What are the best sounding Jimi Hendrix CDs?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Harlanator, Jan 12, 2013.

  1. A Local Bloke

    A Local Bloke Forum President

    Location:
    canada-na-na-na-na
    Is Gloria a different take or mix/edit?
     
    Detroit Rock Citizen likes this.
  2. jhm

    jhm Forum Resident

    As I recall, it's just a longer edit.
     
  3. pool_of_tears

    pool_of_tears Searching For Simplicity

    Location:
    Midwest
    Best option is to seek out the 180g Lp, either the old Classic 180g or the more recent one, and do a needledrop.
     
    Burningfool and A Local Bloke like this.
  4. A Local Bloke

    A Local Bloke Forum President

    Location:
    canada-na-na-na-na
    My record setup is incredibly far from 'high-end' so I won't be doing that anytime soon! I settled on the '80s CD somebody mentionned up-thread, and it sounds fine to me. Not as crisp as the '97 but much more dynamic.
     
    Library Eye and pool_of_tears like this.
  5. Experiencereunited

    Experiencereunited Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland
    Seems they Re different edits to me as there are parts on one but not the other and vice versa.
     
  6. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    The dynamic ranges of the two versions are about the same.
     
    alchemy likes this.
  7. Detroit Rock Citizen

    Detroit Rock Citizen RetroDawg Digital

    The Dr#s for the Reprise editions of the three Experience albums in order of release are 11, 11 , 1o. The EHs are 8s straight across the board. I'd say there's a noticeable difference.
     
  8. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    I thought we were talking about Cry Of Love. The 3 core studio albums I have 3 original Reprise CDs and prefer these over the EH because the Reprise non-RE1 have no noise reduction and have full dynamic range. Much like the 2014 remaster of Cry Of Love. The EH core catalogue are compressed but don't use noise reduction.
    Here's a comparison of some US Electric Ladyland CDs I did a while back with more detailed reasons why I like the original Reprise CDs.

    ELECTRIC LADYLAND – The Jimi Hendrix Experience


    In 1968, things weren’t doing so well in the Experience camp. Noel Redding, growing tired of endless overdubbing sessions and hangers-on in the recording studio, started to adopt a more truculent attitude to recording, which signaled the beginning of the end for his position in the Experience. Sessions for the album were based far more on cosmic jamming and less on the concise musical statements of the past 2 albums, and as a result, Chas Chandler, feeling that his direction as producer was being ignored, resigned and set Jimi adrift.

    Typically, when Electric Ladyland was finally unveiled, it sprouted many different covers around the world (for more of this, see Are You Experienced), but the 2 main variations were the UK Track nude “Electric Lady” cover (released 25/10/68) and the U.S. Reprise (also released 25/10/68) solarised face of Jimi. The Experience had no say in the UK Track version of the album cover and it was roundly hated by the band. However, it still stayed in print for many years in the U.K., Japan and Germany.

    The U.S. Reprise album artwork was fairly close to Jimi’s written instructions to his U.S. record company and certainly didn’t have to be racked in a paper bag, as the U.K. version did when it was imported into the U.S. It seems Americans were more prudish than the English, rather surprisingly.

    On CD, the U.S. releases went as follows:

    1. The first Electric Ladyland CD was released in 1987 on Reprise, the original US record company of the Jimi Hendrix Experience, as 2 separate CDs, rather than in a single fat-boy jewel case. The Reprise 2 CD set had the advantage of being mastered by Lee Herschberg prior to both computerised noise reduction and digital compression. What does this leave us with? Rather nice sounding albums that were relatively unfutzed-with and nice dynamics, also without any exaggerated frequency re-equalization. Some hiss is apparent, however, but without being in any way obtrusive. Contrary to populist opinion, these CDs were rather nicely done. The CD booklets were a little sparse, but at least they stayed true to the album's original intent. However, I’m not so sure that Electric Ladyland was mastered from the original master tapes (unlike Are You Experienced, which was), because there is a rather extended, but slight, loss of high frequencies in the left channel during part of Voodoo Chile that is not present in a later EH edition (starting with the lyric “I’ll make love to you……and Lord knows you’ll feel no pain”). The organ is a little peaky also, which is different from the later EH edition, where the organ doesn’t jump out at you on certain notes. Also, the staticky hum of Jimi’s amps in the right channel of Voodoo Chile is far clearer in the EH version than the Reprise version, where it is harder to differentiate from tape hiss.

