The Definitive Single Versions Part 1 (1958-1969)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Bob Lovely, Jun 15, 2002.

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  1. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Friends,

    Recently on the Album version v. Single version thread I agree to research my collection for definitive single versions. This past week I spent about 15 hours on this fun project. Quickly, I realized that this project needed to be divided into parts because of the shear volume of information, lest I have HZ shutting down my thread for excessive use of memory on a server. Part 1 covers Top 40 music from the beginning of the Stereo era (circa 1958) through the decade of the 60's. In the near future, I will post a thread on the definitive single versions of the 70's so, please, lets hold off on those 70's posts in this thread. Anyone is, of course, welcome to beat me to a thread on the definitive singles versions of the 70's (Grant?).

    This thread is not a "Mono is better" thread. Rather a posting of the definitive single versions from a time when AM Top 40 Radio (Mono) and jukeboxes (Mono) were the primary vehicles for singles to be promoted as hits. Not until the late 60's did FM Radio begin to become a viable vehicle for the promotion of hit singles.

    I will post this list in a rough chronological order. I will not list Mono single versions where there is no known Stereo version or where the Stereo version has never been officially released (Phil Spector produced recordings by the Crystals, Ronettes, etc.) I will not list single versions where there is a highly faithful Stereo mix that is very close to the Mono single mix (i.e. Elvis, Roy Orbison, etc.). I will not post the versions that we have discussed in this Forum on a regular basis (Beatles, Rolling Stones, Who). I will not list any Motown hits because, generally, with Motown the Mono single versions are "the" definitive versions, period! Far too many of the Motown Stereo versions up until the late 60's are plagued by inferior, sloppy mixes containing distortion, artifacts and over bright high end. There are exceptions, of course. At some time in the future I will post a thread on the definitve Stereo versions of hits from this same time period.

    The Criteria

    Mix:The Stereo mix for this song is not faithful to the original Mono single version. This can include instrument and vocal placement or where there is no "middle" on the Stereo mix.

    Impact:The Stereo version does not have the correct impact of the Mono single version. This can be a product of the mix and the amount of compression used on the Mono single version during mastering for the 45.

    Low End:The Stereo version of this hit is missing or weak on the low end as compared to the correct Mono single version.

    Version:The Mono single mix is a different recording or such a different mix that the two versions sound like different recordings. Beginning in the late 60's Stereo single versions were created and the correct Stereo single versions will be so listed where applicable.

    * denotes a Mono single version that, to the best of my knowedge, is not available on CD.

    1950's

    For Your Precious Love--Jerry Butler & the Impressions* 1958 (Mix)

    Shimmy, Shimmy Ko-Ko-Bop--Little Anthony & the Imperials* 1959 (Mix)
    There is a sonic problem on every Stereo mix I have heard with vocal simbience break up.

    Shout--Isley Brothers 1959* (Mix, Impact, Low End)
    The Mono version has more bass and impact.

    Splish, Splash--Bobby Darin 1958 (Impact)
    The Stereo version is less wet, however.

    Lonely Teardrops--Jackie Wilson (Impact, Mix)
    The Stereo version has less impact and it is too wet.

    I've Had It--Bell Notes 1959 (Impact) (for Todd)

    Mack The Knife--Bobby Darin 1959 (Mix, Impact)
    The Stereo master has a "gain-riding" problem about mid-way through the song. The HDCD mastered Stereo is the best Stereo version.

    1960's

    Will You Love Me Tomorrow--Shirelles 1960 (Impact, Mix)

    He Will Break Your Heart--Jerry Butler 1960* (Mix, Impact)
    The Stereo version is also too wet.

    Runaway--Del Shannon 1961 (Impact)

    Hundred Pounds Of Clay--Gene McDaniels 1961* (Impact, Low End)

    Girl Of My Best Friend--Ral Donner 1961 (Impact)

    Tossin' And Turnin'--Bobby Lewis 1961* (Impact, Version)
    The correct Mono single version has no intro.

    The Lion Sleeps Tonight--Tokens* 1961 (Impact, Mix)
    While this hit was always wet, the Stereo version is too wet.

    You Don't Know What You've Got (Until You Lose It)--Ral Donner 1961 (Impact, Low End)

    Big Girls Don't Cry--Four Seasons 1962 (Impact, Low End)

    Sheila--Tommy Roe 1962 (Version, Impact)
    The Mono single mix has been reported to be another recording. The Stereo version doe not have the impact of the Mono single version.

