The Monkees "More of the Monkees" Rhino Handmade Deluxe Box Set

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by The Spaceman, Dec 13, 2014.

  1. super sally

    super sally Forum Resident

    Location:
    Mint Hill, NC USA
    I'm looking forward to hearing the inevitable youtube mashup video of the "Whatever's Right" backing track with Micky's 2016 vocal.
     
  2. readr

    readr Forum Resident

    Looking For The Good Times is a 1969 vocal. Also, from Present, Ladies Aid Society is a 1966 vocal......compare, it’s pretty obvious. We are getting a backing track for LFTGT on the new box.....can’t wait, great backing track.
     
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  3. feinstei9415

    feinstei9415 Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    Just a reminder.... When you pre-order from the Rhino/Monkees website, your credit card is charged immediately instead of at the time of shipment.
     
  4. Pawnmower

    Pawnmower Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dearborn, MI
    Everyone hated the blu-ray set? Why?
     
  5. Pawnmower

    Pawnmower Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dearborn, MI
    Yes, that's a nice collection. I just wish they told us where all the tracks came from. And the mix of "Mommy and Daddy" on the Rhino Handmade 7" is missing.. but the A-side is there.
     
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  6. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    "Everyone" was more like an extremely vocal 10% of fans who were upset over relatively minor issues.

    In pre-release press materials, Rhino stated "10 Episodes" had alternate soundtracks (be they rerun or syndication; it never specified), when in reality, it was just "10 songs". And some of those were on the bonus disc, not incorporated into the episodes themselves. Other than that, we lost a snippet of the boys with Johnny Cash (because the Cash estate would not sign off on his part), and a few seconds chopped out of 33 1/3 (again, because of licensing). It was an embarrassing amount of whining over so little.

    Meanwhile, every episode of the show was presented in stunning quality, mastered from the original negatives, completely obliterating any previous release of the TV show. We got an alternate (and never advertised in advance) version of the 33 1/3 TV special, and a Bonus Disc with a couple of hours worth of mouth-watering rarities and outtakes. The Head outtakes alone would have been a satisfactory bonus, but there was a lot more. It's an outstanding release, and a vocal minority has given the impression that it was a disappointment. It was anything but.

    Oh, and there were some packaging snafus that Rhino deserved criticism for, but which they rectified fairly quickly, and as easily and conveniently as could be expected for the early buyers who were affected.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
  7. peteham

    peteham Forum Resident

    Location:
    Simcoe County
    Not on my version.
     
  8. FJFP

    FJFP Forum Resident

    Check again. Maybe it's only for clarity because it's not too noticeable, but it's definitely new - I know I've seen a list of remixed music box tracks with it on.
     
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  9. Michelle66

    Michelle66 Forum Resident

    While you're at it, why not mention the fact that Rhino continued to display the incorrect list of the set's contents until after fans started to complain about missing material that had originally been promised (and pre-orders taken for).

    Rhino's main site did so again this year when they had their summer sale.

    This is the main reason why folks got upset. And all of it could have been avoided if Rhino had taken care of all the licensing issues before offering the set for sale (or at least updating their site before people got unpleasant surprises when content they had hoped for wasn't there after all).

    What's more, during the entire brouhaha, there was also an extremely vocal group of fans who continued to make excuses for Rhino and insisted that anyone who was upset was wrong.

    Let's look at this in terms of the upcoming MotM box. Some people are most interested in the live material. Others are more excited about the backing tracks. And there are those who are looking forward to the remixes the most.

    Now, suppose once people start getting their sets in the mail, they discover (for whatever reason) that the live tracks weren't included after all.

    Some people might have ordered the set solely to get those live tracks. (Just like people might have ordered the bluray set to get the alternate soundtracks, or a complete version of 33 1/3, or Micky's "NEW" commentary, or any other reason.)

    Would these people have the right to be upset? I mean, those live tracks weren't originally part of the MotM album, and they likely sound horrendous.

