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The Technics SL-1200 GAE/G/GR general questions thread

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Halloween_Jack, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    Agreed 100%

    the eyeball is not calibrated lol

    my guess spec is <0.020 " or 0.50 mm
     
    snorker likes this.
  2. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    I'm way too busy keeping my own equipment and records dust free already!
    Suspended wooden floors and lovely static inducing carpet make sure to keep me occupied with that during the winter ;)
     
    johnny q and Ingenieur like this.
  3. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    If 0.020" the deviation is 0 +/- 0.010" in 0.9 sec. Mine is < 1/2 of that.

    That is a vertical acceleration of +/- 3e-5 g from null vs the 1 g holding the stylus down. 0.0032%

    I doubt even a good 180 gm lp is that flat.
     
    recstar24 likes this.
  4. T86911

    T86911 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    France
    After i was refunded my G MIM for wobble, i look for a GR (I don't care the origin for a GR) and i saw that the nightmare wobble still here...
    I was about to push the purchase button but now i hesitate again...Pffff...
     
  5. Slimwhit33

    Slimwhit33 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Orange County NY
  6. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    I don't have time to post a video but my naked eye can see a distinct wobble when focussed on either the bottom or top of the platter (not the dots). I looked at a video earlier in this thread and my issue is similar - forum advice was to return. I use the bottom of platter and reference the plinth as the stationary area. My solid metal Mana TT spirit level sits over the spindle and clearly shows the level deviations.

    The platter strobe dots aren't perfect either, one area is out so looks pretty obvious when rotating. Leave it off if it can't be done right. And people with older and cheaper Technics TT's say their finish was fine....

    Also, didn't mention that the rubber mat is not properly circular - easily noticeable when rotating. OK, so it's covered by a record in play and I would not worry about this much but it's a bit sloppy.

    I would not care on a sub £500 product but I am not happy with them on a £1300 product, even though I paid £200 less. And, it would make it harder to sell on if I spring for a G later. I already have a TT which does not have near this same wobble so it's an issue for me.

    I called retailer and they say they will exchange - awaiting details. If the next one is similarly afflicted then I'll have to think carefully.

    I have not got any issue at all with MiM decks at all as long as they maintain QC. I have visited their fine country many times. However, a recent review on my retailers website also cites fairly poor QC with their SL1200GR MiM deck ....

    "I've been a Technics owner for ~25 years. My DJing days are behind me, so I decided to sell my SL-1200MK2s to fund a GR. Unfortunately, I'm not sure I've done the right thing. I'm pretty disappointed with the new turntable.

    The quality of the paintwork is not great. This is actually a replacement unit. The first one had similar issues and was replaced by Richer. I thought it must have been a one off, but both the original and the replacement were poorly finished.

    The platter mat is not perfectly round, so from above, appears to 'wobble' from side to side when the platter is spinning. The centre hole looks like someone has made it with a nail and the hole is actually too small to fit the spindle, so the mat doesn't sit flat on the platter. As a result, records don't sit flat on the mat, making them look warped when they are spinning and causing tracking problems during playback.

    Overall, I'm not impressed. Especially at this price point. It's not what I would expect from a £1299 bit of kit."
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  7. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    It can't be judged by eye.
    Need a dial runout gauge.

    I measured mine, tight, less than <0.010"
    0.006 and 0.008 depending on point of measurement.
    It looks like it wobbles to the naked eye.

    The focus of the eye distorts it.
     
    snorker likes this.
  8. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    The spirit level over the platter does not though. Virtually no deviation on my other TT.

    And, the other issues...
     
  9. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    A bubble on the center of the spindle moves when the platter is slowly rotated?
    Sounds like the TT is not leveled.
     
  10. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    honestly, issues are often perceived, more than real.
    Hope it works out for you.

    again, only a gauge will tell the true tale
     
  11. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    The spirit level fits flush over the spindle. It is dedicated for turntable use, precisely machined. It is supposed to be used to level the TT i.e. adjust the feet to centre the bubble and except minimal deviation thereafter. I run the platter under motor power to check.

    My other TT runs virtually no deviation using the same procedure and also exhibits virtually no visible platter wobble either. The Technics has plenty more bubble deviation and my visual observation backs it up.

    And, aside from that, the finish of the strobe markings on the exterior and the rubber mat is not great in any case. Though I would have lived with it.

    Mine and the other reviewers' QC issues are not imagined/perceived imo, with all due respect. You have an A1 sample which is great but I'm not happy with mine. Not bitterness on my part at all, I have other options, but I do have an AT OC-9XML and AT headshell bought for it which is not ideal....
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  12. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    A bubble level will not have 0.001" resolution.
    Neither will your eye.
    The error multiplies.

    Perhaps a Technics is not for you.
    Time for you to move on to something else?
    Good luck in your search.

    Running the TT exerts forces on the bubble/fluid. Any deviation will be multiplied.
    Even on mine.