    Duke Of Earl--Gene Chandler 1962* (Mix, Impact)
    The Stereo version simply never sounds very good. There is some vocal simbience break up.

    Sealed With A Kiss--Brian Hyland 1962* (Mix, Impact)
    The Stereo has that annoying reverb channel bounce.

    Baby Workout--Jackie Wilson 1963 (Impact, Low End)

    He's So Fine--Chiffons 1963 (Impact, Low End))
    The recent first Stereo mix is fun but, is missing the impact of the Mono version.

    Deep Purple--Nino Tempo & April Stevens 1963 (Mix, Impact)

    Bad To Me--Billy J. Kramer and the Dakotas 1964 (Mix, Impact)

    She's Not There--Zombies 1964 (Mix, Impact)
    The instrument placement on the Stereo mix is very different.

    Dawn--Four Seasons 1964 (Impact, Mix)

    Rag Doll--Four Seasons 1964 (Impact, Mix, Low End)

    Ronnie--Four Seasons 1964 (Impact, Low End)

    Five O'Clock World--Vogues 1965 (Impact, Mix)
    The Stereo mix loses the impact of the Mono single mix.

    Like A Rolling Stone--Bob Dylan 1965 (Mix, Low End)
    I still love the sound on my Columbia Red vinyl promo 45 with one exception, the Stereo version mastered by Steve. He captured the power and impact of the single version in the Stereo mix.

    Let's Hang On--Four Seasons 1965 (Impact, Low End)

    Treat Her Right--Roy Head and the Traits 1965 (Impact, Mix)
    The Stereo mix places the vocals too upfront and the instruments too far behind. Also, the Stereo version is too dry. In order to create a Stereo single version, I use the version that Steve mastered, add some compression, add some reverb and I have a version that captures the power and impact of the Mono single version, only in Stereo (sorry, Steve).

    Time Won't Let Me--Outsiders 1965 (Impact, Low End)

    The "In" Crowd--Dobie Gray 1965 (Impact, Mix, Low End)
    Maybe some day we will hear the Stereo version done right.
    ;)

    I Ain't Gonna Eat My Heart Anymore--Young Rascals 1965 (Impact, Mix)

    Roadrunner--Gants 1965 (Mix, Low End, Impact)
    The Stereo version is also too wet.

    We Gotta Get Outta This Place--Anuimals 1965* (Version)
    The US single mix is a different, superior recording than the currently available UK album mix. The rights to the US single mix are controlled in the US by Allan Klein (need I say more). I found it on a French EMI EP labeled as an alternate mix. For collectors this version is a must have.

    White Rabbit--Jefferson Airplane 1966 (Impact, Low End)

    Walk Away Renee--Left Banke 1966 (Impact, Mix)
    The Mono has the profound centered impact.

    Kicks--Paul Revere and the Raiders 1966 (Impact, Mix)

    Gloria--Shadows of Knight 1966 (Impact, Mix)
    The Stereo mix is awful and loses the power and inpact of the Mono mix.

    Let's Fall In Love--Peaches & Herb 1966 (Impact)

    I've Been Lonely Too Long--Young Rascals 1966 (Mix, Impact)

    Love Makes The World Go Round--Deon Jackson 1966 (Impact)

    Little Bit O' Soul--Music Explosion 1966 (Mix, Impact)

    The Letter--Box Tops 1966 (Version, Impact, Low End)
    The Mono single mix is very different.

    Summer In The City--Lovin' Spoonful 1966 (Impact, Mix)
    This classic is far more true to the original sound in Mono.

    Hungry--Paul Revere and the Raiders 1966 (Impact, Mix)

    Sunny--Bobby Hebb 1966 (Impact)

    A Girl Like You--Young Rascals 1967 (Impact, Mix)

    Sunshine Of Your Love--Cream 1967 (Impact)
    Mono captures the way it sounded on AM Radio in 67'.

    I Never Loved A Man (The Way That I Love You)--Aretha Franklin 1967 (Impact)

    Show Me--Joe Tex 1967 (Impact)

    Try A Little Tenderness--Three Dog Night 1968 (Impact, Low End)

    Hooked On A Feeling--B.J. Thomas 1968 (Impact, Mix)

    Light My Fire--Doors 1967* (Version)
    I would simply like to have the Mono single edit on CD.