    And what if Rhino never bothered to update their site and continued to list the set as having the live tracks?

    There would also be those who'd make these arguments:

    - MotM has never sounded better!
    - The backing tracks are fabulous!
    - Andrew Sandoval really hit a home run with the remixes!
    - The live tracks would have sounded crappy. You're not missing anything!
    - We need to continue supporting Rhino so they can keep making Monkees product. Don't complain!

    But, what about those folks who ordered the set because they wanted the live tracks? Guess they're just SOL...

    Just like the people who wanted 10 episodes with alternate soundtracks, a complete version of 33 1/3, Micky's "NEW" commentary, Johnny Cash, etc.

    You know, stuff that Rhino had listed on their site for at least six months (during the entire pre-sale), and once again during this year's summer sale.
     
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  10. paste

    paste Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ohio
    It still does: http://www.rhino.com/product/the-complete-series-blu-ray

    They also still list "Terrifying" as being on Good Times, too: The Monkees - GOOD TIMES! | Rhino
     
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  11. varitone

    varitone Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lincs, UK
    Sorry to go OT, but could you please tell me what was edited out?

    EDIT: Wikipedia says it's Jerry Lee Lewis - Whole Lotta Shakin' Goin' On in the medley.
    33⅓ Revolutions per Monkee - Wikipedia
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
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  12. peteham

    peteham Forum Resident

    Location:
    Simcoe County
    There is no mention of that in the credits, song listing, etc.. I have it in front of me.
     
  13. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    Rhino deserved criticism for sloppy attention to detail in some of the pre-release info that was out there. Fair enough. Nevertheless, only the most steadfast "glass half-empty" people would argue that the criticisms were in line with the errors. I'll stand by what I wrote: the complaints were loud, continuous, and well out of proportion to the mistakes. And what really irritated me (and many others) were the incessant claims that Rhino was deliberately trying to bilk people out of their money. It was ridiculous. They were criticized for their mistakes, and rightly so, but it went way beyond that. (I'm not saying you made those claims, but a few folks did. And continued to make them.)

    Regarding your first statement above, no one is "SOL". You simply request a refund for the item. Rhino accommodated at least one person I'm aware of, who requested a refund based on the alternate audio tracks being misrepresented.

    Regarding 33 1/3, what would you have them do? Entirely eliminate it from the package, because of 20 seconds of a Jerry Lee Lewis song? I can't imagine anyone preferring not having it at all, as opposed to simply living without the missing song excerpt. (And by the way, this was announced by them, before it was released. It wasn't an unpleasant surprise discovered by fans once it came out.)

    I think the very long wait until the announcement of the MOTM Deluxe is related to the problems they encountered last time. It appears they wisely waited until all i's were dotted, and t's crossed, before announcing the release. I was surprised it's being shipped a mere month after being announced.

    The bottom line is, Rhino deserved criticism for their errors. They got it, and then some. And then some more. The insults hurled at Sandoval were totally unjustified, and the assertions that Rhino were nothing but underhanded crooks were ludicrous.

    What sucks is, all of the negativity hurled at them quite possibly has torpedoed a potential 80's/90's/00's video boxed set. I wouldn't blame them if they just said "screw it, why bother?" It's not like the profit margin on these justifies the headaches. I also think Rhino manufacturing 10,000 of the Blu-ray sets was a mistake. That's probably twice the number they should have made, given the price tag for the set.
     
  14. Michelle66

    Michelle66 Forum Resident

    You're exactly right about the short time between the announcement of the MotM box and its release. Ideally, that's how it should be done.

    I can also understand your point about "half empty/half full" – at this stage of the game.

    However, if the set had been originally listed with its actual contents – as well as having a disclaimer that 33 1/3 needed to be edited – none of the furor that occured last year would have happened.

    Rhino deserves heaps of criticism for the way the bluray set was originally marketed and released, and the fact they're still listing it as having material that's just not there is wrong. I wouldn't say it's nefarious, but it is incompetent.

