“The Dirt” (Motley Crue movie bio based on Nikki Sixx’s book)

No moral pontificating from me, but as a relevant aside, in Ozzy Osbourne's book he describes MC as being too wild even for him. That's saying something!

In fact, Metallica felt the blowback from Ozzy's tour with MC, as Sharron, not wanting a repeat of events, basically secluded Ozzy from Metallica with very strict rules. All because of Motley Crue.

 

You’re right, it wasn’t a big deal back then. Times change.

 

Would agree, Mick Mars is the exception. I've always had a strange fascination with horrible people.
(I've become obsessed with American politics in the last few years)

 

“The 80s were so long ago that basic notions of decency didn’t apply” isn’t a point of view I agree with, but, through this thread, I have learned that many people do apparently believe that.

 

I can remember when that accident happened. It was a big deal in that, potentially, Vince Neil could have served a year + in jail. For fans of the band, it meant it could be the end of the band. But as far as the death of Razzle of Hanoi Rocks, it was seen as tragic, but that was about it. I've read that Neil still has guilt over that incident to this day.

To my thoughts on the movie after watching it this afternoon: not bad, but certainly not great; it just made me think, "why was this made again?" There were parts of it that were very "I, Tonya" almost (over the top antics, breaking the fourth wall, etc.). I think "The Dirt" was definitely inspired by that movie to some degree.

I don't feel like the movie really went in-depth into much of anything outside of Nikki Sixx's heroin abuse and even that was cursory. The casting wasn't great (Iwan Rheon as Mick Mars seemed like a particularly odd choice and Daniel Webber didn't look a thing like Vince Neil). Yet, with Webber he was probably cast because he actually had the acting chops to pull off Neil's see-saw like life while in Crüe. The accident, the death of both his friend Razzle and his daughter, make his story the most tragic of all the members. So, yeah, this was only "okay". A fun watch if, like me, you were a big fan of the band in the early 80's, but I have no real desire to see this again.

 

I just finished watching it and though it was pretty decent. Made me wish I could of seen them back in the day. Though I was a bit disappointed that they ended the movie in the mid 90s. I'm sure most of the good stuff already happened but is not the whole story.

 

Probably wanted to skip over that time when Nikki Sixx almost incited a race riot.

 

Drinking and driving wasn't seen as a deal for most of the 1980's. That's just a fact. There's plenty of data out there to back it up. Look at arrests, convictions, prison sentences. By the time we got to the late 80's and early 1990's state's started passing tougher drinking and driving laws, ad campaigns about the dangers were all over the place, organizations like MADD and SADD were all over the place, etc. My post has nothing to do with "notions of decency" and everything to do with the actual facts of the time.

 

Nice try, but not accurate. As this lengthy People magazine article from 1983, the year before Neil got in his car drunk and killed someone, reflects, it wasn’t in “the late 80s and early 90s” that public attitudes and laws concerning DUI began to change - they had already begun to change in the early 80s.

Outrage Over Drunk Driving

But, beyond that historical reality, the argument that “lots of people once thought it was OK to drive drunk” doesn’t make driving drunk OK. Nor does mean that driving drunk was ever OK. Lots of people once took it for granted that, say, women weren’t able to vote or to open a bank account without their husband’s permission. That doesn’t mean that it was ever OK to treat women as second-class citizens.

 

You can use a People article to back up your claim if you'd like (I wouldn't accept it in my classroom). I'll stick with hard data of laws, arrests, and sentences. The anti-drunk driving crusade didn't reach a crescendo until the late 1980's.

I mean, Vince Neil KILLED somebody and seriously injured 2 others and he was given 30 DAYS. Does that sound like something that was considered a "big deal" to you? These types of charges and sentences were commonplace then.

 

Bringing in the sheaves, bringing in the sheaves,
We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves,
Bringing in the sheaves, bringing in the sheaves,
We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves.…


Enjoy the Nu-Victorian Era, turkeys. You don’t know what you missed. Hedonists Unite!

 

I can't say I've noticed comedy skill from him either.

 

As we discussed upthread, Vince Neil admits that he had the money to buy his way out of jail. Rich and powerful people have always been able to use their money and power to buy their way out of trouble. Fifteen years before Neil walked away from killing someone while driving drunk with a slap on the wrist, Sen. Ted Kennedy walked away from killing someone while driving drunk with a slap on the wrist.

But, whether or not someone has the means to game the system, yes, killing someone while operating a deadly piece of machinery while intoxicated is, by definition and by common sense, a “big deal.” That some people in some times and places may, for whatever reason, have thought otherwise and even had a flippant attitude about that, doesn’t change that underlying reality.

 

Really weak movie.

You may not like The Crue but they were about the most honest band from that whole scene and when they wrote songs about violence and death and "breaking the rules" it was because they actually experienced those things.
You have to think of Motley as a B or C level band that are greater than they appear to be on paper. Their "genre" music is the perfect and most honest encapsulation of that time and state of mind and they actually transcended it.
Folks at places like this constantly make the argument that this and that band are good or great despite popular opinions, Motley is one of these bands.