    Mony, Mony--Tommy James & Shondells 1968* (Mix, Impact, Low End)
    The Stereo mix is such a mess and sounds awful.

    Time Of The Season--Zombies 1968 (Version, Mix, Impact)
    The Stereo is tepid and lacks the power of the Mono single version.

    You've Made Me So Very Happy--Blood, sweat & Tears 1968 (Version)
    The edited version is the correct single version, without the long instrumental break in the middle.

    Mr. Bojangles--Jerry Jeff Walker 1968 (Version) (for Beagle)
    The Stereo mix sounds like a different recording.

    Crimson & Clover--Tommy James & the Shondells 1969 (Version)
    The single mix is definitive. Steve recently discussed this.

    Spinning Wheel--Blood, Sweat & Tears 1969 (Version)
    Heavily edited, the single mix is more compelling.

    This list is by no means complete. Please add to it!

    Bob :)
     
  2. Uncle Al

    Uncle Al Senior Member

    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    OK - let's play! (Great list, btw, Bob).

    My lp preferences have already been "published" (on these boards - lol), but one quick off the top (more later).......

    How about Donovan's Sunshine Superman and Hurdy Gurdy Man. Both superior sounding versions on the single for mix, bottom and impact.
     
  3. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Bob,

    You've been busy!

    Remember, the STEREO version of "Mack The Knife" was made with different mics and setup than the mono version. The stereo is "far-miked" and the mono is "close-miked".

    To make matters MORE confusing, the stereo version was used to do 45 MONO recuts in the 1970's (by folding in the channels). The way to tell if your version is the correct mono, is the intro. On the mono, you can hear the bass and drums. In the stereo version the bass and drums are just rumors. :)

    There was a "Bad To Me" in stereo? Nah, mono only. You don't mean the R.F. remix do you? That can't count.....
     
  4. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Also, please remember on "She's Not There" that the stereo mix from 1969 is lacking two layers of overdubs. One layer is the extra drums and percussion, and the other is the extra vocals. These were added AS THE MONO WAS BEING MIXED! Therefore, not on the four-track tape....

    :)
     
  5. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    The mono single of "Mony Mony" is mixed AND edited very differently than the stereo version. The mono adds more reverb but at the same time sounds much tighter than the common stereo mix.

    When I do my 70s list in a couple of days I will format things differently.
     
  6. chip-hp

    chip-hp Cool Cat

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Bob,

    Interesting thread ... good job ... thanks for your effort. Posts like this one make this Site fun to visit.:)

    FYI ... according to Mike Callahan's "Oldies On CD", Second Edition - May, 1994, several of the songs that you have marked with an (*) appear on CD in mono but it is not clear if these versions are the 45 edits.

    One example is "Tossin' And Turin' " which supposedly appears in mono on Vol.1 of Ace's "Golden Age of American Rock 'N' Roll". I haven't checked it. Since I don't have a copy of the original 45, I wouldn't know for sure anyway.

    Another example is "Sealed With A Kiss". That song seems to appear in mono more often than stereo (I don't think that I have a stereo version on any of my CDs). Are these not the 45 edits? Again, I don't have an original 45 to compare.

    Again, you hard work is appreciated.
     
  7. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Sunshine Of Your Love

    Is one that I think robs us as a single. Eric's great solo is just sliced off. Remember, this song was played off the album on the radio for a while before the single was "edited" from a copy tape of the mono mix.

    Just doesn't sound right cut up like that to me...

    "Light My Fire" on the other hand, DOES sound right on the 45 version. It's the way we all remember it, and the way most of us heard it first. I still play my 45 of it!

    The tape is "D" by the way....
     
  8. Beagle

    Beagle Senior Member

    Location:
    Ottawa
    Bravo Bob! Well done!

    I'll add some things sporadically, as we go along.

    A couple of things...

    Mason Williams-Classical Gas (I was playing my original orange label mono 45 yesterday and I think the mix/balance is probably the same one as the stereo LP version but the 45 sounds more together and hotter.

    Gary Lewis and the Playboys-She's Just My Style (original Liberty 45 sounds tighter and hotter than the stereo. I remember as a kid my record player couldn't track the A-side nor the B-side "I Won't Make That Mistake Again"

    Barry McGuire-Eve Of Destruction (original mono red RCA 45 and mono LP version smoke the stereo ABC reissue 45)
     
  9. Pat

    Pat Forum Detective

    Location:
    Tampa, FL

    Sealed With A Kiss has NOT shown up in STEREO anywhere, to my knowledge! The "stereo" version is fake stereo!