    Update: What follows below was just copied from Rhino's main site (not the Monkees online store). As you can see, missing content is still being listed and there is no mention of the special as having been edited...

    • • All 58 episodes, newly remastered in stunning HD from the original negatives for the very first time, plus the 1969 TV Special "33 1/3 Revolutions Per Monkee"
    • • Bonus material featuring commentaries from all four Monkees, original Kellogg's Monkees commercials, and more
    • • The 1968 Monkees film "HEAD" in HD with never-before-seen outtakes
    • • Unique packaging including a 7" featuring "Star Collector" b/w "Goin' Down" in unique TV mono mixes
    • • Strictly limited to 10,000 individually numbered sets

    We're excited to reveal the contents of this long-awaited collection. But first, check out the fantastic packaging - a lenticular 3-D cover mount that "moves" as you tilt it!

    Discs 1-7

    All 58 original, uncut episodes of THE MONKEES, remastered in HD from the original film negatives Audio commentary from all four Monkees NEW audio commentary from Micky Dolenz, Rodney Bingenheimer and "Monkee Girl" Valerie Kairys Venet Alternate "Saturday morning rerun" versions of 10 episodes with alternate songs and mixes All in the original glorious mono direct from the film audio mags

    Disc 8

    The 1968 movie HEAD, in HD Optional DTS-HD Master Audio 5.1 surround soundtrack Audio commentary from all four Monkees

    Disc 9

    The 1969 NBC television special 33 1/3 REVOLUTIONS PER MONKEE, restored from newly discovered video elements Audio commentary from Micky Dolenz

    Disc 10 - BONUS DISC, AVAILABLE IN THIS STRICTLY LIMITED EDITION ONLY!

    Original screen tests Original TV commercial spots featuring The Monkees Newly discovered outtakes from THE MONKEES TV series Newly discovered color promo film for "Randy Scouse Git" created for TOP OF THE POPS and unseen since its original airing Never-before-seen backstage footage of The Monkees at the 1967 Emmy Awards Newly discovered outtakes from the movie HEAD Newly discovered outtakes from the TV special 33 1/3 REVOLUTIONS PER MONKEE The Monkees on THE JOHNNY CASH SHOW in 1969, including "Nine Times Blue" and "Everybody Loves A Nut (with Johnny Cash)" The Monkees on THE GLEN CAMPBELL GOODTIME HOUR in 1969, including a medley of "Last Train to Clarksville/I'm A Believer/Salesman" and a performance of "Tear Drop City" The Monkees on ROWAN & MARTIN'S LAUGH-IN in 1969 Davy Jones performing "Someday Man" from the 1969 TV special MUSIC BAG, unseen since its original airing Newly restored color promo film for "Oh My My"

    This collection is strictly limited to 10,000 individually numbered boxes and once those are sold out, this edition and bonus disc will never be available again.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
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  15. npgchris

    npgchris Forum Resident

    That's weird that there's still some errors there. But I'm confused? Because I remember the "10 Episodes" and the "Everybody Loves A Nut" stuff being removed, shortly after it came out. How did that erroneous information get back in there? I'm guessing that at some point, a page was redesigned(?), and someone copied and pasted the original (incorrect) info onto the page? Unless I'm crazy, I remember it being pointed out that the information had finally been corrected, and some people were mad that it had taken them a few weeks to do it!

    Was the missing Micky commentary ever verified definitively, or officially addressed by Rhino? I've had the set since the beginning, but there's so much stuff on there that I could have easily missed a feature (either being omitted, or being included that had previously been unmentioned). Did Rhino ever identify the episode the commentary was recorded for? Sometimes an alternate audio track can be on there, but not mentioned. I do remember Rhino showing a picture of Micky that had supposedly been taken on the day he recorded the commentary. So you'd think that it would be there. I remember people mentioning this at the time, but I never remember reading that it had definitely been excluded. Regardless, it seems apparent that it's not identified on the disc's menu? If it was inadvertently left off, then that is certainly a legitimate complaint, and Rhino should reissue the disc with the correct content, as happens all the time in the world of Blu-ray.

