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VAN MORRISON Album by Album Discussion: Part 2 (Wavelength 1978 - Enlightenment 1990)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Clarkophile, Nov 26, 2007.

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  1. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    Welcome!:wave:

    A pity the long-rumoured Yanni-Vanni collaboration never came to fruition, innit?;)
     
  2. albert_m

    albert_m Forum Resident

    Location:
    Atl., Ga, USA
    All three non album versions blow away the album versions. The synth production is difficult to listen to. You can hear how it will kill any song, no matter how good otherwise. And we know from the versions found elsewhere, that there are some truly good songs involved.

    The album as it is, I can only listen to and enjoy on some level, Higher than the World and Inarticulate No 2.
     
  3. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    Here's the review of Inarticulate Speech of the Heart from AMG:

     
  4. Sneaky Pete

    Sneaky Pete Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC USA
    Others who bought it, cherish it a little less. I'm not naming any names, I'm just saying.;)
     
  5. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    In case anyone is interested, I pinned down another instrumental for my Vanstrumental collection: "Much Binding in the March", from the shelved Mechanical Bliss album sessions.

    I learned from the Heylin book that the instrumental "Caledonia Soul Music", in its full-length form, would take up an entire side of an album.

    Back to Inarticulate Speech, one of the outtakes from the sessions was "Showbusiness," which turned up on The Philosopher's Stone. My guess is it was left off because the anti-Biz vibe of that song and the peaceful vibe on the album didn't jibe.
     
  6. dee

    dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    ft. lauderdale, fl
    I like the idea of this instrumental approach, as well as the meditation collection. I hope as the thread moves along, these projects will continue to be updated, and completed. :righton:
     
  7. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    Oh yeah, I'm still working on 'em. I'll definitely post the results here when I'm done because...well, because you're the only ones who would care!:laugh:
     
  8. DJ WILBUR

    DJ WILBUR The Cappuccino Kid

    :tsk: I would care too!!!!
     
  9. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    WILLIAM!!!!!!!:wave:
     
  10. DJ WILBUR

    DJ WILBUR The Cappuccino Kid

    :wave:
     
  11. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    William, when can we expect your introduction to Live at the Grand Opera House Belfast?
     
  12. dee

    dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    ft. lauderdale, fl
    Just want to say that, for what it's worth, I read your post real quick, and I read Live at the Grand Opera House BREAKFAST! ;) :D
     
  13. Craig

    Craig (unspecified) Staff

    Location:
    North of Seattle
    Michael Hayward's outstanding Unofficial Van Morrison website has moved:

    http://www.vanmorrison.net/

    Read the "What's New" section for the story.
     
  14. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    Thanks, Craig.

    Yikes! That's deplorable. Here's the text of the message:

    January 17, 2008
    Normally I would be getting excited about the upcoming re-issues of Van's back catalog on CD (in many cases with bonus tracks) and directing Van's fans to those CDs through our links to Amazon.com. Instead, however, the New Year gets off to a much rockier start -- as long-time and loyal site visitors will already know.

    This site began as a personal hobby about 12 years ago, an expression of my own enthusiasm for Mr. Morrison's music, which I hoped to share with other fans. Because of these beginnings this site was located in personal webspace at the university where I work; a fact which was entirely circumstantial and which does not indicate any official endorsement on the part of the university. Over the past dozen years this site grew organically as Van's fans -- you, in other words -- contributed to the content: CD reviews, information about new recordings and upcoming concerts, background information on references contained in Mr. Morrison's song lyrics. As such it is not too far out of line to state that, if there is any site on the internet which is a collective and collaborative expression of Van's fan base it is this one.

    The tone is respectful; there is no advertising on the site -- never has been; there is no facilitation or encouragement of piracy; in fact the site has long contained a statement to the effect that bootlegging was "not condoned". Any fair-minded visitor to the site is likely to have concluded that the site promoted, and helped fans to better understand, Mr. Morrison's work.

