Warning to all record collectors!!! (outer bag/inner sleeve concerns)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by rockadelic, Oct 17, 2014.

  1. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    Wow, interesting thread.

    I have one Simply Vinyl LP, ELO Out Of The Blue two record set. It came in a heavy plastic outer with a flap. I've only played it a handful of times since buying it sometime around 2001, and always stored it in the original outer sleeve.

    Anyway, I just pulled it out, and darn, it's got that crazy cloudy haze all over the vinyl surfaces. The records were not like that when new. And I had replaced the original inners and put the records in the same poly-lined inner sleeves I typically use. Those inners have not caused any other issues that I've been aware of. Cleaning on the VPI wouldn't remove the haze, but fortunately the records still play ok.

    So, it's the outer bag causing this reaction?
     
  2. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    The outer sleeve on my Simply Vinyl LP has not bubbled or gone wavy, yet the records were affected.
     
  3. James_S888

    James_S888 Forum Resident

    Yeah, you need to replace those pink inner bags ASAP. Like immediately on arrival.
    I've noticed the problem too. I put the records into MoFi rice paper sleeves.
    A few people need to write to the pressing plants. Those bags suck.
     
  4. wildchild

    wildchild Active Member

    Location:
    phoenix,arizona
    Wow I had heard about the innersleeves leaving plastisizer on the records (including my sealed Die Beatles record!) but never had a problem with the outer sleeves. I only have 1 MFSL record like this but I have never heard Atom heart mother on anything but cat litter vinyl!
     
  5. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    Thanks for the warning.

    This is for real. Right now I'm learning how these outer sleeves are obviously a serious problem. As mentioned above, I have a Simply Vinyl album that came in one of those heavy clear sleeves with the flap.

    Not only has it caused the records in the sleeve to get cloudy, but it has affected two other records--different albums that were stored on either side. I just discovered this...

    Here are a couple quick pictures of the sleeve:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Graham

    Graham Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Great. I've spent a couple of hundred pounds over the last year on PVC sleeves for my records.

    The gatefold ones are thick, like the Simply Vinyl one above (and I have two Simply Vinyl releases that I'll be checking today) but all the other ones are thin. I'll now get rid of the gatefold sleeves but I'm still not sure about the thin ones, which are these:

    http://www.panmer.com/record-sleeves/record-sleeves-pvc/130-micron-12-inch-pvc-record-sleeve.html

    EDIT: Just checked my two Simply Vinyl LPs (Raw Power and Berlin) and neither has any signs of damage. I'm ditching those sleeves anyway, just in case. Those PVC sleeves are different to the ones I've linked to above as they are super thick, whereas the ones above are thin and clear as glass.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
  7. Hi Five

    Hi Five Forum Resident

    Location:
    "Granadaland"
    So what about the Bob Dylan mono vinyl box set? They all have plastic inners.

    [​IMG]

    Should I bin them ASAP?
     
  8. MaximilianRG

    MaximilianRG Forum Resident

    I wonder if this is what happened to my Michael Jackson 45's collection. In came in a long fold out sleeve of thick plastic. All the 45's have double or triple loud tape hiss.

    [​IMG]
     
    ShallowMemory likes this.
  9. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    Those pink inners? In my experience they leave a residue, and it's very easy to scratch the vinyl surfaces as you pull the records out of them.

    I replace those inners immediately.
     
    ellingtonic and Hi Five like this.
  10. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    hvbias likes this.
  11. martinb

    martinb Forum Resident

    I've just spent a couple of hours checking my collection. There's about 20 PVC covers showing signs of bubbling

    This is a thin single cover:
    [​IMG]

    This is one of the thicker gatefold covers:
    [​IMG]

    There's no signs of damage to these records or the ones stored either side. It seems very random, records in different parts of the collection, sleeves bought at various times and from various places. We don't have any humid or extreme temperatures around these parts and the room is always between 68 - 72 degrees F.

    I do already have some of the Polythene covers as well, which are ok. I'm thinking now of replacing the PVC with Polythene, but it's going to be a big and quite expensive job, and the Polythene ones don't look as nice.

    Could have done without this:(
     
  12. melstapler

    melstapler Reissue Activist

    Could heat be a catalyst?
     
  13. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    City of Angels
    It's mainly the type of thick poly outer sleeve that libraries use, with the pocket for the checkout card. You know the type I am sure. It's thick clear and covers the jacket.

