. It still sounds a bit tame compared to the Croydon set. An additional song from Stockholm, Keep a Knockin’, is available on the release From Stockholm to Philadelphia.

    The interesting point of speculation is what would have happened if Island had in fact released Mott the Hoople Live instead of Wildlife. It would have almost certainly been more successful, though whether it would have delivered the hit album the band needed is still open to question; it would not have solved the problem of “where’s the hit single”.

    Nevertheless, if you like the original wild and dangerous Mott the Hoople this is an essential listen.

    The CD is out of print; it was reissued as part of an In Performance box but that is also out of print.

    A review on Amazon uk provides a first-hand account of the original event:

    I was at this gig, 16 years old, and I kind of understand why they may not have released it before... it was wild. Overend was travelling fifty feet out into the audience with a long lead, clambering over seats - the Fairfield Halls is an all seated venue built for Classical concerts - I would expect a few extra or missing bass notes resulted! Ian Hunter invited the audience up on stage - soon you couldn't see any band members at all and probably half the recording equipment was knocked over.

    ... I had seen Mott the Hoople and Free several times before at the better venue across the street - the Greyhound. At the time I thought it was ridiculous that Mott supported the Free - I watched a couple of Free's songs, then walked out, along with many others. Early Mott the Hoople at the Greyhound were among the best gigs I've ever seen, just amazing. So this is the proper Mott the Hoople with Mick Ralphs and Verden Allen, and in their prime. As you can probably tell, I haven't even heard this yet, I only just found it was out, but I know it will be a real recording of a band that could really tear it up live. And they liked those Croydon gigs too, as they say in the later "Saturday Gigs".​
     
  11. old school

    old school Senior Member

    Paul Kossoff of the Free would blow Mick Ralphs off the stage, Kossoff was a much more accomplished guitarist in my opinion.
     
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  12. John Fell

    John Fell Forum Survivor

    Location:
    Undisclosed
    Free and Mott The Hoople would have been a great show to see. I have this show somewhere and I remember when I got it thinking it was a good show with good sound for the era. They should have released it back then.
     
  13. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Music is not a competition> Both guitarists have strong poiints. Just different from each other. Paul Kossoff wasted his talents (and life) in a cloud of drugs.

    A concert with Free & Mott The Hoople in a quality venue sounds like an excellent gig to me. 2 bands I would love to have seen live.
     
  14. old school

    old school Senior Member

    I never said it was a competition. I was responding to this quote in post # 135." I had seen Mott the Hoople and Free several times before at the better venue across the street - the Greyhound. At the time I thought it was ridiculous that Mott supported the Free - I watched a couple of Free's songs, then walked out, along with many others."
     
  15. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    I wonder what the current day 16 year old would think of walking out on a Free gig after a few songs these days. Probably similar feeling to those who booed the newly electrified Dylan.

    So if it is not a competition how or why did you declare a winner & a loser.

    I think the loser was the 16 year old (Not unusual for teenagers to have silly poorly formed opinions)
     
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  16. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Fairfield Halls Croydon 13th Sept 1970

    I've just finished my re listen.

    Great quality sound for both concerts. Because they have kept the tracks from each concert together the album lacks a proper sense of flow & Thundrbuck Ram appears twice.
    Storming performances from the band with prominent guitar & organ and great drive from bass & drums. It maybe lacks a few of their stronger songs.
    I think this would have been a great release if they had released it back in the day.
    Most definately worthy of seeking out a copy. I'd rate it 7 out of 10

    A bit of background on Swedish bootleg recordings back in the day.

    From 1984 to @ 1990 I owned & ran a second hand record shop. One day I had a visit from a man carrying a small suitcase full of sample bootleg lp's which he told me were all recorded in Sweden & were excellent sound quality.
    The reason for the high quality sound he told me was due to the fact that Swedish labour laws insisted that all concert stage & sound personnel was to be provided by locals. This meant that as part of a concert all overseas touring bands had their equipment set up by employees of the venue. A by product of this situation was that the venue would record all performances. This lead to the situation that bands either wouldn't play in Sweden or would play in the knowledge that a live recording would result. Many bands saw this as an opportunity to get some product out into the market. Although the bands had little control over the released product it was better than free because they were paid for the concert.
    Due to a number of reasons I never entered into an arrangement with the guy to sell his products and can not recall if I heard any of the lp's. I can not recall any of the artists in his samples.
     
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  17. I think that Wild Life is a good album but it's such a radical departure that some folks have a hard time with it. It's a quiet lull between two massive sounding albums.
     
  18. old school

    old school Senior Member

    No winner or loser just the facts period.
     
  19. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    I think you've mistaken opinions with facts
     
  20. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Thunderbuck Ram

    I've just comapred two versions. The 1st on Mad Shadows (Angel Air release) & the 2nd on Strangely Strange But Oddly Normal.
    The 2nd version definately worth checking out. For me the more prominent organ gives it a real lift.

    I'm thinkig that Verdun Allen has been sadly underated by me over the years
     
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  21. old school

    old school Senior Member

    Fair enough.
     
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  22. Alien Reg

    Alien Reg Forum Resident

    I can't find the post, but earlier someone mentioned that Guy Stevens believed recording an album should be an event, not some routine job. How right he was, and God bless him for it! So many times you read about bands, past and present, moaning about "having to go into the studio". The best bits of Mott's Island years are due to Guy's philosophy - "Come on, you're young and in a band - these are the best days of your life!!!"
     
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  23. elborak

    elborak Forum Resident

    Whether I agree with this comparison or not, no one claimed that Ralphs blew Kossoff off the stage; they claimed that Mott blew Free off the stage.

    And if you listen to live Mott from this era, it's easy to understand why some felt this way.
     
  24. old school

    old school Senior Member

    I saw Mott on there third American tour in 1972 good live band. I also saw Free in 1972. In my opinion Mott is a very capable rock band but blowing Free off the stage never happened.
     
  25. Kingsley Fats

    Kingsley Fats Forum Resident

    Some folks like apples more than oranges. Some folks like oranges more than apples. & some folks like them both
     

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