    Despite this history, despite all of these facts, on Monday, January 14 I received a message from someone working for an outfit named WebSheriff, who claimed to represent Van Morrison and Exile Productions. According to the message, this website stands accused of (and I quote): "numerous infringements of our said clients' IP [ed: Intellectual Property] rights including, but not limited to, the infringement of copyrights, trademarks, goodwill, performers rights, moral rights, publicity rights, privacy rights and the wholesale facilitation of further, numerous infringements by third parties on a grand scale (such as providing access to bootleg / unauthorised / illegal recordings)" end quote. I'll repeat for emphasis: "wholesale facilitation of"; "on a grand scale".

    Additionally the message implied that I was "participating in and actively encouraging the aforementioned infringements" end quote. I'll repeat for emphasis: "participating"; "actively encouraging".

    The message further insisted that I take down the site down immediately (my emphasis) pending discussions to resolve the alleged infringements -- with the implied threat of legal action if I did not comply. In my reply I pointed out that if there were, in fact, infringements, then they were unintentional and in any event remained unproven, and that a polite request to remedy the matter (with details and an explanation) would in all likelihood have been promptly acted upon by myself. Despite the fact that I have had no verifiable proof that the correspondent actually does represent Mr. Morrison; despite the fact that not one specific example of these alleged offenses has been offered, I took the site offline as a gesture of good will.

    I was to receive a list of 'Guidelines' within 48 hours, 'Guidelines' which would presumably detail the means "whereby your freedom of expression can harmoniously co-exist with the rights of this artist / his production company to protect their intellectual property rights against commercially and artistically damaging infringements" end quote.

    I suppose I should be honored that this site is considered of sufficient stature that it is (allegedly) a threat to Mr. Morrison's image and livelihood. But the truth is that I'm pissed off at the heavy-handed and bully-boy way in which this situation has been handled, with messages from WebSheriff directed, not just to me personally, but to my employer as well.

    I can't help but ask: what on earth were Mr. Morrison and his managers/advisors thinking when they hired a company who seems to view the internet as a wild west show filled with "outlaws"? (I urge you to visit the WebSheriff site -- specifically their "Outlaws Gallery" page -- to see what I mean) Is this an indication of how Mr. Morrison views his fans: as "outlaws"? I sincerely hope not.

    As noted above I took the site temporarily offline as an expression of good will and (to borrow from the legalese with which WebSheriff's message was larded) "without prejudice", and have been waiting patiently to receive the promised 'Guidelines'. 48 hours (and more) have elapsed without a followup, which is why I have decided that it is time to go back online.

    However I have no intention of further involving the university in this imbroglio, which is why the site has this brand new home at vanmorrison.net. I had hoped to roll out a site redesign before migrating, but obviously circumstances did not permit; look for a new design and new features in future, though (as always with things like this: "as time permits"). Inevitably with such an abrupt transition there will be a few rough edges, so please let me know if you find anything on the site which needs attention (for example the site's Search facility seems to be broken; I'll look into that). I apologize for all the broken links and broken bookmarks out there; I expect that it will take some to track down and update all references to the site's original location (all help in this is gratefully accepted).

    For the record (and to echo the note which is prominently featured on the site's main page), this is an unofficial site. Mr. Morrison's official site can be found here. Opinions expressed herein do not represent the views of Mr. Morrison in any way. This site does not facilitate or condone piracy; we do not accept tacky advertising. We encourage (and facilitate) the purchase of Mr. Morrison's commercial recordings in the fervent hope that Mr. Morrison lives long and prospers.

    Thanks to all those loyal visitors who wrote in to express their concern about the site's disappearance; it was definitely appreciated. I will try to keep you posted on the "discussions" with WebSheriff. Let's just hope that Van comes to his senses and shows some appreciation for the loyal support of his (often long-suffering) fans. This kind of strong-arm tactic can quickly destroy a lot of fan good will.
     
