Timewatching: The Divine Comedy Album-by-album thread

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by LivingForever, Nov 5, 2020.

  1. The Turning Year

    The Turning Year Lowering average scores since 2021

    Location:
    London, UK
    This has gone over my little head o_O:laugh:, but I do understand how these changes subtley shift the mood, and I'm sure that's probably why I feel such an emotional attachment to it even without realising.
     
  2. jon-senior

    jon-senior Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eastleigh
    Ha! Cleverer people than me would be able to explain why each individual change is so effective, but I only have a very vague grasp on the theory!
     
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  3. a paul

    a paul Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    I really disliked this song for a long while. Maybe because it felt so full after the excitement and catchiness of National Express. And it didn't seem to be as good as the other slow song that follows it. But at some point it clicked with me a bit more, and I ended up finding it fine.

    So I will give it fine/5.

    (3.5)
     
  4. The Booklover

    The Booklover Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    I don't doubt this at all since there's plenty of evidence beyond the cover of "Life On Mars?" in the lyrics:
    So, don’t rely on the starry skies / Screw the universe / You ought to try / To live your life / On Earth

    Plus, why refer to the nature programme when there aren't even animals mentioned for a change?

    By the way, the lines above remind me of the great 1992 Pulp track "Space":
    Space is OK
    But I'd rather
    I'd rather get my
    I'd rather get my kicks down below
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  5. Vagabone

    Vagabone Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Well, that's the clear message of the lyrics, yes, but I don't get how that strengthens the case that it's a reference to "Life on Mars" whose lyrics, whatever they're about, aren't really about life on mars.

    I just googled "Life on Earth", and the TV show was the first thing that came up, even now. True, it's a UK thing, but Hannon was and is still writing for a largely UK audience.
    "Life on Earth" (the TV show) was about far more than animals, it covered the evolution of all life on this planet. It was quite philosophical as I remember it, not just an excuse to show wildlife footage. It was a major landmark show, before eventually becoming the first in a trilogy of similarly ambitious big-budget series. It originally aired in 1979 but it was repeated in the 1980s when I was a child. I remember my dad getting me and my brother to watch it, saying , "This is a really important series, and it might not be repeated again for years". I can't believe that Neil Hannon, who is some years older than me, would be unaware of the show. And Ockham's razor would suggest that a song title refers to the famous thing with the same name rather than another famous thing with a similar name, despite the coincidence of Neil covering the Bowie song.

    Also, on the very next album there is another song that could well be named after a UK TV show, "Mastermind". Then later we have "Arthur C Clarke's Mysterious World" and "'Opportunity' Knox".

    EDIT: note that, in the linked Wikipedia article, a new edit of the show was screened in 1997 or 1998.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  6. The Booklover

    The Booklover Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Well, you've made a strong case here (for the programme as well). So your take might be true. Once again, in the end, I think it doesn't really matter what Neil intended. From the listener/reader's perspective both readings sound plausible, which is a good thing.

    Given Neil's repeated participation in the TV show, I definitely won't argue that "Mastermind" was named after the boardgame.;)
     
  7. ericthegardener

    ericthegardener Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Life on Earth

    All the “French resistance accordion tango songs” are going to get high marks from me. Not a ton to say about this about this one, except that I like that Neil seems to be finding his mature singing voice that relies less on inhabiting a character and cheesiness, and more on the weariness (or joy) of his own actually-lived-life. I love his voice on lots of the earlier songs, but regardless of whether or not I prefer his later songwriting I do prefer where his voice ended up on later albums. I don't think he fully settles into that new voice until Absent Friends, but I hear the start of it here.

    4.7/5
     
  8. jon-senior

    jon-senior Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eastleigh
    I'm not sure I've ever really considered Neil's vocal change over the years in that way before, but I think you're absolutely right. That would be my preference too.
     
  9. RadiophonicSound

    RadiophonicSound Electrosonic

    Location:
    Royal Oak MI
    Huh, interesting. I’ve generally felt his singing has gradually gone a little downhill on the last few records, whether because of smoking or age or whatever, but I’ll see if I change my opinion as we get to those tracks.
     
  10. ericthegardener

    ericthegardener Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    To be clear, I'm not offering an opinion about his technical abilities as a singer, just the character and style of his singing.
     
  11. The Turning Year

    The Turning Year Lowering average scores since 2021

    Location:
    London, UK
    I agree with @Radiophonic_ about it going downhill since Absent Friends but (apart from Victory...) I don't mind its more 'lived in' quality.

    Like @ericthegardener and @jon-senior I think I also prefer his more mature style of singing (technical ability aside) as I feel it has a lovely rustic, honest quality and real warmth and humanity which better reflects what seems to be his real character.
    I think it suits some of his earlier songs very well, and brings something new to them, for example Lucy.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  12. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    Life on Earth

    When I first got “Fin”, both this and “Eric” were “the boring ones”, and would frequently get skipped once I’d got fully familiar with the album as a whole. And whilst “Eric” has recently been reassessed, I still struggle with this one a bit.

