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Wandavision / Marvel MCU on Disney+

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Vidiot, Jan 22, 2021.

  1. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

    Hollywood, USA
    Hey, I didn't see a dedicated thread on Wandavision, so I thought I'd start one. This is an absolutely bizarre TV show that ties in to the events of the final Avengers movies, which deals with Vision (the super-android created by Tony Stark) and his unlikely romance with superhero/witch Wanda Maximoff, and Vision sacrificing himself and getting killed by evil villain Thanos.

    The series picks up in a 4x3 B&W world of the late 1950s, with the two of them married and living together in a nice suburban house in the town of "Westview," where Wanda is a magical housewife and Vision is a rising employee with a computer firm -- handy, since he's a computer himself. Their house in the first episode very much resembles Rob & Laura Petrie's home from The Dick Van Dyke Show, though the house begins to change, and by the second show it's the Bewitched house. It's a weird sci-fi/comedy/drama pastiche where nothing is as it seems.

    It's an odd show because they stir in a lot of bizarre elements, and a lot of the comedy seems too broad and heavy-handed and way too obvious... but it's clear they're in an elaborate simulation (kind of like The Matrix) that jumps around in time and space. Who actually controls this world and where they really are, and if Vision is really alive, remains to be seen. The trailers are pretty remarkable:

    I kind of rolled my eyes at the first couple of shows, feeling like "this is what happens when 30-something executives set out to imitate random classic 1960s shows," but after checking out the trailers, I'm a little more jazzed at the spectacle and mystery implied in future episodes. This is an incredibly-expensive TV series -- about 700 people worked on it, and the budget (for a half hour show) is north of $10 million per episode, which is pretty stunning -- and I think it's worth watching, particularly if you're into the Marvel stuff, have a nostalgic feeling for the 1960s and '70s, and have an appetite for a challenging show that goes in weird directions.
  2. PTgraphics

    PTgraphics Senior Member

    I’m looking forward to seeing how this all plays out. I watched a bunch of breakdown videos on YouTube and didn’t pick up a lot of the subtle of semi hidden references in the first 2 episodes.
  3. Quadboy

    Quadboy Forum Resident

    The mention of the 'Stark Industries' toaster makes me 'wanda' if the Old man himself is set to be included later in the season.
    Marvel seem to put little teasers in for a reason.
    The older actor from Endgame [compared to the other actor's 40's version] has been under used throughout the films.
  4. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident

    Mt. Kisco, NY
    We're being set up for a major plot twist. They hinted at it a bit in the trailers. Not everything is as it seems...
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2021
  5. twicks

    twicks Forum Resident

    I don't know if I have the patience to stick it out until the plot twist occurs. My Marvel-loving son and I were both bored silly by the first 2 episodes.
    gabacabriel likes this.
  6. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    I can't even begin to fathom a budget like that. Back in the 60's that would be the budget for an entire season. Not for a show but for a network!
  7. Dillydipper

    Dillydipper Sultan Of Snark

    Central PA
    Consider how much more Marvel programming they thought they'd have ready to go at this point, all that planning hampered by the pandemic hamstringing production schedules. Agendas re-calibrating left and right...

    Just paying people to sit tight and keep washing their hands, with no Magic Kingdoms to pay for it, gotta be making quite a sweat behind those mouse ears!
    Veronica Mars likes this.
  8. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

    Hollywood, USA
    It is pretty stunning. I think Game of Thrones was the first big series that went over $10 million per episode, which quickly became the peak for really big network series. Westworld and Mandalorian pushed it to $15M an episode (worse for the latter, because it's only a 30-35-minute show). Look at it this way: quite a few streaming services are spending $100M-$150M for a 2-hour movie, so spending $30M-$40M for three or four episodes is downright affordable.

    When I was working on network TV dramas in the 1990s and 2000s, $3M was very standard for a one-hour show, and $1M-$1.5M was about where most sitcoms were. (Of course, the longer the shows stayed on the air and the bigger the casts, the more expensive they got.) Famously, Seinfeld, Frasier, and Friends went through the roof the last few seasons, when all the cast members were making millions.

    I think the Marvel TV shows on Netflix were somewhere around $4M-$5M an episode, which is high but not crazy/high. I'm hoping that Disney+ will be able to bring back the better ones, particularly Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and Punisher, which I think were all very well-done. So far, Wandavision has been successful enough that Marvel TV is talking about rolling out more shows; the Hawkeye show with Jeremy Renner and the Loki show with Tom Hiddleston are coming in a few months, I believe.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2021
    googlymoogly and SandAndGlass like this.
  9. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    That is incredible! I just don't see how it is sustainable financially?

    But this comes from someone who grew up watching Irwin Allen science fiction shows on TV.
  10. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical Omnivore

    Victoria, Canada
    I heard some of it is based on the West Coast Avengers comics by John Byrne, somewhere between #42 and #57... any truth to that? I haven't been able to see the show yet.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2021
  11. SmallDarkCloud

    SmallDarkCloud Forum Resident

    It's hard to say. There's nothing in that run of stories of Wanda and Vision being trapped in simulations of television sitcoms (if that is what's happening on the show). There's only been three episodes so far, so it's possible the show might incorporate some of Byrne's stories from West Coast Avengers further down the line.

