Warning to all record collectors!!! (outer bag/inner sleeve concerns)*

I've maybe 30 records that I've kept in PVC outer sleeves since the mid 80's without any damage, I've checked these records regularly for maybe 10 years or so since the first time I heard about the PVC problem and they're all still in great condition. The thing is I've always stored them in a stable indoor climate with very small temperature and humid fluctuations. On the other hand- 17 years ago a friend gave me his entire record collection, at the time I had no space to store these records indoors so I put them in a big storage box in my garage and kept them there. I forgot about them until earlier this year when I found a mystic box on a shelf in my garage- when I opened the box I once again discovered this hidden and forgotten treasure. Around 25-30 out of the total 150-160 records had PVC outer sleeves and all of these records had that 'foggy' looking vinyl- the rest that had PE outer sleeves or no outers at all were all in great condition. I believe that the stable indoor climate was/is the key that the records I've had for more than 30 years in PVC do still look shiny and do sound great. The records I kept in my garage sadly had severely damaged vinyl that's both visual and audible probably because of the more unstable climate conditions. I believe it's around 30 years ago since I got my last PVC outer sleeve- since then I've focused only on PE outer sleeves which are great IMHO. No more PVC outers enter this house.

 

Explain PE please.

 

Polyethylene. See previous page.

 

what surprises me that no one that had pvc sleeve problems with damaging records mentions
other issues than "hiss" or "swoosh".
of course this is one of the issues, sounding like "frrrr frrr" or "swswswshh",
but what i experience right now is that a lot of records have also massive groove damage,
especially after the lead in (ca. the first 40 seconds).
in many cases either there are hundreds of little spots, looking like residue or fine scratches
but actually caused by the pvc sleeves (oxidation)?, or one channel distorts like "pfffffrrrt" each
rotation, similar as if a too heavy stylus would have been used (groove wear/damage).

also, the edge of the record often looks greyish/silverish, as if the chemicals have eaten into the
record. if the record previously had scratches, or was uneven etc., these parts are shimmering
in a blueish/silverish tone from the pvc sleeves.
anybody else with these experiences?

i also can only warn not to use this horrible stuff, it#s the devil's work and will even damage
records not only near the sleeves, but even in the same part of the shelf!
all users of PVC record sleeves better throw that garbage away asap, or you'll maybe
end up with a destroyed record collection!

 

I do not believe it can get worse after the offending type sleeves are removed from the equation.

 

Price and where to order please?

 

12 inch Outer Album sleeves (Blake sleeves) 32x31.5 + 3.6 cm. [BLP1] » Packlinq

 

The Blake sleeves are pretty thin, only 50 micron, which is less than half the thickness of the Sleeve City Ultimate outer sleeve.
For those who like the flap style sleeve, too bad there doesn't seem to be one in something more like 125 microns, (5 mil)

 

I am very sorry to hear of your problem/ I can empathize -- it's distressing for me even to find out a few of my records have PVC damage.

There are many non-believers around who think we are mistaken or making this up. Certainly there are exceptions due to storage conditions and perhaps some PVC covers are more harmful than others. But anyone who still doubt this phenomenon is for real needs to wake up.

 

Polypropylene ?
I use the BCW 33rpm 12 inch outer poly Sleeves Acid Free 2mil, so am I okay ? They are described as being made of crystal clear polypropylene.

 

Excuse my ignorance. Maybe I can't read all that well (English is not my first language), but are we talking about the actual record stored in this plastic thing inside the carboard sleeve. Or are we talking about the record in a paper inner sleeve, inside the cardboard sleeve and then stored in this plastic thing.

 

We are talking about ANY PVC sleeves. They are all evil.

 

So PVC can damage a record through the cardboard sleeve and paper inner? Wow......

 

The sleeve that the whole thing is stored in.

 

I’m sorry, but I don’t know. I use polyethylene and have never had a problem.

 

Can anyone answer as to if these are different, the same, problems?
polypropylene/ polyethylene/PVC?