    I suppose it’s only normal that it didn’t reach out and grab me straight away - it’s very much a song for someone approaching the end of a millennium, and indeed the end of their 20’s, wondering a little what they did with their life up to now and offering sage advice so that others don’t waste theirs... not so much for a 19-year old at uni who feels he has the whole world in front of him.

    Now I’m 42, the sentimentality of the tune and the morose nature of the lyrics strikes much more of a chord; (and indeed now that @jon-senior has explained the chords, the chords are also tugging at my heartstrings a little!)

    It’s the awkward marching rhythm and “French Resistance Accordion Tango” feel (TM Livingforever, 2021) that I still don’t think I really get. It makes it maudlin where it should be beautiful. In fact the only part I really love is where the drums drop out and the gorgeous melody is played by the ethereal piano and doubled up by the choir - that right there makes the song worth a 3.5

    But the rest of it, I still don’t enjoy enough to stop this being my least favourite track on what, let’s face it, is a pretty darn solid album.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
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  13. The Booklover

    The Booklover Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    I agree. This is the prototype of what I referred to as TDC's derivative Francophile dirges. Musically, this style doesn't appeal to me. I think the verses are OK and I do like the choral interlude, but the "Au revoir joie, bonjour tristesse" (again pandering to French audiences by referencing Françoise Sagan's famous novel) chorus lets this down, especially the clichéd over-the-top vocal delivery after the interlude.

    That said, I really like the lyrics and message here.

    That's a great analysis which lets me appreciate the song more. I'm still undecided whether I should give it 3 or 3.5 points.

    I enjoyed that too. The new otherworldly synth bit is great, a successful update for the Regeneration era.

    Yes, it's different from the approach in the Pulp lyric I quoted above.
     
  14. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    I have to say; there are going to be a LOT of extra tracks to go through between “Fin” and “Regeneration”...

    A whole stack of “Fin” B-sides, then the tracks from “Secret History” and their single B-sides...

    And quite a number of collaboration tracks which I really want to cover, too. Hope you’re all onboard for the journey!
     
  15. jon-senior

    jon-senior Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eastleigh
    I think you know we are!! :agree:
     
  16. The Booklover

    The Booklover Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Thanks for posting these. The live rendition here is so much more energetic than the single version (but still ruined by the samples).
     
  17. ericthegardener

    ericthegardener Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Absolutely! I'd be disappointed if we didn't hit a lot of these extra tracks.
     
  18. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    Excellent! I’ll be relying on people to let me know if I miss anything critical :)
     
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  19. The Turning Year

    The Turning Year Lowering average scores since 2021

    Location:
    London, UK
    Yes Sir! Definitely onboard for the voyage... :righton:
    There is a lot of great/interesting/slightly odd stuff in this period if I remember rightly :)
     
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  20. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    Counting things up now. Just on the “Fin” singles there are 7 brand-new Neil-composed songs and 7 covers...!
     
  21. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    I make it 33 additional officially released studio tracks to cover between “Sunrise” and “Timestretched” ... :sigh:
     
  22. LivingForever

    LivingForever Forum Arachibutyrophobic Thread Starter

    I’ve not even had time to go through the treasure trove you sent me!
     
  23. ericthegardener

    ericthegardener Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Is that amazing?! Essentially 3 albums worth of extra material. This thread may never end!
     
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  24. Hazey John II

    Hazey John II The lyrics are fine, there's no problem there

    I agree with @jon-senior, the chords make this one - one of Neil's prettiest progressions. There's so little to the melody, almost a single line repeated with variations, laid on top of the chords. Hannon's such a good lyricist and so driven by themes that it's always tempting to start with the lyric, but the early idea suggests the music was all on piano first, lyrics following later to match the mood. The four stanzas are quite loosely connected - I wouldn't be entirely surprised to find they were stitched out of a notebook like Through A Long and Sleepless Night.

    The Attenborough and Bowie links had never occurred to me until today, and both are interesting, but it seems silly to me to wonder which one Neil had in mind, because I can't believe he had the idea of inverting Bowie first. It seems more likely the line came to him when trying to fit something to the tune, and maybe later on he realised what it could mean. (At least, that happens to me a lot when I write songs - a line will come that is just right, and then I'll realise why it works later.)

    Anyway, I always had a soft spot for this - it's a minor song in many ways, but it's a very pure distillation of the 'classic' multi-faceted DC approach. I love the resigned pose with a smile at the corner of the mouth - "It's this kind of mood. Play along with me?" - and it makes me feel like a co-conspirator. Let's indulge ourselves, we all know we don't mean it... don't we? Which allows Hannon to get away with outrageous moments like the Crouch End Festival chorus sending us to heaven and the absurd growl and scoop on the second "happiness". It's such a fun sad song. The 2001 version, insisting on being taken seriously, is a dour dirge; the twinkle in the eye is everything.

    4.5/5
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  25. Hazey John II

    Hazey John II The lyrics are fine, there's no problem there

    I thought about suggesting doing the Fin B sides with their respective A sides to break things up a bit, but forgot to mention it - too late now, and maybe not a good idea anyway. It'll be an interesting month! I'll probably still not comment on many of the live tracks and cover songs, but definitely want to listen again to the Hannon originals - lots of good stuff there.
     
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