The Beatles' "Rubber Soul" - Putting together the proper tracklist

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by yesstiles, Dec 23, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. A well respected man

    A well respected man Some Mother's Son

    Location:
    Madrid, Spain
    Why should he know which version inspired Brian? I think the truth is still to be determined.
     
  2. DRM

    DRM Forum Resident

    This is silly.
     
    notesfrom likes this.
  3. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    You have no way of knowing this. If it had the same effect all over the world why did 90% of the bands inspired by it, to succeed, come from the US and the UK?

    Next, look at the respective sales figures to try and suss out how influential they were.
     
    notesfrom likes this.
  4. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    Just taking a stab here, but maybe because he was there?
     
    schnitzerphilip and notesfrom like this.
  5. Dean R

    Dean R Forum Resident

    EMI owned Capitol because they needed someone to market records in the world's biggest music market.
     
  6. Dean R

    Dean R Forum Resident

    Which was no worse than any other band who was signed directly to a record label.
    And earned them more money per record than many who weren't and were supposedly being paid a bigger royalty.
     
  7. Dean R

    Dean R Forum Resident

    If you're asking that question it's the UK version.
    Sold more around the world and since 87 has sold more than it had ever previously sold in that format alone. (I suspect it has outsold the US version in the US by now - although I'm happy to be proved wrong on that)
     
  8. Dean R

    Dean R Forum Resident

    Millions.
    I'm not sure the Rubber Soul sold that in the 60s.
     
  9. Dean R

    Dean R Forum Resident

    This includes sales of the CD which is of course the UK version
     
    BeatleJWOL likes this.
  10. A well respected man

    A well respected man Some Mother's Son

    Location:
    Madrid, Spain
    And Drive My Car has three words, and uses "my" in the middle, just like In My Life... so I guess Drive My Car communicates too... :shh:


    I never said anything about tone. I think both versions have multiple tones. What I said is that opening the album with IJSAF may set a certain mood some listeners may associate with the album, but even that mood changes throughout the different songs.


    I don't know what you are talking about, and I'm not sure you know either. It seems to me you are just trying to find justifications for the four discarded tracks. You are overthinking this.

    And by the way, Nowhere Man sounds like nothing The Beatles had done before, and IINS was inspired by The Bells of Rhymney, which was released after Help! had been completed, so neither could be in Help!
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
  11. Bill

    Bill Senior Member

    Location:
    Eastern Shore
    Well, we can listen to Dexter's boss, Capitol then-President Alan Livingston, discuss Dexter's remarkable performance. As you may recall, after Dexter had passed on the Beatles for Capitol twice in 1962-63, they instead signed a record contact with US label Vee-Jay. However, Vee-Jay defaulted on the payment of royalties due under the agreement and, by telegram dated August 8, 1963, EMI's US agent sent Vee-Jay a telegram terminating the agreement. This gave Capitol a fresh right of refusal for the recordings of EMI artists the Beatles and Frank Ifield, both covered under the breached and terminated Vee-Jay agreement. Around this time, Livingston started getting calls from London about the Beatles' success. This prompted him to discuss the Beatles with Dexter at a weekly Capitol staff meeting. Livingston recalls:
    "So, at one meeting, I said, 'Dex, what about the Beatles? I read a lot about them and they're doing well in London.' He said, 'Alan, they're a bunch of long-haired kids. They're nothing. Forget it.' I said, 'OK.' I trusted Dexter. And I had no interest in British product at this point. And so a few weeks went by and I began to get nervous because of the British press, I could tell they were doing really well, so I said, 'Dex, what about the Beatles?' And he said, 'Alan, forget it, they're nothing.' I said 'OK.' And so we turned them down." In the letter so notifying the Beatles and rejecting their new single ("She Loves You"), it advised of its conclusion that the group would not do anything in America. According to Capitol, the Beatles' music was not suitable for the American market. Upon Dexter's recommendation, Capitol did exercise its newly- restored rights for Frank Ifield's recordings in the US. Notwithstanding Dexter's marketing/packaging genius, the Ifield single peaked at 57 on the Billboard charts.- Bruce Spizer, The Beatles Are Coming (2003) at 40-43.
    Denigrate the contributions of "rank amateurs" Brian Epstein and George Martin during this period, transforming a small-time local combo into the world's top music act, at your peril. Remember, though, often, it is better to remain quiet and be thought a fool than to speak, and remove all doubt.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
    goodiesguy, gja586, dsdu and 5 others like this.
  12. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    It sold nearly 2 million in the US by the end of 1965 alone - in less than a month. So, yeah, millions.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
  13. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    Exactly.
     
  14. A well respected man

    A well respected man Some Mother's Son

    Location:
    Madrid, Spain
    Well, the bands that came from the UK would be inspired by the original album, wouldn't they? As for the rest of the world, I live in a country which is not the US or the UK, and I know how important and influential this album was. Maybe you just don't know the bands that received that influence.

    There are very few trustworthy sales figure records from the 60s, even the 70s in some countries. And I don't think that has anything to do with it. The original album was a milestone in the countries where it was released, and the US album the same. So logic dictates that's not becuase of the tracklist differences, but because it showcased 10 of the 14 songs from the original.
     
  15. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    Not Brian.
     
  16. Evethingandnothing

    Evethingandnothing Forum Resident

    Location:
    Devon
    Isn't that because 90% of successful bands known in the US and UK come from the US or UK. Not sure why that is, but hey ho. I know that the influential German band Can were influenced by psychedelic era Beatles.
     
    A well respected man likes this.
  17. thrivingonariff

    thrivingonariff Forum Resident

    Location:
    US
    +1 (Countdown to someone making the argument that the US album was a milestone because of the inclusion of two particular songs.........released on the previous UK album. :laugh:
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
    A well respected man and Gila like this.
  18. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    Logic? The US RS was a monster and sold many many more copies than the UK version in the 60s. Beyond that you and I don't know. We don't know any way to evaluate the influnce of RS in Spain, but we know the bands formed in response to it were in the US and UK, except for Los Bravos. The US RS was the one that got a reputation and became shorthand for something musical, when musicians talked about music, post-RS.
     
  19. MPLRecords

    MPLRecords Owner of eleven copies of Tug of War

    Location:
    Lake Ontario
    The album released in the country with a population of 54.35 million was outsold by the album released in the country with a population of 194.3 million. I'm shocked.
     
  20. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    Can are part of the 10%.

    I think if we are talking about influence you have to look at who was inspired by RS to make a successful band, and where they were from. I'm going to give you Can becuase they are well known to us here.
     
  21. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    I'm glad you are open to this fact. The logical inference from it is that the US RS was more influential than, well the UK RS, but also in all probability, than any other LP ever.
     
  22. Evethingandnothing

    Evethingandnothing Forum Resident

    Location:
    Devon
    Well that's so specific that I wouldn't know where to begin such a search.
     
  23. drad dog

    drad dog A Listener

    Location:
    USA
    I don't want to send anyone on a search. Just common sense is required.
     
  24. Bill

    Bill Senior Member

    Location:
    Eastern Shore
    That's the argument. Those two Help holdovers changed the history of the world.
     
    goodiesguy, cublowell, Gila and 3 others like this.
  25. simond9x

    simond9x Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I love this. Thanks, Bill. I'm glad we all enjoyed our own versions of Beatles LPs and respect each other's preferences. At the end of it all, it' is just pop music, beautiful pop music. So thanks to the Beatles, George Martin, Brian Epstein and even good old Dave Dexter Jr! I'm 'unwatching' this thread now. It's run its course.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine