Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dolsey01, Mar 12, 2019.
How do they compare?
That's the 80ths VS the Lintons?
It's the 85th version. I never heard the 80th version but the Denton 85th is brighter, more excited and livelier than the Lintons due to the upper mid-range/treble being more prominent. Of course, the Lintons sound more like floorstanders and they have a darker, non-fatiguing sound where nothing jumps out at you. The difference becomes clear when you listen to Katie Melua's album called Album No. 8. On the Lintons, the band behind her voice sounds a bit misty while on the Dentons the mist has mostly cleared.
I wonder whether all this is a continuation of the Denton (smaller/brighter) and Linton (bigger/darker) legacy?
Linton and Denton available in Black Oak:
Wow! Denton's look awesome in black. Black Lintons look good too but not like the Dentons IMHO
Interview with Peter Comeau at IAG headquarters UK about Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary, the new retro Mission 770 monitors, and more ...
I have to say, the 770 has me intrigued, but since it's made in the UK (and not in China) it might be in a different price range. It feels like it's their anwer to the KLH Model 5.
Mission 770 was a speaker I lusted over back in the day. Remember a pair being on display in he window of Lasky's in Bristol UK. These recreations are very interesting.
I even like the combination of walnut veneer and the white front sides.
This is the mahogany finish, I think.
The wharfedale Linton black is about to be reviewed by Andrew Robinson, and Christy.
I wonder if Andrew will like it, especially after the way he was gushing over B&O ..
I personally don't like it in black... Untraditional.
Those who do like the black oak but already have the walnut edition, it should be pretty easy to oil them black.
I hope you’re joking.
So I've recently purchased a pair of Linton's and am currently deliberating how I will power them.
The shop I auditioned them was powering the speakers with the Leak 130. It sounded nice but perhaps lacked a little power for me as I felt the speakers could give more.
My main listening will be Vinyl and streaming through spotify / tidal etc.
I've whittled it down to the two following options and would love to hear other's thoughts on them (or other suitable alternatives!)
Audiolab 6000a Play - From what I can gather this is a pleasing combination and well suited to the Linton. The simplicity and price are appealing though drawback might be no sub-out, no tone controls and whether it has enough power (I listen quite loud from time to time).
Yamaha MusicCast R-N803D Network Receiver - Appears to be great value, more power and can still stream, tone controls. I presume Yamaha's neutrality would work well with the Linton speakers?
I can pick up either for a comparable price though am open to other suggestions that cost more. Appreciate any input in advance!
I know at least one or more folks here use Yamaha, but I would go with a better version Yamaha integrated and maybe add streaming or other stuff later. The Lintons need some oomph esp at higher volumes.
Yamaha A-S801 (Silver) is the same price as the one you mentioned but I can’t help but think more of its engineering is in its power supply and amp sections. Altho I can’t know for sure.
I do wish Yamaha had a $1200 integrated! It jumps to >$2000 which to me is absurd (the huge step that is).
I’d look for amps that put out more (maybe even 2x) power into 4 ohms than 8.
Maybe Cambridge Audio CXA81 ???
Arcam SA20 ???
Rotel A14 MKII (Black) ???
Marantz PM8006 ???
Here’s another thought. How about a good beefy power amp Parasound NewClassic 2125 v.2 and a simple but excellent preamp like Schiit Audio: Audio Products Designed and Built in California …?
For more $$$ a Parasound A 23 (look for refurb or open box units to save money) and the Schitt Freya+ … can run balanced which is (theoretically anyway) better sonically. I think this would be a totally killer combo.
Thank you, yes very valid points.
I should seriously consider integrated + streamer options but just makes it a harder sell to the wife in buying multiple components rather than an 'all in one'.
Going down that path I'd be keen on the Technics SU-G700m2 + streamer although I don't think any have arrived in Aus yet. Presumably a big step up in price too...
I answered above, but here’s another possibly interesting tack: NAD Electronics M10 BluOS Streaming Amplifier Factory Refurbished
NAD rates this as 100W into 8 or 4 ohms, but
“Clipping power >130 W (at 1 kHz 8 ohms 0.1 % THD) >230 W (at 1 kHz 4 ohms 0.1 % THD)
IHF dynamic power 8 ohms: 160 W 4 ohms: 300 W”
NAD is well known for being very conservative in power ratings, and having a lot of “headroom” (max power is way higher than continuous power ratings, as evidenced above).