    I have seen collections that have used these sleeves on only the high end bit tickets. And it ruined those beautiful records. It's a fog that is cast over the entire record, and the LP never came in contact at all with this sleeve, it did it's damage through the cover and inner sleeve and got the record anyway. So it effects the LP through a couple of layers of paper and cardboard. That's pretty strong reaction. And not the inner sleeves.

    Warner Brothers used a poly inner that I have seen do the same foggy damage as well.
     
  14. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    City of Angels
    No, it's not just sealed elements breaking down, and keeping stuff inside. It's a direct link to the PVC and Vinyl reactions together doing serious damage.

    I have stacks of still sealed records from the 60s and 70s, and none of them are getting the deadly fog that the ones in Library PVC type outers are getting.
     
  15. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    Yes, I just looked at a barely played 1960s Moody Blues record that came from England. The original owner had stored it from new in a thick clear PVC outer sleeve. And under a strong light it's possible to see a fog over the entire vinyl surface. Probably the reaction you have described. Luckily, the record still plays fine.
     
  16. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    City of Angels
    I've seen the fog disappear if it is not too far gone and you store it in paper only from then on out. It's tragic that what one would do to keep their prized records perfect could do them in so totally.
     
    TLMusic likes this.
  17. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    City of Angels
    No, these will be fine for decades. But I do find them a little rougher than I would like for a high priced audiophile grade box. I would use rice paper sleeves, those thin ones like Japanese imports always used with rounded bottom. They take up little room, and are very soft on the LP, and cost little.
     
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  18. ashlee5

    ashlee5 Forum Resident

    WIHAYTA?

    :wave:
     
  19. ashlee5

    ashlee5 Forum Resident

    U2's No Line on the Horizon vinyl came with PVC outer sleeve. I removed the outer from mine and stored it elsewhere (as the outer is part of the artwork). The jacket is now in a protective PE sleeve.

    :wave:
     
    SergioRZ likes this.
  20. 5th-beatle

    5th-beatle Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brazil
    I've got a few McCartney 12" records in direct contact with PVC sleeves, such as "We All Stand Together", "Spies Like Us" (both are picture discs) and "Really Love You" (etched disc), plus a Lennon 7" picture disc from the "Imagine" film. Has anyone had one of these records damaged? Are these the kind of PVC sleeves you are talking about?
     
  21. Classicrock

    Classicrock Forum Resident

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    There's something else going on here. I have a few records that have been kept in their jackets within a PVC sleeve for decades with no problems. Vinyl in direct contact with PVC as with picture discs is another thing. I'm guessing the PVC in these cases has a bad formulation and it may be in isolated batches. Not had any issues with Simply Vinyl so far that all came in these sleeves. The main problem with PVC is it laminating to the album cover. Best avoided with shiny/laminated sleeves.
     
  22. Graham

    Graham Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
  23. drbryant

    drbryant Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Yes. My copy of Really Love You has clouded and the sleeve is wavy. The PVC sleeve for Lennon's Happy Xmas 12" single is a mess, with bubbles all over the place that have caused the title sticker to come loose. It's hard to see any damage because it's white vinyl, and have not played it, but I'm sure it's ruined. The PVC outer sleeves for the Fireman Electric Arguments album are starting to pucker at the top.

    The worst was a Universal Japan "Pure LP" reissue of the Stones Sticky Fingers. It's only a year or so old and it is not only bubbling, but has caused clouding on the translucent white vinyl and has affected the outer sleeves of albums that were stored on either side of it. It must be a really bad formulation.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
    5th-beatle likes this.
  24. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    I've just checked my copy of "Really love you" and it IS damaged ! :(

    But, I have an old 12'' picture disc of "No more lonely nights" which is inside its original PVC sleeve since 1984 and it is NOT damaged.
    Same with the PRINCE 12'' from 1988: they are NOT damaged.
    Same with my 7'' picture disc of George Harrison's "Faster" which is stored inside the PVC since 1979 (!) : NOT damaged.

    So does this problem only appears with recent PVC bags ? (less than 10 years old ?)
     
  25. MoonPool

    MoonPool Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    So, are the outer sleeves in the new Beatles Mono Box set PVC? I was thinking of getting rid of them just because the sticky stuff makes it awkward to put the LPs in the covers back inside. If they are PVC, that cinches it.
     

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