    2. When Alan Douglas took over control of the Hendrix Estate in 1989, this album was remastered by Joe Gastwirt (still on Reprise) with relatively unsubtle noise reduction being applied. No hiss remained, and a fair chunk of the high end (and any studio ambience) was also excised neatly. Although the Hendrix CDs generally looked the same on superficial inspection, closer inspection revealed 2 differences. The first was the presence of RE-1 after the catalogue number in the "deadwax" of the CD. Secondly, the booklets touted the usage of Sonic Solutions Noise Reduction System by the remastering engineer. Finally, in the case of “Electric Ladyland, the RE-1 version is easy to recognize, as the 2CDs were condensed onto a single disc, whereas the prior non-RE-1 edition (with far better sound) was on two separate jewel case CDs - not combined in a fat-boy jewel case.

    3. In 1993, when the catalogue was changed to MCA, it was decided to revamp the text and artwork of the booklets of the then catalogue to appeal to new listeners. This included altering the album cover artwork using photos taken by Gered Mankowitz and adding extensive cosmic notes (with liberal usage of phrases such as “flaps dragon wings”), which detracted from the importance of this work. Sound-wise, the re-remastering engineer (Joe Gastwirt again) peeled back a layer of noise reduction (possibly due to howling feedback about the degraded sound from purchasers of version 2) and limited its usage to intros and fades, leaving the body of the songs alone (as tape hiss should be less audible in more heavily modulated parts of a tune). These MCA “ersatz covers” versions should have sounded quite good, as digital compression wasn’t quite as ubiquitous in those days and wasn’t used here. Certainly, they are a slightly better bet sonically than version 2. The booklets do rankle, however – they scream “cheap” to me, rather than classy. Where did poor Noel and Mitch disappear to in the Alan Douglas rewriting of history? There was a lengthy running argument in the press at the time about whether the original master tapes were or weren’t used for this version of Electric Ladyland, whereas they were for the prior original US Reprise non RE-1 and the later EH copies. It turns out that the Mankowitz versions did NOT use the masters, despite Joe Gastwirt saying that they WERE used. There is distortion on vocal peaks in “C’mon - Let The Good Times Roll” that doesn’t appear in either of the aforementioned copies. Wrong tapes, I suspect, but not bad sound generally.

    4. After the Hendrix family finally wrested control of the catalogue from Alan Douglas, the first Experience Hendrix version of the catalogue was issued in 1997. Now eschewing noise reduction totally, the original master tapes and original cover art were used by Eddie Kramer and George Marino, with decent and accurate liner notes added. Digital compression, unfortunately, was used to a greater or lesser extent, according to the title.

    The digital compression is audible during louder passages, but at lower modulations, the sound is great – there is an authoritative nature to the sound that is lacking a little in the earlier copies.

    There have been 4 EH versions issued – the first was a single CD (released in 1997 on MCA – see 4 above), the second was released on Geffen in 2008 - a multi-fold digipak containing the 1997 CD and a full-length DVD (about the making of the album called “At Last, The Beginning”). The third version was released in 2010 when the catalogue was taken over by Sony – the signal levels were slightly reduced from the higher levels of the MCA issues, but the same compression was present, albeit now peaking at less than 100% modulation – i.e. same mastering, but slightly softer. This was a CD/DVD combination with a less extensive “Making Of Electric Ladyland” DVD than the Geffen release.

    5. In 2018, the album was remastered by Bernie Grundman and reissued in a Deluxe set with 3 CDs and a Blu-Ray. The sound was not as good as Bernie’s best work (Cry Of Love and Rainbow Bridge in 2014), as it appears that he was forced to compress the album, which was against expectations of increased sound quality compared with the previous George Marino mastering. The master tape appears to have incurred some damage also - note some variation in sound levels in At Last The Beginning which I've never heard before. The deluxe packaging was rather nice, however.

    My pick of the various US versions breaks down to firstly eliminating versions 2 and 3 – they don’t sound good. The Reprise Non-RE-1 copies sound rather nice, if a little rolled off at the bass end. There’s no noise reduction and no compression. Tone controls may be used to restore what is deficient. The EH does that for you, but compresses the sound a little. If you are tone control free, the EH may be preferable. Those original Reprise CDs are excellent – Lee Herschberg really knew what he was doing. Maybe, one day, Analogue Productions will be allowed to release an SACD hybrid of the album without NoNoise or compression. We can only live in hope.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2022
  9. Detroit Rock Citizen

    Detroit Rock Citizen RetroDawg Digital

    I'd still rather have NO Noise than NO DYNAMICS. The EH In the West is relatively uncompressed as well. Is the old Reprise Essential Hendrix twofer No Noised as well?
    Quite frankly, I'd rather have Alan Douglas than the stepsister.
     