PS/Edit: I’ve purchased most of my last several high dollar items as refurb or open box from Safe and Sound, Accessories4Less, Audio Advisor, or Crutchfield. Never had any issues.
yeah, rouge CMII and lovin it!
Question I wonder if too much warmth a bad thing?
I currently running the Lintons with a Willsenton R-800i 300B 805 which sounds fantastic beautiful tube midrange and incredible sounding vocals...this all being fed through the New Bluesound Node.
I decided I wanted to try bypassing the Bluesound Node's DAC as my next upgrade.
So I purchased the Denafrips Ares 2 which is highly regarded in its price point. I am just worried since the Ares 2 is known to provide warmth and give a more analogue tube sound it may be a bad combination with my already warm sounding combo Lintons + Tube amp?
I have the Lintons paired with a Yamaha A-S801 (recently upgraded from a R-N500) and a BlueSound NODE (2021 model).
Happy to answer questions as best I can.
This sounds incredible on the Lintons! (listen to it on Tidal)
Since I’m new around here, a bit about my audio history and the story behind my current set-up.
Apologies in advance this will be a long one.
My current system configuration is as follows:
Bluesound NODE (2021) > 1m Voodoo Cable Reference Digital Co-axial > Yamaha A-S801 (into onboard DAC) > QED 79 Strand (bare wire both ends) > Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary on matching stands.
Yamaha R-N500 > Canare 4s8 in bi-wire configuration > ATC SCM 7 / REL R205
As anyone reading this thread to this point may already know the Linton’s sound pretty laid back and their overall presentation is just about the polar opposite of the ATC’s they’ve replaced in my system. Where the ATC’s take an almost “forensic” approach to music making these Linton’s can sound comparatively dark, maybe even a bit veiled (more on this in the text below) but they make up for it with an easy going musicality and a sort of “big speaker” sound I’ve only previously heard from other wide baffle designs, often at significantly higher cost.
It may seem strange to have gone from a ruthlessly transparent speaker to these, but this happens to coincide with my own changing tastes. I’m what you might call a recovering audiophile. For years I pursued a “maximum information/transparency & detail über alles” approach to system building, but eventually burned myself out and lost my enjoyment of the music by conducting what (in retrospect) felt like a perpetual gear audition… when I should’ve been enjoying music I was actually just obsessing about the gear. I had to step away and reconnect with the love of music.
So for several years I lived happily with the small system I built around the R-N500… and the relief of not obsessing about gear. Which is great.
During our successive Covid lockdowns I had some time to wonder if I might try a slightly different approach towards “music first” system building.
The first piece to go was the R-N500, replaced by the A-S801 and Bluesound. Digital connection was via a Wireworld Starlight 7 I had lying around. These changes brought the ATC’s to life in a way the R-N500 hadn’t and I couldn’t help thinking the amp in particular had made a bigger impact than I expected given it’s still within Yamaha’s consumer range and not that much more expensive or powerful than the receiver it replaced. I guess there’s something to be said for the simpler design of a straight-up 2ch integrated (in this case with a decent DAC onboard) as opposed to a single box containing amp, streamer, tuner + DAC with a big, bright (and presumably electrically noisy) front display even if the latter does offer lots of value. I don’t want to overstate the differences… we’re not talking “night and day” here… that would be hyperbolic. They’re modest improvements, but easily noticeable and hard to overlook once you know they’re there.
To make some specific comparisons the NODE seems to have a great way of locking onto rhythms which propels music along with greater purpose and “order” than the streamer in the R-N500 does and with the new amp in the chain the system had more snap, a livelier, more dynamic sound and an apparently lower noise floor (or perhaps due to the better DAC chip improved detail retrieval?) for a worthwhile uptick in transparency. I wouldn’t call the A-S801 a “fast” amp and it probably plays ever so slightly on the cooler side of neutral but isn’t lean or analytical sounding by any stretch.