    Without spoiling anything, I'll mention that Byrne spent a good deal of time between #42 and #50 revisiting and "retconning" Vision's origin (stretching all the way back to Marvel's earliest days as Atlas and Timely comics), which didn't sit well with some readers. Vision's origin in the Marvel movies is completely different than what it is in the Marvel comics, so I'm assuming those stories won't be used on the show, but, hey, you never know. There is a Scarlet Witch story Byrne wrote later, between #52 and #57 (I think), which I can see being used, with some changes, on the show.
    beccabear67 likes this.
  12. noname74

    noname74 Allegedly Canadian

    I wonder if her brother and/or Dad will make an appearance?
  13. Vidiot

    Vidiot Now in 4K HDR! Thread Starter

    Hollywood, USA
    Yeah, the whole streaming business is crazy. Netflix has something like 182 million subscribers worldwide, so you figure if each of them is paying upwards of $10 a month, they have almost $2 billion dollars a month to spend on programming. The studios are gradually taking away all their movies from Netflix and Amazon, which has forced both to create their own shows and movies. But that has transformed Netflix and Amazon to becoming de facto movie studios... albeit without theaters. It's a big paradigm shift.
  14. Daniel Plainview

    Daniel Plainview God's Lonely Man

    I'm intrigued by the premise and trying to be patient but after three episodes I'm getting a little fatigued with it. I found myself feeling restless this week, aside from the interesting part of the show when stuff, you know, happened.

    It would be hard to retcon Visions MCU origin ala Byrne as we saw that happen in Age of Ultron, but maybe they could retcon the retcon and somehow re-tie him to the original Human Torch and Captain America The First Avenger stuffs. That aspect of his backstory was most interesting to me, but Byrne took that away.

    And whatever happened to the reanimated Human Torch anyway? I bailed out on comics not that long afterwards and have no recollection of his doings after Byrne's run.
    pdenny likes this.
  15. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical Omnivore

    Victoria, Canada
    I saw the original Human Torch was some kind of business guy financing a new Heroes For Hire group in the comics circa 1997-1999.

    Namor with Jim Hammond (with beard and cat)...
    jupiter8 and Daniel Plainview like this.
  16. jeroemba

    jeroemba Forum Resident

    As a concept, it probably looked like a great idea, but the show is asking us to take a huge leap of faith. I hate to say it but these first 3 episodes were boring. 1 hour and half just to show us that something is wrong is a bit of a stretch.
    Without the trailer i would have already stopped watching the show.
    Daniel Plainview and kouzie like this.
  17. kouzie

    kouzie Forum Resident

    Batavia, IL
    My feeling is that the folks responsible are taking a page out of Better Call Saul/Breaking Bad playbook of very deliberate and sometimes drawn out storytelling. The problem is that show ain't them. I had my finger on the fast forward button a few times during this week's episode. The little tidbits that are propelling the story into interesting (the pregnancy, Geraldine's comment....) just aren't enough. I really hope that episode 4 breaks things open.
    Daniel Plainview likes this.
  18. I loved the first two 'Bewitched' episodes, wasn't so keen on the 3rd (babies) one. I don't know how many episodes they're planning, but it'd be good to see Quicksilver in some form. I'm trying to avoid trailers and spoiler sites. I'm happy to wait and see how it plays out.
  19. GeetarFreek

    GeetarFreek Forum Resident

    I tried, but found it cringeworthy
    Shawn likes this.
  20. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident

    Mt. Kisco, NY
    I think Netflix just surpassed 200 million subscribers. And consider how many people without subscriptions watch using someone else's...

    It's too bad this model can't work in music streaming and have Spotify paying artists millions to record new music.
    googlymoogly likes this.
  21. SandAndGlass

    SandAndGlass Twilight Forum Resident

    I had no idea there was this kind of money in Netflix. But thinking, if they spend 150M on a weekly show, that's 600M each month. That can chip away at even a 2B budget!
    Vidiot likes this.
  22. biodawg

    biodawg Well-Known Member

    Atlanta, GA
    The first few episodes have definitely been a departure from the feel of the movies. Was expecting more action, but the end of episode 3 gives me hope for at least more suspense/thrill.
    Vidiot likes this.

    GLUDFSSR Senior Member

    Los Angeles, CA
    I don’t know anything about the comics, but watched the first 3 episodes tonight. I like the look of the show, but have no ideal what it is about.
    I did notice on episode 1 which was all in black & white, that when the toast was finished there was a Red light on the toaster, I guess that was supposed to mean something. As well as the 2nd episode with the blood and the toy in the yard both being red. Of course with the 3rd episode being in color and it’s ending I don’t know what to think. I will still watch it next week to see how it plays out.
    Vidiot likes this.
  24. Denim Chicken

    Denim Chicken Dayman, fighter of the Nightman

    Bakersfield, CA
    I’ve really enjoyed it so far. I like how each episode took us to a new decade. Looks like the classic show format will be ending soon and we’ll be getting into the main story, which will be tying into Dr Strange.
    Charles Adams likes this.
  25. GentleSenator

    GentleSenator what if

    Aloha, OR
    weird show, but the slow reveal of a mystery was evident out of the gate. i like the aesthetics but i can't imagine this show being able to hold one's attention if these episodes were longer than 30 minutes. i may take a beating, but imo neither of these two characters were interesting enough in the marvel movies let alone a draw for their own show if you aren't a serious fan of them.

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