The Kinks - Album by Album (song by song)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by mark winstanley, Apr 4, 2021.

  1. FJFP

    FJFP Host for the 'Mixology' Mix Differences Podcast

    I have to say, I span the aforementioned Hallmark LP this afternoon while changing the sheets, and I forgot how good the stereo mix is! Cadillac especially is fantastic!
     
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  2. Fred1

    Fred1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Zurich
    I couldn't agree more! :righton:
     
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  3. FJFP

    FJFP Host for the 'Mixology' Mix Differences Podcast

    It only makes me sad we never got stereo mixes of Kinda and Kontroversy.
     
  4. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Do we know if this was a budget consideration... or just one of those things?
     
  5. FJFP

    FJFP Host for the 'Mixology' Mix Differences Podcast

    I can’t imagine the Stereo sold much, so they probably figured they didn’t need stereo mixes. Most other British bands at the same time had the same deal.
     
  6. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    I wonder if they still have the multitrack tapes for their stuff... I know the early stuff was probably 3 or 4 track... but the later stuff....
    Hmmm. Just thinking aloud...
     
  7. Steve E.

    Steve E. Doc Wurly and Chief Lathe Troll

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY, USA
    I've seen some WEIRD things about the way Kontroversy was recorded. Let's just say that while a stereo mix, even a not-great one, was possible with the debut, this may not have been the case with the later ones. And I'll write more on that when we get there.
     
  8. Jon H.

    Jon H. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Hi @Adam9 -

    I did the research on the topics of You Really Got Me (with or without reverb) and the purported US mono mix of Bald Headed Woman, listening to LP copies only. I have the You Really Got Me Deluxe 2 CD (compiled by Andrew Sandoval) but not the MoFi - I'll ask you to check that if you do...

    LP's auditioned:
    US Reprise Mono (1964 original) - 2 copies
    US Reprise Stereo (1970's tan label reissue)
    Spain PRT Mono (1980)
    Germany PRT Mono (1987)
    US Rhino Stereo (1988)
    US Sanctuary Mono (2015) - AAA mastered by Kevin Gray

    First, the ONLY LP I auditioned that contained You Really Got Me with reverb was the US Reprise Stereo. This added-reverb mix shows up on compilations (I have a Japan 2 CD compilation that includes it) but as far as I know it was created by Reprise for the US market - and it reappears on the US The Kinks Greatest Hits LP. Question: does it appear on the MoFi? If it appears on the 2 CD Deluxe it's probably because Andrew found it and put it on as he knew completists would enjoy it. Normally YRGM is always dry on worldwide compilations...

    Now for the interesting findings: all of the copies listed above have mono sound except the Reprise Stereo and the Rhino Stereo - I checked to make sure. The Reprise Stereo sounds great, but the Rhino Stereo sounds amazing! I highly recommend this pressing. However, Rhino went back to the "dry" You Really Got Me for their reissue. I assume the Rhino CD reissue is the same...I'll check.

    ALL of the LP's except for the US Reprise Mono, the US Reprise Stereo, and the US Rhino Stereo use a double-tracked Ray vocal on Bald Headed Woman. The single tracked version is ONLY found on the three LPs listed above. I believe that Andrew found the various versions and mislabeled the "US mono mix" on the Deluxe edition. It transpires that both Reprise issues (Mono and Stereo) are single-tracked.

    Here's the Bald Headed breakdown:
    Single- tracked vocal - US Mono AND Stereo Reprise LP's, US Rhino reissue, and Deluxe edition CD - appears on disc 1 (stereo album) and disc 2 (mono album bonus tracks - listed mistakenly as "US Mono mix", but NOT part of Disc 2's mono LP program)
    Double-tracked vocal - all mono LP's EXCEPT the US Reprise, and appears as part of the mono program (disc 2) of the Deluxe edition.

    If any Kollectors out there have an original UK Pye Stereo LP I'd love to know about You Really Got Me and Bald Headed Woman against my findings above.

    This kind of detective work is exhausting - and it doesn't help that the Deluxe Edition is perhaps mis-labeled with incorrect information. I went and bought 2 mono Reprise copies trying to find a rarity, that in fact I already owned!