By comparison via the R-N500 which I still had around to make direct comparison to - the soundstage shrank in all dimensions and the presentation flattened and sounded a bit lifeless, overall it just had less “juice”. I had my suspicions that the combination of the new amp and streamer had more to offer than the Wireworld cable was passing between them but for the time being it remained in place. I guess old (obsessive) habits die hard
Enter the Linton’s… which I’d been checking out for some time and eventually decided to audition. I pretty much bought them on the spot. I heard them hooked up to a Prima Luna integrated at the store and there was bit of sweetness to the sound that I wouldn’t say is typical of the sound they make with the A-S801. Which isn’t mean to suggest that the Yamaha produces a dry sound either… the midrange is open, detailed and communicative, it’s just not as “lush” as the tubes. And the solid state amp affords much improved grip. Not that any of those observations would surprise anyone.
I sit roughly 2.5m away from the baffles in a 31.5 m2/340 sq foot open plan space. The speakers are set up fairly toed in (they’re firing to a point that converges about 500mm or so behind my listening position) and have only 400mm clear to the wall behind them and 1100mm clear to the side walls. I’ve read that the ports are tuned quite low (apparently 38Hz where presumably there wouldn’t be much energy out of them anyway?) and mine happen to have curtains draped directly behind them which I suppose helps dampen things a bit as well. In my room they have a very even bass performance free of boom, thickening or overhang. That said the 8” woofer can move a decent amount of air… enough to not miss the sub that much, even if it can’t quite play quite as low.
In terms of quality, bass is generally very tight and quick. I’ve heard greater articulation and more texture but overall I’m quite pleased.
Now back to that Wireworld, which to my ears was adding a false weight that was congesting the midrange.
I thought I’d experiment with swapping that out. So I picked up the Voodoo cable from the Cable Co on a third off special. And without stating just about every stereotypical attribute of silver cable the sound brightened & tightened up in a very appreciable way, backgrounds got a bit blacker all of which translates as a perceivable increase in transparency. My take away is that the Linton’s are more than sufficiently resolving to have communicated this upstream change in no uncertain terms.
They still aren’t a detail first speaker which I’m fine with and they maintain their laid back musicality, which to me is their prize characteristic and something I’ve very keen not to ruin trying to extract “maximum information”. But they’ve opened up in a most agreeable way, no longer sounding either dark or veiled and that laid back nature has accommodated the change without the sound becoming etched or lean.
I still wouldn’t describe them as warm sounding speakers. I take nothing away from anyone who feels they are… I just think there’s a “fullness”… a sort of “meatiness” to them which I like a great deal and that sets them apart from many of the narrow baffle, small driver speakers that are so ubiquitous these days. Those now sound a bit forced or “squeezed” to me.
If you’ve made it all the way through, thanks for reading these lines. Hopefully they’ll be of interest to someone.
These speakers really have given me back the music. Transparent enough to showcase audiophile recordings yet forgiving enough to render less than steller recordings in a way that's still enjoyable way.
I do have a new set of Canare 4s11 speaker cables on the way. Happy to offer further updates if anyone’s interested.
good evening Meehael I have two questions for you regarding the upgrade you have done. 1º have you removed the plastic ties that hold some components of the crossover? 2º the capacitor and the resistance are very big, how have you been able to fix them to the crossover? Is it worth removing the plastic flanges, does it affect the sound quality? Thank you very much in advance
I've left ties on the coils. Since my post I've also upgraded C2 capacitor with Miflex KPCU 0.68uf and Pathaudio resistors. Miflex was mounted vertically, Path resistors had just enough lead to fit. All this had huge effect on sound. It became more dynamic with a tad warmer and natural timbral presentation, transients are more articulate, cymbals sound more metallic, less silky. Pathaudio resistors are probably over the top, you can probably get 85% of the performance with some other wire-wound non-inductive resistors. They will bring cleaner sound and more micro-dynamics.
Most certainly you need to change 0.68uf cap with something better, Miflex does wonders.
My next upgrade is 15uf C3 capacitor with Jantzen Standard and then maybe for the final mod 22uf Sandard and 8.2uf Jantzen Superior caps on midrange.
After this I will hotglue all capacitors to xo board with exeption of 6.8 Jantzen Silver that sticks off the board and will have to be glued on the bottom pannel of the speaker.
Thank you for your quickly answer. I’ll be alert to your mods.
Separate names with a comma.