 

I am very curious about this biopic. I expected my Motley Crue concert experience to be wild, but it wasn't. The Crue have mellowed out a lot as they've gotten older just like Nine Inch Nails and Marilyn Manson. Nikki almost died from a drug overdose before Kickstart My Heart, and I think it was a wakeup call for him. He has really turned his life around. He seemed like a smart man whenever I listened to his radio show Sixx Sense. Tommy Lee has also evolved as a person. I think the accident Vince was involved in made him reflect about the kind of person he was and where his life was headed, even if the punishment didn't fit the crime.

Nothing unexpected, violent, or tragic has ever happened at any of the concerts I've been to. I've always heard about people getting punched out or guitarists breaking their instruments, but I've never witnessed it first hand. I've never even heard a singer calling out a fan for being rowdy, and I've been to at least 50 concerts.

 

He also received 5 years probation and was required to perform 200 hours of community service in addition to paying restitution to victims Lisa Hogan and Daniel Smithers, who were severely injured. This passage in the following linked article gives an indication why the district attorney negotiated this plea deal.

Civil Suits

If the victims are not satisfied with the judge's decision, their attorneys could attempt to collect more money through civil suits already filed. The suits do not specify dollar amounts.

[Deputy District Attorney] Kelly told the commissioner that both of the victims understood and agreed that if Wharton is to make restitution, he "must be free and have the ability to perform in rock concerts."

As for community service, he said, the singer and his band have already scheduled a concert for Aug. 24 at the Forum in Inglewood to benefit the Palmer Drug Abuse Program, Los Angeles Inc. Smithers is employed by Palmer.

Lynn Hogan said after the hearing that she will request that Wharton spend time with people who are receiving therapy for brain injuries. Her daughter was in a coma for 28 days after the accident and is still receiving treatment, she said.

"I think it would be very difficult for someone to go into one of these wards and come out the same type of person," she said. "It would be hard to sit with these kids that are trying so hard with therapy and keep the attitude that you want to drink and drive."

Forbid Alcohol

Hogan added that she would probably also request that Wharton be forbidden to drink alcohol while on probation.

Smithers' attorney, Stuart Fest, said that he, too, believes Wharton should be required to spend time with people undergoing therapy for head injuries. He added that the attorneys' decision not to seek jail time for Wharton probably boiled down to a value judgment.

"Frankly, it's a tough one, morally," he said. "I know Dan Smithers had to struggle with his emotions that said Neil should be punished to the full extent of the law. Neil owes two debts--one to society, and the other to the victims. If society extracts its fullest punishment, he can't pay his other debt."

Rock 'n' Roller's Song Sobered by Fatal Crash

 

I thought it was okay it wasn't great and I can't see watching it again really.

The band members came off as cartoonish type characters. I did like Mick's character out of all of them. He was a real grump in the movie.

Vince's character was a party all the time type, Nikki was a talented, driven and psychologically damaged person from his upbringing and Tommy was this bounding imbecile who had only one redeeming quality and that was he played the drums well.

I did notice what I think was a mistake (besides other obvious choices) but maybe some hardcore Crue fans will know. It was early on in the movie when the band first met each other and jammed in the house. Mick Mars' black beauty Les Paul was shown as an Epiphone headstock with the name Epiphone blacked out (on the headstock). Wouldn't Mick have had a real black beauty Gibson Les Paul?

 

It was a 1972 Les Paul Custom. Heavy guitar for a guy with spinal problems.
Mick Mars Shares His Vast Collection of Rare Gibsons and Fenders, Including a Ton of Vintage Strats

 

Yeah - tha's what I thought. I remember the vids and he had a Les Paul custom - black. Not an Epiphone.

 

Only a guitarist would spot that. Who were the consultants on this film? Shame on you.

 

Guilty. I look for that stuff to detect the accuracy of the film.

 

Good analysis.

I think there were far more mistakes in the film than the make of Mars’ guitar. Many, many more, in fact.

I still cannot help but feel a 4 to 6 episode “season” would have benefited this wounded animal better than the less than 120 minute version that was sanctioned.

Meh! I say.

 

Yeah - I think a small series would've been better (maybe?). This format just touched on things rather quickly as they covered at least 2 decades of the band.

I'm not sure I liked Mick talking to us watching the thing. The movie seemed self aware. I guess it could be an interesting device but it felt too *wink wink* kind of a vibe for me for this movie and the subject matter.

 

Hence my “I, Tonya” reference.

Pete Davidson’s Tom Zutant did it, too.

Davidson was AWFUL in this. Just terrible. Rheon’s character broke the fourth wall because he was the most jaded, “been here, seen this” character in the whole thing.

Meh.

 

I feel like I put my hand in excrement and licked my finger.

What do these people think this says about them, even now they seems to see personal tragedy as something you heroically survive.

If they'd achieved any insight they would have given all their money away rather than still milking this nonsense.

Or perhaps I missed their "Look how shallow we are" moment

As a film I don't know if it meant to show this 'truth' or not.