    My dots are irregular. The mat is out of round slightly, the spindle hole is eccentric.
    As the platter rotates it varies with the plinth but is true to the dial.
    MiJ
     
  13. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    If you can afford a $1700 or $4000 turntable you can afford a runout gauge. Things are getting a bit ridiculous about this topic on here. I always suggest buying from a retailer that will take no questions asked returns on any gear. I also think with supply shortages some of these dealers may be selling customer returns or demo units that shouldn't go out to customers.
     
    rtrt, aunitedlemon, C.Ludwig and 2 others like this.
  14. KeithL

    KeithL Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    No detectable wobble on my SL1500C. Only complaint was the crappy headshell which was indented for eternity out of true. That went straight in the bin.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
    dcarwin likes this.
  15. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident

    What would be interesting and shut everyone up is if you could post a test tone or something played on it that soudns wavery/wobbly/not pitch stable...
    I believe you're unhappy, but it's a record player, this really should be how such things are judged. It sounds like you, like me, bought it for low wow and flutter among other reasons, so that would be a game changer for me and I'd be wanting another.
    At the end of the day you're not 100% happy and at that price point you should be! I am now that I have a few niggles put behind me and you should be for that much money too!
     
    Ingenieur likes this.
  16. Slimwhit33

    Slimwhit33 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Orange County NY
    So now you quote one other person on another site.. ugh. Ok, so we're at 3 cases (only one with video evidence that I'm aware of) out of 10's of thousands? Super. Thanks for letting us all know to tread carefully on a product with a 99.9998% (assuming 15k sold units) satisfaction rating.

    The sky ain't falling. Pick another table and enjoy it.
     
    Ingenieur likes this.
  17. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    The video I referenced is on this thread - and the forum advised the wobble was excessive. The review I quoted questioning MiM QC is from the site I bought it from. People can make their own minds up. And I said I'm not bitter in the least, I already own a comparable TT. I prefer hires digital in any case LOL.

    What exactly is your problem - just here to annoy or wind people up? Posting replies with one rolling eyes and that's it? You don't even own this TT according to your sig so why are you posting here?

    Btw, you're going on ignore so don't bother responding. Virtually never use it but your attitude sucks.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  18. Slimwhit33

    Slimwhit33 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Orange County NY
    I find it odd that people make these sweeping comments about supposed QC issues with zero proof. We have one video on this site that I’ve seen. You’ve shown nothing and backing up your claims with another set of comments from the site you bought it from is also meaningless IMO.

    I’ve had a 1200G on back order for almost a year, so I’m allowed to peek in on this forum from what I have gathered.

    Videos of this supposed problem or yawn. And if I get mine (and that seems like a huge if in the States still tbh.. lol) and it has the issue, I’ll post it here with a video. If we start seeing an influx of video proof it’s an issue. Today, it ain’t an issue. Even if you and the guy on the other site posted vids, it’s still not an overarching QC issue. It’s 3 out of ?? A very small %.

    My only point.
     
    Ingenieur likes this.
  19. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    Now that's quite some time!
    Did you finally get it?
    I got mine some years ago at the authorized Technics dealer nearby - they have two in stock most of the time.
     
    Slimwhit33 likes this.
  20. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    I don't use the stock headshell either. I consider it akin to "throw in" cartridges that come with some turntables.
     
    Oelewapper likes this.
  21. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    Technics headshells are definitely better than most other generic OEM headshells due to their low mass, there are many lookalikes that weigh quite a lot more.
    Technics vs Reloop lookalike for example:
    [​IMG]
    This one came with my Technics SL-1200G

    [​IMG]
    This one came with my Technics SL-1210M5G

    [​IMG]
    This one came with my Reloop RP-2000MK3


    But it can't beat any premium aftermarket headshell, so I'm not using them either.
     
    T86911, tin ears and patient_ot like this.
  22. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    That video proves nothing.
    Only a dial gauge can.


    With your expectations and disappointments might be better to move on.

    Do you have a pic of your TT?
    The back label
    The box, how's it labeled?
    pics would be great

    I think he is skeptical because you have shown no proof.
     
  23. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Regards your points:

    Dial gauge: you may well be correct, although several others disagreed on the YouTube video earlier in thread and mine is at least at that level. But hey. Basically, I'm not going to invest buy a dial gauge at this point because a) I don't need want to wait more days to sort this out while I would wait for delivery of it b) it could potentially mark the platter and I'll not be able to return . As indicated earlier, I have already agreed an exchange in an entirely friendly manner with the retailer so let's see. Hopefully, all is resolved with the swap.

    Expectations: my expectation of a £1300 / $1800 deck is just that it's finished properly, as befitting the premium price Technics ask. I have no beef about them building in Malaysia, though there's no doubt a lack of premium cachet vs the MiJ ones. Travelled Malaysia extensively and it's a great country and companies like Sony have been manufacturing there for years. Nevertheless, Technics have made cheaper versions which do not seem to exhibit the flaws observed. No worries if that can't happen - like I said, I've already got a similar spec TT but I wanted to try a direct drive with better build quality. I'll move on if that's not possible. And I prefer my Benchmark DAC2 over listening to a TT as of now.

    Photos: No, TT is packaged up again now ready for pick-up tomorrow or next day.

    The guy I blocked: general tosser/mischief maker. I can do without thanks. I come here for friendly debate and exchange of thoughts.

    That's the last I'll post on this until I get the replacement. Cheers. :)
     
  24. Ingenieur

    Ingenieur Forum Resident

    Location:
    Gone
    there is no disagreeing with a dial gauge...none
    It is a number. Not debateable.

    No pics?

    we have no idea of how it is 'finished' or performs.

    The video show no issues. One complaint was the mat hole was too small, just push it down.

    You are spreading misinformation with 0 back-up. It is confusing.
     
  25. Markym

    Markym Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    I said I wouldn't post again and I've been pleasant to you. I don't take kindly to being told I'm spreading misinformation. I'm relaying what I observe. You want me to unpack the TT to take some photos and a video for you LOL? Ignore my posts and find someone else to troll pls. Cheers.
     

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