  15. ZenArcher

    ZenArcher Senior Member

    Location:
    Durham, NC
    What good does it do to protect your IP if you kill your fan base?

    I can understand that IP has to be protected and bad precedents can't be set, but artists should simply strike a deal with non-profit fan sites that allows them some leeway. But to come out blazing against fans who are trying to generate interest in your own career, that's crazy!
     
  16. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    This is all about control, nothing else. I don't think Van cares one whit about his fanbase. And it appears that this is business as usual at Exile. Check this out--from the preface of Heylin's bio:

     
  17. dee

    dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    ft. lauderdale, fl
    I don't mean to sound naive ;) , but this naivete' is leading me to speculate that maybe Van himself has nothing to do with this kind of internet policing? This blind presumption of mine too is telling me that Van's interest and understanding of the kind of site referred to that is devoted to his life's work and resides in the web, is possibly completely alien to him, and not even on his radar? I've checked his official site, once, I think. I'm going to go on and check it again now. I'm sure it's quite the Van database and/or promotional model. :shake:
     
  18. dee

    dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    ft. lauderdale, fl
    Pretty much a bare-bones official site, I guess. Nice idea with streaming a video from the Montreaux dvd, but not much else going on there, really. And the shop looks to be paid by the pound - no good for us dollar people!
     
  19. curbach

    curbach Some guy on the internet

    Location:
    The ATX
    Hi, Tom. You forgot "High Spirits" after helpfully remembering the title for me ;) Also, I was listening ahead last night and discovered we have forgotten "Evening Meditation" (which admittedly is somewhat forgettable. . .)
     
  20. Clarkophile

    Clarkophile Up in T.O. keepin' jive alive Thread Starter

    Right you are! Thanks.
     
  21. DJ WILBUR

    DJ WILBUR The Cappuccino Kid

    any last thoughts? we're moving on to the Opera House in a few hours.
     
  22. DJ WILBUR

    DJ WILBUR The Cappuccino Kid

    LIVE AT THE GRAND OPERA HOUSE BELFAST

    (Released February, 1984)

    1. Introduction: Into the Mystic (Instrumental) / Inarticulate Speech of the Heart (1:06)
    2. Dweller On the Threshold (3:38)
    3. It's All in the Game / You Know What They're Writing About (7:08)
    4. She Gives Me Religion (4:35)
    5. Haunts of Ancient Peace (6:24)
    6. Full Force Gale (2:23)
    7. Beautiful Vision (3:33)
    8. Vanlose Stairway (5:29)
    9. Rave On, John Donne / Rave On Part Two (9:08)
    10. Northern Muse (Solid Ground) (3:45)
    11. Cleaning Windows (4:48)
    Total time: (52:04)

    Musicians:
    David Hayes: Bass
    Mark Isham: Synthesizer/Trumpet
    John Allair: Organ/Piano
    Pee Wee Ellis: Flute/Saxophone/Vocal (Background)
    Tom Donlinger: Drums
    Mick Glossop: Engineer
    Carol Kenyon: Vocal (Background)
    Kathy Kissoon: Vocal (Background)
    Van Morrison: Guitar/Piano/Director/Keyboards/Saxophone/Vocal/Producer
    Bianca Thornton: Vocal (Background)
    Peter VanHooke: Drums

    Here we are at our second live official release, a decade later and the best song from the performance IMO is not on the album, but is relegated to a 12” vinyl b-side. This 52 minute album would have become a must have if “Summertime in England” from this very concert was added to the song lineup of this cd. That song as previously discussed came to fruition during this tour and is such a missed opportunity to not have had it tagged on as a cd bonus track and we can only hope the powers that be let it be so when this one is remastered with bonus tracks, if this one is slated for that treatment.

    Otherwise, we’ve got a pretty lite opener introduction into a very perfunctory “Dweller on the Threshold” into a very laid back “It’s All In The Game/You Know What They’re Writing About”, and frankly by this time, I think Van lost many who might have dropped the needle originally on this one!