    Hopefully I have not tried the patience of anyone in this thread, but when an "alternate" version is discussed I often want to get to the bottom of the mystery.

    Cheers!
     
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  9. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Nah mate... any and all information about the album and the songs is going to be valuable to someone. Anyone not interested can always skip the post :righton:
     
  10. Jon H.

    Jon H. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Thanks Mark! I know it's trivia to some but when the "Deluxe Edition" purports to be the last word, old-time vinyl collectors like me sometimes have to do further research. There's a reason I have so many copies of these albums - I LOVE 'Em!
     
  11. Michael Streett

    Michael Streett Senior Member

    Location:
    Florence, SC
    I’m also a nerd for these various alternate mixes so I’ll be popping in when the discussions for the specific songs come about for others that may not know about some of these. It all started with Doug Hinman’s book some 25 years ago and went from there. I did a deep dive through the entire Kinks catalog last year and have notes on these alternate mixes and where they can be found.

    I’m curious though why you say Bald Headed Woman (US Mono Mix) is mislabeled. I think the way they look at it is the UK mono and stereo mixes are considered the default or “correct” mixes if you want to call it that. So the US mono mix would be the “alternate” mix to be labeled as such.
    I look forward to reading more about your research as the thread moves forward.
     
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  12. Adam9

    Adam9 Senior Member

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Great and exhaustive work on this @Jon H. Much appreciated.
    First, I apologize for quoting your whole reply as it is difficult to edit on my phone.
    As to the MoFi, I have actually never had the opportunity to hear it. But in this short thread the last post, I think, mentions that YRGM is the reverb version: Kinks MFSL 2 for 1 ?
    Good point about Bald Headed Mountain being the single-tracked version on both the mono and the stereo Reprise. It makes me wish I had kept my Rhino CD of this which absolutely does have the dry version of YRGM.
    I have also never heard the Pye stereo of the first album but I would bet that it has the reverb version of YRGM. It's funny that this would exist on a stereo album since it's mono, not fake stereo (at least on the Deluxe on the stereo disc).
    I used to have a stereo Reprise Greatest Hits and I don't remember if it was reprocessed for stereo. Probably it was.
     
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  13. sharedon

    sharedon Forum Zonophone

    Location:
    Boomerland
    Ray mentioned the reverbed YRGM with dismay in an interview reprinted in the Uncut Kinks Ultimate Music Guide, said something like he only ever hears it on US radio.

    Because I first owned it on the old Reprise Kinks Greatest Hits, I was amazed when I later heard the unfutzed-with version - and could never listen to that echoey mess again!
     
  14. Jon H.

    Jon H. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC USA
    The single-tracked vocal appears in the US on BOTH the stereo and mono LP's. Having said that, confusingly on the Deluxe Edition the single-tracked vocal mix is described as a "vocal overdub".

    It is perhaps labeled with good intention as the US mono mix, but my point is that the stereo mix on the Reprise album is single-tracked too. All UK and continental releases in mono contain a double-tracked mono mix. I see what you mean - now I, who had the best of intentions, am thoroughly confused!

    I just checked the stereo Marble Arch LP referred to above (great cover by the way) and it has the single-tracked vocal.

    So - to recap:
    Mix #1: UK and European countries, Mono album - mono mix, double-tracked vocals
    Mix #2: US mono mix - single-tracked vocal, in mono
    Mix #3: UK and US Stereo Albums - single-tracked vocal, in stereo
    There is no stereo mix with double-tracked vocals AFAIK...

    As I type this I see the confusion; and to clarify, not only are the versions different in single- or double-tracked vocals, but I believe that it's a different "take" of Ray's vocal.

    All this research for a kinda weak song! Oh well, at least Shel got his royalties. I like The Who's version better, but...as a good choice...oof.
     
  15. All Down The Line

    All Down The Line Senior Member

    Location:
    Australia
    Riding jackets?
     
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  16. All Down The Line

    All Down The Line Senior Member

    Location:
    Australia
    There you go mixing up artists already with a quick one Mark!
     
