The Byrds: song by song thread (1965-67) and beyond! *

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Hombre, Feb 1, 2019.

  1. Hombre

    Hombre Forum Resident Thread Starter

    The original version by the Byrdfeaters...

     
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  2. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    You beat me to it.
    Believe it or not, the final chord in It Won't Be Wrong is the so called Steely Dan Mu Major chord. In case you may not know, it is a major chord with an added 2nd. The harmonies at the end of It Won't Be Wrong form that chord. An E Mu Major chord.
    I don't know where McGuinn heard it before the Byrds. Maybe Herbie Hancock?
    Good catch.
     
  3. Rfreeman

    Rfreeman Senior Member

    Location:
    Lawrenceville, NJ
    So 2nd in the same octave, not a +9?
    What does Mu mean?
     
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  4. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    Know that I think about it, the chord formed at the end of The Byrds song is a added 9 and not the Mu Major chord. Just guessing from a quick listen to the way the harmonies are voiced.
    I think you are right and it is a +9.
    I have guessed that Steely Dan got Mu from "mutated".
     
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  5. MikeM

    MikeM Senior Member

    Location:
    Youngstown, Ohio
    I have always played that final chord as a Bm with an E bass. When you think about it, that's roughly equivalent to an Em9 — the notes would be E-B-F#-B-D-F#, whereas a standard Em9 voicing might be E-B-E-G-D-F#. The only thing missing in the first voicing is the G.
     
  6. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    I have trouble hearing the chord formed in vocal harmonies at times.
    You are probably right.
    Just for my own sake, I thought that a B Minor chord with an E in the bass is equivalent to an E 7th Sus 2. The third is omitted making it a Sus 2 chord.
    But you are right, without the third it is roughly equivalent to the Em9 but I think technically the chord without the G is an E 7th Sus2.
    I was wrong calling it a Mu Major chord. Definitely no third (G)- as you have pointed out- in the Byrds song.
    Of course I am getting way outside the scope of the thread but what the heck it is fun to discuss. A cool way to end the song. I wonder who thought of it? Probably McGuinn.
     
  7. Dylancat

    Dylancat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    Good info
     
  8. Dylancat

    Dylancat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    Yea.
    A very neat way to end that song.
    An Inventive idea in rock...
    (But that’s the Byrds....that’s what they did)
     
  9. idleracer

    idleracer Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    :kilroy: The main thing that makes this different from the re-recorded version is the mix. Instead of the guitars being spread out and the vocals centered, it's the other way 'round. The guitars are both in the middle, Gene's voice is panned slightly to one side and Roger's & David's (obviously singing into the same microphone) panned slightly over to the other. This is one of those Byrds tracks where Gene and Roger never seem to overlap each other, and there are three distinct notes being sung throughout.
     
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  10. Hombre

    Hombre Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Set You Free This Time. Time to shine for Clark, who wrote and sang this song. It's the almost-talking kind of tune, still very pleasant and well performed. It ends with some cool harmonica playing. Very good track, though I can understand why it couldn't climb higher on the charts when it was released as a single.

     
  11. MikeM

    MikeM Senior Member

    Location:
    Youngstown, Ohio
    It is a beautiful song, and Crosby stars here not only on harmonies but also with the sliding double-stop parts he plays throughout, which really add a lot to the song's effectiveness.

    But still hard to imagine how anyone thought this could have been a Top 40 hit. Gene got screwed from two directions, with "Feel a Whole Lot Better" and this one.
     