  10. furmanu

    furmanu Forum Resident

    Location:
    Clyde, NY, USA
    Yes, my copy on CD of Essential Hendrix on Reprise is No Noised. I purchased it back in 1990 or so when it first came out. It does not have a RE-1 in the matrix like the No-Noised Electric Ladyland does.
     
    SinnerSaint likes this.
  11. George P

    George P Notable Member

    Location:
    NYC
    As always, great information/overview, John! Any reason you leave out the early WG Polydor 2CD set from your discussion? I'd be curious to see how you feel it ranks, especially as I prefer it to all the others.
     
  12. btomarra

    btomarra Classic Rock Audiophile

    Location:
    Little Rock, AR
    For Smash Hits NR is your option. The Polydor while not no-noised has speed issues, chopped off intros on some songs. IIRC, there is no Reprise Smash Hits that isn’t NR’ed, even though certain issues don’t notate its use in the booklet.

    The EH is pretty compressed:

    Album details - Dynamic Range Database
     
  13. Detroit Rock Citizen

    Detroit Rock Citizen RetroDawg Digital

    I have the EH
     
  14. John Harchar

    John Harchar Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    It's very frustrating in retrospect that the first round of Reprise CDs had no greatest hits package apart from Kiss the Sky. Wonder if a 1985/86 Reprise Smash Hits would be as well regarded as the AYE is now.

    That's why I'd still like a digital issue of the Bernie Grundman mastering of the Record Store Day vinyl from 2013 with my avatar as the cover.
     
  15. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    George,
    I never kept any EU copies, as I wasn't happy with the sound of most of them as well as the skimpy and badly printed booklets.
     
  16. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    With respect to Electric Ladyland, IMHO, there's too much sound missing in the Reprise RE-1 and the MCA due to NoNoise and the MCA version didn't use the original stereo master. Check the vocal distortion in C'mon Let The Good Times Roll which isn't present on any other version.
     
  17. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    As noted John, the distortion likely doesn't have anything to do with the tape used.
     
    Detroit Rock Citizen likes this.
  18. Detroit Rock Citizen

    Detroit Rock Citizen RetroDawg Digital

    I probably haven't listened to the MCA since I bought the box. I didn't notice a difference between the MCA and the Reprise. I'll take a listen tonight,
     
  19. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    I forgot you had said that before, Luke. What do you think was the problem there, then? It sounds like someone transferred that track with the meters pinned to the right with some of the vocals, which doesn't make sense as it's not a remix. It just seems odd that the overload only appears on that track on that remaster.
     
    rpd and Detroit Rock Citizen like this.
  20. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    It seems to be the (mis)use of noise reduction.

    I wasn't 100% certain, but it seemed like the 1993 CD was probably taken from the masters.
     
    ricks and Detroit Rock Citizen like this.
  21. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Stax Sigma

    Joe Gastwirt claimed it was, Eddie claimed it wasn't. EH propoganda machine to pump up the EH version?
     
  22. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    My guess is a combination of propaganda and not really knowing. Kramer may have really believe it, but it wasn't necessarily true.
     
  23. John Harchar

    John Harchar Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    Oh God, I remember this was an issue when I first got onto AOL back in the 90s! When did Steve say he saw the AYE master tape, before EH or after?
     
  24. A Local Bloke

    A Local Bloke Forum President

    Location:
    canada-na-na-na-na
    What's the story with that cover? Was it originally made for Smash Hits? Was it used anywhere on the initial release? Was the RSD the first time it had ever been put out?
     
  25. John Harchar

    John Harchar Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    They did a whole western shoot as well as one with Jimi in biker gear that became the South Saturn Delta cover. They used the western pictures on the back cover and apparently had this in mind for the front but ended up going with what they did. It worked out for everyone in the end: Reprise got a huge seller and later on EH had an excuse to release the album again so even suckers like me without a record player are thinking of buying it.
     

Share This Page

molar-endocrine