 

I’ve never seen PVC sleeves come up on eBay or Amazon when doing a search for record sleeves. It finally dawned on me what everyone was referring to. It’s those covers the people at the public library use to put records in back in the day. I’ve got a few of them from when the library gave away all their vinyl years ago. I can’t imagine anyone using those things today.

 

paper inner? PVC destroyed almost my complete collection of 4500 12"es and Lps within 3 weeks
through thick cardboard covers, PE inners and even shrink foil !!

 

Really? That's awful!
Most of my records are in plastic outer sleeves - don't know if they're PVC or not. Seems I have some investigation to do.

 

PVC sleeves are easy to identify:- they are usually thick, not very flexible and often give off a chemical smell (probably the plasticizers vaporizing). They seem like thick premium covers. They are often used as outer covers for picture disks and Laserdisks (remember those?).

 

Once the bad sleeves are removed - the fogging is halted. I had some singles that got light fog, and it disappeared after a year or two of being in paper sleeves. It's rare but a record can cure itself if you catch it in time.

It sounds like your LPs were getting the gases for many years and it's unlikely to go away now.

I would run each record and see if any of them are fogged on surface only, where it did not do damage beyond just a surface fog that can be washed off. Some vinyl is like that, it repells the chemical fogging effect - can be washed away. Not most but some.

 

In the new Metallica And Justice For All boxset, the One picture disc comed packaged in one of these PVC style heavy sleeves. Guess I should resleeve it right away? If left on would it effect the other records in the box?

 

yeah, i know that effect, unfortunately the case on only 2 or 3 records where it could be (partially) removed or improved. in almost all other cases, it's a far worse chemical reaction without fogging, but you can see the changed surface when breathing on it ("splotchyness"/marks etc.) audible as crackles or hiss.
in many cases as well, there are already the blue shimmering marks in lead in, run out or in between on uneven parts of the record (for example hairline scratches).
i can ensure you that this all happened within a few weeks in summer only, although stored properly (no direct sunlight or humidity) due to the autocatalytic off-gassing of almost all sleeves.
this **** is extremely dangerous, as it is a gas and travels INTANTLY through all layers when happening - so you can never react quick enough when it already is happening. there are even many records with a completely destroyed channel (mainly those with thinner/tighter grooves = 2 or more tracks on one side). also, especially atlantic and emergency pressings suffered the most, seams to be the vinyl mixture responsible (massive constant crackling due to the changed surface of the records).

some records i caught right in the process - the vinyl surface is looking extremely oily (as if someone just gave it a wash). then it's already too late, as it is already the reacting surface of the vinyl and cannot be wiped off, at least at my experience.

one more thing i like to pronounce - almost always it's the picture discs with its special PVC sleeves (with flap) that are discussed. please keep in mind that this is a special interest product, but i'm talking about
the outers with the hard, perforated edges, often they have a light purple or blue shimmer visible when several sleeves are stacked.
i now fear that the contaminated cardboard outers continue off-gassing for a certain time, and maybe in summer the (already modified/reacted) surfaces gets even worse. total pray and see mode now ..

 

I think to save any record that can be saved after exposure to the poisonous gases, cleaning with dish soap and water and after a good towel dry, store the lp in a new paper sleeve so it can breath a bit with no poly or plastics. Some records (however rarely) do recover on their own if they have the chance.

 

Posting because a member asked me about this issue in a PM and I thought people would find it useful here:


I bought this set of U2 singles when I was a kid in the mid-80's, the records have always lived inside of their paper picture sleeves in this large PVC display sleeve. Always properly stored, not in the sun or extreme environmental conditions.



After 30 plus years the record surfaces all look like this:



Compared to a new 45:


When played the records all have a layer of noise that sounds like a hiss in the background. They aren't unplayable, but they don't sound good and nothing I have tried over the years since I discovered the damage (probably 10-15 years ago) had made the slightest improvement. Whatever chemical reaction has occurred is irreversible as far as I can tell.