    These first 12 anemic minutes do not capture the power this band had in 1984 and I’m shocked that this is the show and the release we were given. I can only assume they wanted the Belfast show to be released as it was recorded in his home town.

    Still there are some great bits on this album and its in no way a total bust….Almost worth starting at track four with “She Gives me Religion” which feels like a good opener and a great vocal on this one. With a nice soulful vibe and the band finally feel’s to have got into a bit of a groove with one another. This is followed by a truly wonderful “Haunts of Ancient Piece”. Not a song I’ve had the luck to hear live, but this is the way I’d of loved to hear it. Isham is just the perfect touch on this one. Soulful, jazzy, and mystical and is one of my faves on here and bounds into a nice take on “Full Force Gail” and then a perfunctory “Beautiful Vision”.

    From “Vanlose Stairway” to the end the album is a clear winner for me. Vans vocals on “Vanlose” are just goosebump inducing and the backing vocals and instrumentation are perfection. Just a lovely float and it only gets better when “Rave On John Donne” takes flight. Honestly the only reason I can think of not including “Summertime in England” on this album is so it wouldn’t overshadow what is now the highpoint of this live album.

    Rave On is sheer magic and worth the price of this cd. Closing out with one of my faves live "Cleaning Windows". Certainly this is a cd to check out when you have most of his other cds and if you love the grouping of songs he was touring with in 1984, otherwise not essential if you're still building up your Van library with studio albums from the 80s....
     

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  23. garyt

    garyt Forum Resident

    OK, a couple of points I'd like to make - firstly, I was at the Friday night show: the GOH used to sell what are called 'slips' tickets to sold out shows on the morning of the show. The slips are high up at either side of the auditorium, and I had to queue for an hour after working a night shift on the Thursday. Great gig, and Van & the band were very tight. The cheer you hear at the start is VM walking on stage from the wings, up to the mike & beginning to sing.
    Secondly, the live version of Summertime in England on the 12" single isn't from these gigs, but a concert from an earlier tour, recorded at the Ulster Hall, also in Belfast. The band on this version is different, as Phil Coulter is on keyboards.
    Gary
     
  24. Baron Von Talbot

    Baron Von Talbot Well-Known Member

    This was actually 1 of the first 2 CD's i ever bought ! When i played it in my small students flat late one night, lying in bed half asleep / half awake i sometimes woke up and wondered : "How come the Grand Piano is still in this tiny room - how did they manage to put it here ?" - (My previous Living Room had a mighty Grand Piano in it for a few weeks, untill the owner found a possibility to move it to her new home). The Live Sound was so realistic in it's Digital Over Exactness. I read somewhere they recorded most of Van's vocals directly in front of the Piano.
    I really liked that album from the get go. i hadn't bought any VAN records since Wavelength, only knew and liked Cleaning Windows from the Radio.
    I agree with the review before - This set is getting stronger all the time. Although i wouldn't say it sounds anemic at the beginning - but the Band, the Choir and Van need some time to get in the mood . As often with this artist he needs some time and effort to reach the magic he is able to work up, where ever he might get that from.
    I do not care where he takes IT from as long as he finds it and passes it on to his audience.
    One word about the Cover. This CD looked so elegant and tasty, not only this picture of the very beautiful old Opera House, but also the green marble stone that surrounds the picture. All that gives this album the feel of real art and you won't be disappointed. Somehow it is as good as most of It's Too Late To Stop Now and much better than everything recorded Live later.
    I also like the fact he doesn't include his Classics on this CD- This is the best BEST OF you can get from his early to mid 80ies output. 8.5 / 10 Points :)
    :cheers:
     
  25. DJ WILBUR

    DJ WILBUR The Cappuccino Kid

    :hide: oops, I knew it was from Belfast and just ASSumed it was the same gig. I'm a ***** cause I shoulda double checked.

    so is this 52 minute show the whole concert? can you recall any tunes that could be missing?
     
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