    Tossin & Turnin' sounds great (to me) in stereo with the extra intro; Baby, baby, you do something to me... (and sax!)
    :cool:
     
  10. CT Dave

    CT Dave Senior Member

    Location:
    Connecticut
    The mono version of Bobby Lewis's "Tossin' and Turnin'" on the Ace "Golden Age Of American Rock and Roll,Vol.1" is a fold down of the stereo mix with the intro ("Baby,baby you did something to me") chopped off. The original mono mix of "Tossin' And Turnin'" has hi-hats overdubbed, you can really notice them right after Bobby sings the line "The clock downstairs was striking four". Also, there is some editing on the final verse when he sings "I couldn't get you off my mind, I heard the milkman at the door". That line is sung differently on the stereo version. I downloaded a mono mix of "Tossin' And Turnin'" that has an extended fade from WinMX some time ago. It is a really clean mix, and I would love to find it on CD.
     
  11. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    And, knowing now that the LP version was slowed down makes it even harder for me to listen to.

    Give me the single anyday!

    BTW, Bob, I recreated the single almost exactly, except for the slight pitch variations at the edit points.
     
  12. guy incognito

    guy incognito Senior Member

    Location:
    Mee-chigan
    "I Fought The Law" by the Bobby Fuller Four -- The stereo version is what always gets played on oldies radio here, but doesn't the mono single version have a different vocal track (and perhaps different instrumental as well)?
     
  13. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Keep in mind the stereo is a different recording.
     
  14. Andrew

    Andrew Chairman of the Bored

    1970s single versions

    Three off the top of my head:

    David Bowie: "Fame" (impact)

    Silver Convention: "Fly Robin Fly" (LP version way too long)

    Manfred Mann's Earth Band: "Blinded By The Light" (ditto)

    Oops! I didn't notice the timeline in the thread name. Doh!
     
  15. Steven

    Steven Senior Member

    Location:
    Mercer County, NJ
    What CD (or CD's) have this in mono? My two copies are stereo. For the record: narrow on Brill Building - Era box, wide on Shirelles Varese comp.

    Steven
     
  16. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    Pretty Ballerina-Left Banke 1967 (Impact)
     
  17. indy mike

    indy mike Forum Pest

    Course, the stereo mix of I Fought the Law has a mighty naughty word snuck in - Bobby doesn't just "miss his baby and good fun" - listen closely and you'll hear what else he misses... ;)
     
  18. chip-hp

    chip-hp Cool Cat

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Re: Re: The Definitive Single Versions Part 1 (1958-1969)

    According to "Oldies On CD", the 1992 3-CD "Scepter Records Story" on Capricorn has it in mono with good sound.
     
  19. guy incognito

    guy incognito Senior Member

    Location:
    Mee-chigan
    [​IMG]
     
  20. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Re: 1970s single versions

    Andrew! we're supposed to save this for the 70s thread! Remember?
     
  21. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Re: Re: Re: The Definitive Single Versions Part 1 (1958-1969)

    That box was highly criticized by many in the audiophile crowd. I thought the first two discs were just fine. I'm still blown away bu the sound of "I Say A Little Prayer" by Dionne Warwick.
     
  22. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam Thread Starter


    Al,

    Good examples! I saved a few to post as we went along. Sunshine Superman is one on my "additional list" I agree with your observations.

    Bob
     
  23. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Steve,

    Sorry I had to be away the rest of the day on Saturday. Thanks for the info on Mack The Knife. I will listen to my Mono of Mack The Knife when I get home later today. I have a Stereo of Bad To Me on an Eric Records comp. Probably is the R. F. remix but it is not noted as such.

    Steve, this is what I truly enjoy...a fun project.

    Bob :)
     
  24. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Steve,

    I had the Disreali Gears album before that 45 edit was ever issued. I like the Mono version on the MFSL. But, you are correct, that great solo was definitely missing from the 45 edit.

    Bob
     
  25. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam Thread Starter

    Detective Pat,

    The Sealed With A Kiss that I have in Stereo is definitely not, fake Stereo. It sounds like an unfinished mix. Reverb bounce from the vocal in the right channel to the left but, two distinct channels of sound. I will e-mail you later with the source on disc.

    I enjoy the Stereo of Tossin' And Turnin' but the Mono has more power.

    Bob :)
     
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