Warning to all record collectors!!! (outer bag/inner sleeve concerns)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by rockadelic, Oct 17, 2014.

  1. KeithH

    KeithH Success With Honor...then and now

    Location:
    Beaver Stadium
    I am sorry to hear of members suffering from bag rash, but I'm not sure what this has to do with music.
     
  2. Psyre

    Psyre Forum Resident

    So are Poly inners like mofi, disckeepers, and vinyl styl outers safe?
     
  3. vinylbuff

    vinylbuff Forum Resident

    Location:
    North Port Florida
    :biglaugh::bdance::pineapple::uhhuh::D:laugh::laughup:
     
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  4. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Yes I mentioned those heavy library type covers in my post on the first page - bad! Its the outgassing that creates a 'contact' between the record and deteriorating PVC. Think of it like smoke in a room..the molecules disperse into the environment, they are not stopped by porous or permeable materials (wood, paper, cardboard, fabrics etc.) Deteriorating PVC bags or sleeves do the same, create an inside environment that affects a record without ever technically touching the record. So in that sense you are right, there is 'direct' contact.

    Nevertheless the environment where records are stored is a huge factor (also the particular blend of vinyl used to press the record). Even with those awful library covers, I've noticed some records are affected and others weren't, even when its clear the plastic cover & LP have been together a long time. If were the simple fact that PVC cover + vinyl record = damage, then all records stored that way should be equally affected. But they aren't.

    The OP was I believe referring to certain inner sleeves that hold the record itself, but this is a good discussion generally.
     
    Bill Hart likes this.
  5. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Yes, at least in a stable home environment. I started using these in the late 1970's for my own collection. Never ever have had a problem, and pushing forty years now.
     
  6. Phil D

    Phil D Forum Resident

    A few years ago I decided to re-house all my 45s in new PVC sleeves as the old ones were bubbling (but no damage to discs). I bought hundreds from Covers 33 here in the UK. and re-sleeved all of them. I never play my 45s and therefore rarely look at them. However after a few months, I did need to play one and found the surface of the disc fogged over (I call it scorched). To cut a long story short , roughly a third of my collection is affected and these newly bought sleeves are to blame although when I complained to the seller he blamed it on damp!
    All the discs are 60's U.K. pressings and I found certain labels are more prone to this damage than others - E.M.I. and Pye pressings in particular. On the other hand Philips pressings are unaffected. I have now thrown out ALL of my PVC sleeves and I advise anyone else who has them to do likewise.
     
  7. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Yes there is something else going on as you noticed. It isn't PVC per se that causes damage, its how the chlorides and other elements in it 'get out' and interact with elements that are in other materials. The environment we store things in is always a huge factor; the air inside our houses contain fluctuating amounts of oxygen, hydrogen, and lots of suspended elements (both solid and gaseous) from outside air, especially in urban areas. Add in heating systems that heat our houses, and the cooking of food....and I'm leaving out residues from washing records with the various concoctions people use (which invariably, folks have little clue whats really in them).
     
  8. Psyre

    Psyre Forum Resident

    I checked mine I thought to be pvc. The records with the pink tinted thicker sleeves definitely were beginning to show signs, faint enough that I think it will clean, but in some lights visible. The ticket clear had not began showing signs but I did not tiny scrates in some areas, so I don't trust them either anymore.
     
  9. MikeP5877

    MikeP5877 Uh Huh

    Location:
    OH
    If someone sends me a record with an infected sleeve, will it spread to my other vinyls?
     
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  10. dino77

    dino77 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Europe
    I had this happen to cd-rs stored in pvc sleeves.
     
  11. drbryant

    drbryant Forum Resident

    They should be. The concern here is with the thick, "heavy plastic" PVC outer sleeves. Those other inner sleeves probably use something else. However, my instinct tells me that the general rule should be to store vinyl in dry, cool conditions. Who knows what extended exposure to heat and humidity might do to other types of sleeves (or the vinyl itself). I looked at the sleeves I purchase in Japan, and while none of them indicate what substance was used, they all have a warning that high temperatures or humidity can affect the sleeve.

    This is a different issue. Those pink inner sleeves are covered with some kind of gunk - you can feel it on your hands after you handle the sleeve. This gets on the vinyl, but it can be cleaned off. You should definitely get rid of them. The PVC issues that people are discussing here relate primarily to PVC outer sleeves that affect the vinyl, even though the vinyl may not come into direct contact with the vinyl.
     
  12. drbryant

    drbryant Forum Resident

    Not your entire collection, but if it is a heavy PVC sleeve, it can affect the records stored near it. I have seen this in my collection.
     
  13. drbryant

    drbryant Forum Resident

    Did anyone answer this? They are not PVC.
     
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  14. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    I don't think those are PVC.

    The PVC outer sleeves discussed here are thicker and the plastic feels different to the touch. From memory, U2 No Line On The Horizon, Bjork 2LP reissues from One Little Indian, Cat Power Sun Deluxe Edition and The XX both albums all came in think PVC outer sleeves... and many more :(
     
  15. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    I was writing at the same time as you ;)
     
  16. MoonPool

    MoonPool Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    Thanks for this information. Now all I need to determine is what the outer sleeves I bought for my LPs are made of. Whatever the case, I haven't seen any problems on any of them. I randomly selected about 20 from different parts of my collection, including some MFSLs, and they all seem fine.
     
  17. Stefano G.

    Stefano G. Ab alto, speres alteri quod feceris.

  18. Al_D

    Al_D Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    So glad I read this tonight!

    I already knew about the problem with PVC sleeves in contact with vinyl, I've had a couple of those do this to me already. I didn't realise it could happen through paper and card though. It's always the collectable vinyl that's packaged in this stuff too, why do they do it??!? That's a few more records tarnished. Luckily a lot of my collection is 12"s with one track per side, so the music is above the hiss enough to be bearable for my purposes. I can imagine a classical album would sound horrid with this problem.
     
  19. Tjazz

    Tjazz Music is my Mistress

    Location:
    USA
    I'm scared, and it's not Halloween. :sweating::cussing:
     
  20. Grant

    Grant Now let that bass fall in! Oh yeah!

    Location:
    United States
    I read that car interiors leech benzine, especially in hot temperatures. Benzine is harmful to a male's reproductive system.
     
  21. Grant

    Grant Now let that bass fall in! Oh yeah!

    Location:
    United States
    I have that, and a few other records in those sleeves that I will now remove and discard. EDIT: I just checked a few, and they definitely have the foggy, cloud on them.

    PDQ in Tucson put all of their records in those sleeves. I shudder to think what those records look and sound like now, having been sitting in that building for years, probably with no air conditioning running.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
  22. PTgraphics

    PTgraphics Forum Resident

    I just bought this set of 45s. Will have to check out the vinyl tonight.

    Pat
     
  23. ptijerm

    ptijerm Forum Resident

    This thread scares the hell out of me just as much as those "all my CDs will decompose after 20 years or so" threads.

    Why couldn't I have collected metal spoons or pottery or something less fragile?
     
  24. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    After doing some quick research regarding the concerns raised in this thread I've learned:

    Polypropylene inner and outer sleeves = probably safe

    PVC sleeves, as used by Simply Vinyl and others = not so safe.


    I think the material of inner and outer sleeves makes a tremendous difference in preservation quality. And environmental conditions like heat, humidity and cleanliness are a huge factor as well. My two cents...
     
    ggergm and Bill Hart like this.
  25. aoxomoxoa

    aoxomoxoa One man gathers what another man spills

    Location:
    Dayton Ohio
    I only have one such sleeve and I just pulled it to be safe.
     

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