  12. jwb1231970

    jwb1231970 Ordinary Guy

    Location:
    USA
    In my top three of all time favorite songs. Brilliant majestic soul music
     
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  13. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    Set You Free This Time

    Starts off with a cool country like guitar figure and then the verse is a Dylan inspired deal that stays in D major. The verses end on the A dominant chord but returns to D. The section repeats at :17 and then at :29 Gene brilliantly holds on the A chord in the pre chorus (departure) section and deceptively changes key to A major but our ears don’t know that yet. Fantastic way to both add tension and momentum to hold on the A chord in the pre chorus. Gene ends the departure (pre chorus) section on the D chord at :37 and it kind of tricks our ear into thinking we are back in D. The chorus then follows going back to the A chord and then the E chord to establish the new key of A. Brilliant use of key changes and delaying the cadences to establish the key change. Everything repeats and Gene sounds great on the vocals. Beautiful harmonies. It sounds like Gene voice is overdubbed. Everything repeats and Crosby plays his usual fantastic fills. At 2:24 Gene plays a laid back Dylan like harmonica line to bring the short but brilliant song to an end.

    Another amazing Clark penned tune. Genius use of key changes that are so subtle that you never know they are happening until just the right time. A standard song structure but atypical use of key changes. Killer song.
     
  14. MarcS

    MarcS Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    I wonder if the politics of getting this song released as an A side and it’s subsequent failure played a part in Gene’s decision to leave.
     
  15. PhilBorder

    PhilBorder Senior Member

    Location:
    Sheboygan, WI
    IDK, I think it should have been a huge hit. Gene had great presence as a front man, and he really gets the song across, even though their lip synching

     
  16. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    Good question. Maybe @Clarkophile will have some insight into it.
     
  17. idleracer

    idleracer Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    :kilroy: I can. It simply doesn't sound like an A-side when juxtaposed with everything else on the charts at the time. When surrounded by the likes of "Nowhere Man," "19th Nervous Breakdown," "Try Too Hard," "Shapes Of Things," and "Going To A Go Go," it just sort of lies there.

    It has a lot of words but not a lot of notes. One only needs a range of about a third of an octave to sing it.
     
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  18. Hombre

    Hombre Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Lay Down Your Weary Tune. A rendition of a Dylan's song that was a leftover of his album The Times They Are A-Changin'. Bass sounds good, quite prominent. I like the tune even if it's a bit weary.

     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2019
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  19. jwb1231970

    jwb1231970 Ordinary Guy

    Location:
    USA
    Album filler
     
  20. idleracer

    idleracer Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    :kilroy: It's noteworthy for three reasons:

    :whistle: It was the first version of this tune that was available to the general public.
    :whistle: Like "Farewell Angelina," it's a not-too-common example of a Dylan give-away tune that had not began it's life as a Witmark demo.
    :whistle: The chorus features four-part harmony instead of three, thus making this Chris Hillman's vocal debut on a Byrds record.

    :kilroy: The song itself is pleasant, but nothing special.
     
  21. Hombre

    Hombre Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Interesting facts, thanks.
     
  22. Rose River Bear

    Rose River Bear Senior Member

    Subterranean Homesick Blues made it to number 39 earlier in the year and it falls squarely into your description. IMO not a determining factor as to why it was not a big hit.
     
  23. Hombre

    Hombre Forum Resident Thread Starter

    There are always exceptions, but I still think that "Set You Free This Time" was not the best selection for an A-side. The song certainly has several merits and in my opinion it's one of the best tracks of the album; but it didn't have hit potential, as it was actually proved.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2019
  24. richierichie

    richierichie My glass is always full.

    Sorry to be one song behind. If I was hooked by Mr Tambourine Man and I'll Feel A Whole Lot Better, 'Set You Free This Time' was the song that got right under my skin. A beautiful song that made me aware of Gene Clark and his magnificent songwriting. A timeless tune from a timeless band.
     
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  25. Dylancat

    Dylancat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    Hmmm.
    I think this track by the Byrds is extremely under appreciated.
    This is a very good, and very poetic folk rock song with a fat bass, cool 12 string picking on right speaker, and incredible vocal group harmony on the chorus.
    It’s a companion piece to “Turn, Turn, Turn”
    Listen to them back to back and you will see what I mean.
     

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