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The Technics SL-1200 GAE/G/GR general questions thread

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Halloween_Jack, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    Yes I think you’re right, at first as a HiFi LOMC cartridge, but when DJs adopted the 1200, there were MC DJ variants released.
     
  2. ODS123

    ODS123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    They do not appear to be an authorized dealer… Can’t find them on the technics website. Not that that should matter too terribly much.

    however, I would not purchase if they don’t accept credit cards (an experience shared by an earlier poster about his quest to acquire a 1200 G. from a different dealer)
     
    MikeJedi likes this.
  3. MikeJedi

    MikeJedi Forum Resident

    Location:
    Las Vegas
    That was me about the GAE I attempted to purchase from an ADealer who refused credit cards. Lol. It was nuts. I wonder how TMR got the brand new G GR GAEs. Maybe someone sold them to TMR. ..
     
  4. MusicNBeer

    MusicNBeer Forum Resident

    Location:
    Florida
    My concorde with Sty40 tracks superbly. Resonance is just under 8Hz but I don't care because for some reason it's really robust to tracking warped records. My AT carts don't handle warps as well.

    It's got a nice flat frequency response and doesn't require super low capacitance loading.
     
    Big Blue, johnny q and Oelewapper like this.
  5. I am new to Technics, today I received the brand new SL 1210 GAE (55th Anniversary model). I haven't had a chance to unpack it yet, perhaps on the weekend.

    I have done a bit of research on alignment. Should I just start out with the Technics recommended alignment? Cartridge mounted straight in the headshell (representing the 22° angle) and 15 mm overhang (52 mm dimension with the gauge).

    Looking at some numbers online, like here:

    Tonearm Alignment Calculator Pro - Vinyl Engine

    Simply looking at the numbers, perhaps Lofgren A looks a bit better. I don't think I have too many records with a very narrow deadwax area. Maximum error, maximum distortion and average rms distortion appear to be better with Lofgren A.

    On the other hand, not sure if I would like the looks of the cartridge being mounted at an angle in the headshell. But I guess it is only optical, and if it sounds better that way (unsure about this), maybe it is the way to go.
     
    Dignan2000 and MusicNBeer like this.
  6. ODS123

    ODS123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Goodness gracious, just do what the smart engineers who designed your table Intended for you to do and use the alignment gauge. They knew what they were doing. :)
     
  7. formu_la

    formu_la A.I.

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Check out this article. He mentions the alignment options. Just another opinion, I know, but I like his.
    Technics SL-1200GR / SL-1210GR Turntable Review - Audio Appraisal
     
    ubiknik, Big Blue and rjstauber like this.
  8. formu_la likes this.
  9. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    MM variants, I meant :p
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  10. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    Some say that the resonance frequencies fall below 7Hz threshold, or are pretty close to it, so borderline. That's using this formula: Resonance frequency
    As I said above, probably wrong numbers are at play. Which figure should one use for the tonearm EM: 4.5 (12-7.5)? You said:
    but isn't the EM measured differently than just by simply weighing the wand?

    I thought the same when read those opinions.
     
  11. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    In other words this:
    So, logically you can't just subtract the headshell 7.5 weight from 12 and have the EM of the arm without headshell and then add the Concorde total weight. I think it doesn't work that way.
     
  12. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    No it doesn't, and that's not what I did when I estimated it above. You have to consider where the center of mass is in respect to the connector and apply a correction factor.And in a subsequent post, someone else said that it does measure between 7 and 8 Hz, so that somewhat corroborates my estimation. If we did what you suggest and just add the difference in the Concorde weight, the resonance would calculate to below 7 Hz, around 6.5 Hz. Probably still OK, but starting to get marginal without any tonearm dynamic damping.

    Still, in the end if you want accuracy, you have to measure the resonant frequency, as someone reported above, though not sure which method they used.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  13. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    What connector? (Not kidding.)

    For which Concorde? There are different models/compliances.

    I didn't suggest that, I think you did?
    Again, for which compliance/Concorde?

    How?
    :angel:
     
  14. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    I'm quoting this again because I found the post I couldn't the first time:
     
  15. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    The connector on the end of the tonearm tube where both the headshell and the Concorde attach.

    I don't know, but most of the stylus assemblies that would likely be used by the audiophiles on this site are listed at 25 cu on the KAB site, so that's what I used in the calculation. Not sure what the poster that measured the RF has.

    I suggested you could do it that way and probably be close enough, resonant frequency calculations don't really require much precision, but I gave the results based on estimating the center of mass to improve accuracy, per below ...

    It's probably close enough to just add the extra Concorde weight compared to the stock headshell (18.5 - 7.5) onto the 12 g effective mass, though you can try to find the center of mass and make a reduction based on that, maybe just multiply the difference by 75%

    I don't know, see above.

    It's been covered many many times around here, but just record a few seconds of music without a subsonic filter engaged and look at the frequency spectrum. You should see the resonance frequency rise in response in the 10Hz and below region.
     
  16. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    Davey likes this.
  17. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I think the Technics alignment with the gauge sounds good, and I’ve not felt a need to try anything else. My reason is not some blind faith in the Almighty Infallible Technics Engineer Gods, but because it’s easier to set up correctly that way than trying to angle the cartridge while stooping over the turntable and trying to see how the cantilever lines up on a mirrored null point grid. If it didn’t sound great, I’d possibly pursue other options, but it does sound great, and I think I’d be less likely to get a different alignment geometry exactly right.

    However, the fact that it’s a Technics turntable shouldn’t somehow render traditional alignment geometries useless or inferior. They’re just not as easy to set up.
     
    csgreene, rjstauber and recstar24 like this.
  18. ODS123

    ODS123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    I don't believe the decisions of the Technics engineers to be devine or god-like. ..Just the result of good old fashioned evidence based engineering.

    By the time the G/ GAE's were designed Technics had more than enough time to re-think their alignment tool and change to the Lofgren.
     
  19. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Sure, they could have redesigned the angle of the s-curve and changed the overhang distance to square up to a different alignment, had they any reason to do that. However, the fact that they didn’t doesn’t make their alignment geometry inherently superior. Cartridge alignment is a matter of personal preference that is not specific to each model of turntable. Technics having decided sometime in the ‘70s they liked a sorta-Stevenson geometry and then not seeing a need to reconsider that because it works fine does not mean they have optimized anything.
     
    recstar24 and Davey like this.
  20. ODS123

    ODS123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    They had all the tools and resources to know which is best. ..Yes, I agree.
     
  21. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    I use an Ortofon plug n play cartridge, as God and Technics intended!
     
  22. ODS123

    ODS123 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    oh, brother... I've created a meme :)
     
  23. nomad709

    nomad709 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    USA
    Easier to find bigfoot riding a unicorn than it is to find an available new 1200G, wow
     
  24. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
  25. nomad709

    nomad709 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    USA

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