    There's no denying that the "10 Episodes" verbiage shows a very poor level of quality control by someone at Rhino. There's no excuse for that. But my original point, which was to refute the notion that Rhino was being deliberate in their deception, still stands. But the fact that this information still exists on the website speaks poorly of Rhino's attention to detail. No argument there.
     
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  16. Michelle66

    Michelle66 Forum Resident

    People have written about the missing "NEW" (in caps because that's how Rhino contines to list it) Micky Dolenz commentary, but I'd say its absense was largely overlooked due to the other issues people had been concerned about.

    I think the "perfect (sh**) storm" that formed last year was a result of all this:

    – soliciting sales of the set before all the licensing had been finalized
    – promising material that ended up not being included (and continue to do so)
    – repeatedly delaying the set's release for 6 (?) months (while promising more special features that were not included anyway)
    – poorly-designed packaging that self-destructs under the stress of the set's contents
    – poorly-constructed packaging that may suffer from excess glue marring the lenticular panel, the lenticular panel just falling off, or both.
    – tone-deaf excuses in the wake of everything just listed

    The bluray set is the perfect example of how not to market something – especially an expensive niche product designed to appeal to a rabid fan base.
     
  17. paste

    paste Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ohio
    Where was it announced? It was first posted here after someone on Zilch noticed it was missing on their copy.

    If you go to the next page in that thread, you posted this:
    "If they knew a while ago that the performance wasn't going to be there, it would have been wise to have mentioned it during one of the interviews Andrew and John gave over the past few months. As they revealed more details about some of the stuff they'd found and were including, they could have slipped in that they had to excise 15 seconds of Jerry Lee Lewis due to a rights issue and most people would have shrugged it off. Especially since we were all salivating at all of the goodies that they were including."
     
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  18. Keith V

    Keith V Forum Resident

    Location:
    Jersey City, NJ
    Is the 20 seconds of 33 1/3 mentioned released on the original DVD set (or VHS)?
     
  19. paste

    paste Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ohio
    Yes, it is. As people have posted here in various threads, never get rid of any Monkees' media when there is a newer version of the same video/album, because there is probably at least one thing unique, like a different mix, to it that is not on the newer version.
     
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  20. super sally

    super sally Forum Resident

    Location:
    Mint Hill, NC USA
    RE: the Micky commentary... I'm going to guess either someone found it had no value, they are saving it for a release of the Blue-Rays without all the extras or it never happened at all (and the photo was of something else.)
     
  21. WonkyWilly

    WonkyWilly Forum Resident

    Location:
    Paradise, PA
    What a disaster that was. And I still have yet to recieve a copy that isn't basically destroyed. Not worth the ridiculous price.

    I always find it amusing when people say that you aren't allowed to complain about something sub-par that you paid good money for based on false promises.
     
  22. Keith V

    Keith V Forum Resident

    Location:
    Jersey City, NJ
    Which one? DVD or VHS? Or both?
     
  23. Michelle66

    Michelle66 Forum Resident

    33 1/3 is complete on VHS, laserdisc (sold in Japan), and DVD.

    The bluray set is the only place where it has been edited.
     
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  24. Ken K

    Ken K Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sayreville, NJ USA
    This track has always been iffy as far as being "ready" for vocal overdubs. Andrew's book says something along the lines of being done in one or two takes and features Tommy Boyce singing off-mike (but faintly audible). I'm thinking this take was a run-through, but just maybe it would have been completed if Boyce and Hart hadn't been dismissed as producers not long after these tracks were put down. Just a thought...
     
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  25. Ken K

    Ken K Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sayreville, NJ USA
    There is also a new remix on the 3-CD "The Monkees". Sounds quite good, too.
     
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