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  17. Fred1

    Fred1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Zurich
    Yes, crimson riding jackets.
     
  18. Scottsol

    Scottsol Forum Resident

    Location:
    Evanston, IL
    Since YRGM was readily available as a single before the album was released and is easily accessed now without having to purchase the album, its presence on the album carry’s very little weight in an overall evaluation.
     
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  19. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Beautiful Delilah

    So we open the album with a Chuck Berry track, and it isn't really a song of Berry's that I am particularly familiar with to be honest and here it steams out of the gate.

    Here is an interesting thing that strikes me when I listen to this album .... much like the early R&B tracks that the Who did, there seems to be a need to put an affected vocal on the track ... I guess looking for a more raw sound or something along those lines, but much like Daltrey, I prefer the guys to sing in their natural voice. Perhaps it is a feeling of needing to sounding a bit rougher or something along those lines, but on listening back to this album, one of the distractions for me is that affected vocal.

    The song motors along at a good pace, and I think the energy level is really very good. We get a nice lead break kick in, and in my opinion Dave again shows early signs of being a very good player. there is a kind of wild abandon that he manages to bring to his leads that adds good flavour and energy, without losing control, of the necessary feel.

    So for me this is a pretty good opener to the album and without setting the world on fire, it gets the attention and brings us in nicely.

     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2021
  20. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Some video of the band playing Beautiful Delilah

     
  21. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Colourised?
    Slightly different sound

     
  22. FJFP

    FJFP Host for the 'Mixology' Mix Differences Podcast

    I remember being shocked when I first heard this track, as I wasn't familiar with Dave's vocal yet, but I think this is a solid opener. Enough energy to make it fun, though Dave's affected vocal is certainly a strange one. Never heard the original. It's a thumbs up from me.
     
  23. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    So Mystifying

    Interestingly we get Dave singing the first song on the album, and then we move into the Ray Davies penned Mystifying, and Ray takes the lead vocal.

    Recorded in late August at the sessions for the album at Pye studios 2 in London, the song opens up with a nice rolling pull off riff, with bass and drums accenting it with some punch. We then launch into the chorus and it has some nice harmony vocals. Ray delivers the lyrics with somewhat of a Dylanesque phrasing that works really well, and interestingly enough this is before Dylan had done anything like this, as he was still rolling the acoustic folkstyle numbers... It kind of makes me wonder if Dylan had been hearing the guys around the place, or just coincidental ... or perhaps I am way off base.

    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying

    Well, help me, baby, get a message through
    You leave my mouth wide open with the things that you do
    First you say you love me, then you say that we're through
    You know you're so mystifying, can't believe it's true

    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying

    You know that every time I see you walking down the street
    You got a mystifying wiggle from your head to your feet
    You got a shock wave pulsating rhythm through my brain
    You know you're so mystifying, you just ain't the same

    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying

    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying

    Well, mystify me by the way that you walk
    You even mystify me by the way you talk
    Go from one day to the next if you'll be mine
    Oh, little woman, you are so mystifying

    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying
    You know you're so mystifying

    Songwriters: Davies
    So Mystifying lyrics © Kassner Associated Publishers Ltd, Broadway Music Corporation

    Lyrically it isn't earth shattering, but it is a solid fairly typical rock type song, and does what it needs to do.

    I really like this track, it is actually really catchy, and the lead riff with its rolling riff is a pretty decent hook I reckon.
    We have this bouncy and quite punchy feel about it.
    I actually found myself singing this in my head for a time over the weekend after having a revisit of it on Saturday on the way home.


     
  24. croquetlawns

    croquetlawns Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scotland
    The first two tracks are a good overview of how I approach the album as a whole - putting up with the covers (not quite bad enough to bother skipping them!) to get to the decent originals. This is probably the lesser of Rays originals on the album, but it's still better than the Berry cover. I can also only take so much of Dave's vocals on early Kinks tracks!
     
  25. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Also a little interesting addition to that.

    This track was actually a hit for Swedish group the Hep Stars, and made it to number 4 on one Swedish chart and number 5 on another.

    Here is the Hep Stars with the cover version

     

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