The Smiths - CD comparison thread

Another thing worth noting - just because peak levels are different that doesn't necessarily mean that a different A->D transfer was used. One would assume the relative peaks between the different tracks would at least be quite similar if the same transfer was used but then processed differently in the digital domain

Looking at the "Louder Than Bombs" graph it is hard not to conclude that the RT and RT/Sire CDs derive from the same original transfer. Concluding that the RT one was clipped but not processed while the RT/Sire one was not clipped but had some processing applied would certainly fit both the peak level data and the difference in sound between them.......

Again, pure speculation without further analysis!

 

I always figured that since Louder Than Bombs was a US comp that the Sire CD's would be the best or at least the same as the Rough Trade. Is this not the case?

 

The RT is streets ahead - strange but true.

 

That's what I figured. Thanks Mal.

 

This is the Peak levels from The Smiths s/t:
Made in USA
9 25065-2
Matrix: 1 25065-2 SRC-02

To me this disc sounds very good.

Track 1 Peak level 79.7 %
Track 2 Peak level 86.3 %
Track 3 Peak level 84.2 %
Track 4 Peak level 84.1 %
Track 5 Peak level 72.0 %
Track 6 Peak level 80.7 %
Track 7 Peak level 87.7 %
Track 8 Peak level 93.1 %
Track 9 Peak level 87.2 %
Track 10 Peak level 85.5 %
Track 11 Peak level 88.2 %

 

Now this is where the fun starts.

Here is a sample from "What difference does it make?" from the RT/Sire edition of "The Smiths".

http://download.yousendit.com/18F6E580091D353F

I have compared the similar tracks on the s/t to the tracks on "The very best of". I prefer the sound on the RT/Sire. The tracks on "The very best of" sounds to aggressive. I even prefer this to the sound of my RTT 146 A1/B2 12"

It would be very nice if someone could post a sample from the RT and WEA issues.

Thank you.

 

Bingo. The peak values track pretty well between both versions for the RT tracks that aren't clipped. And if we compared the RMS values, they would probably better track between both versions. I.e., RMS values aren't as much affected by light clipping.

Mal- Have you ever compared RT and WEA LTBs? The WEA does look substantially different. I wonder how it was sourced. And then if you have, could you put a number version on the goodness vs the Sire/RT? Something like RT: 100, Sire/RT 88, WEA 72, or whatever.

When I compare CDs, I have 2 ways that I compare. Casual listening is normal stereo from my speakers. Critical listening is with a set of headphones. I can hear smaller differences easier with headphones. Oh, and the specific way that I compare is to rip each track (using EAC, of course ) to my hard drive, then I normalize according to RMS value (I lower the louder one; don't want to clip the softer one), burn each version of each track back to back to a CD-R, and *then* listen. For me, it's too hard to swap discs back and forth, change volume, and then try to critically listen fo rthe differences.

And unfortunately , Dr M brings up a point. I have noticed on in otherthreads that: a) sometimes it's kind of universal which disc people prefer. In that case, there is usally a larger difference. But there is also sometimes when, b) where some people prefer one disc, and others prefer a different disc. In *that* case, I think there usually isn't a significant difference, or there's a small difference, or there's no difference at all. Yes, sometimes I think some people hear differences where none exist. But Mal has taken this a step further in that when the peak values don't track as much, then by golly we probably should expect to hear a difference.

Neat stuff!!

 

A question -

I have the Japanese mini-sleeve versions coming. Anyone know which mastering THOSE are ?

 

I believe they are clones of the current WEA discs with updated packaging.

 

But run 'em through EAC, and then we'll know.

 

Yes, please do!

 

Okay, just received the Japanese editions yesterday and I have some peak values.

Only have the four studio albums so far. Next week I should have RANK, BOMBS, WORLD and HATFUL...

Peak value across the board is 100%, except for "I Won't Share You" on STRANGEWAYS which was 82.9%.

So then... same mastering, boosted levels ?

 

Huh. So it could be they're remastered, or it could be the same mastering but with boosted levels, as you say. I guess there's no way to be sure from EAC alone. How do they sound?

 

Yes, tell us about the sound!

 

To be honest, I don't have the equipment or the ears - or copies of the original discs anymore (I purged a lot of discs years ago). Most of my listening these days comes through my computer speakers while I'm at work or on my iPod while I'm walking. I would be happy to provide any other information that may help. Wave samples or screenshots of the wav files...?

I did buy these replicas of Kiss albums and they listed the mastering in the credits. It could be that I haven't looked hard enough but I found no credit regarding mastering.

 

I'd be interested in seeing some screeenshots of wav files when you have the time.

 

Surely. Here's the whole CD of THE QUEEN IS DEAD -



And a closeup look at track one -

 

And one last pair. STRANGEWAYS, full disc -



And the 82.9% peak level "I Won't Share You" -

 

Thanks....maybe we can keep this thread going by comparing the wave forms that Craig posted to other pressings?

Thanks Craig.

I wonder why such a difference with "I won't share you"?

 

Well, just to make matters more confusing, here is a wavform of "stop me....", from the very best of cd....how does this compare to the japan stop me from strangeways?

 

Well, I checked the waveforms out and they're definitely different - they're slightly different lengths as well (more silence). I deleted the silence and they're definitely different.

I would think that if these were remastered, word would have gotten out. I just find it odd that they're different at all, level-wise.

I will try to check some of them against VERY BEST OF, as that's all I have to compare them to at this point.

 

Just read another post here about Japanese CDs in mini album sleeves having questionable sound quality/masterings.

That disturbs me.

 

Well, the waveforms you posted do look rather maximized, and that's generally frowned on around here. But I wouldn't worry about it too much. First, because it's not uncommon for a CD that "breaks the rules" to end up pleasing many, though not all, of the folks here. See the latest Jimi Hendrix remasters, Love, etc. And then second, the only thing that really matters is how they sound to you. If you like 'em, you're set. If you decide that you don't, you can always resell 'em.

 

The rest of the Japanese mini-album CDs:

HATFUL OF HOLLOW - all 100% except:
14 Back To The Old House (66.3%)
16 Please Please Please Let Me Get What I Want (93.5%)

THE WORLD WON'T LISTEN - all 100% except:
10 Asleep (79.1%)

LOUDER THAN BOMBS - all 100% except:
20 Stretch Out And Wait (89.3%)

RANK - all 100%.