What's This? - hearing music before song starts on LP*

Today I was play some vinyl on my vintage system, and noticed during the silent passage just before the song started I could hear the fist few notes very faintly!!! Was does this mean???

Jay

 

Print-through on the master tape. Very common.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Print-through

 

Another thread with a vague title.

 

Exactly right.

 

Or groove echo or whatever it's called when the stylus picks up information through the wall of the upcoming groove. We've had this debate before.

 

Well it's first for me!!! Thank you very much!!!

Jay

 

I am familiar with print through on tape but, I can't ever remember hearing this on vinyl!!!

Jay

 

I don't think I ever heard of a master tape having print through!!! So how does it get on the vinyl???

Jay

 

Late at night, the print-through fairy sneaks into the pressing plant and puts it there.

 

I've heard this...on a Steve Miller song (forgot which one), there is a second or two of silence somewhere, and you hear what sounds like very faint music in the background, playing backwards.

 

I have always thought this is what it is. I recall hearing this on a particular Led Zep song when playing vinyl, and it matched perfectly with one complete revolution of the LP before the start of the song. No way was this print-through if the tape was running at 15 ips or more, it wouldn't last nearly as long.

I worked with reel-to-reel tape for years and never had a case of print-through. Even on my cheap Radio Shack tape. Certainly shouldn't occur on a professional tape.

 

deja-vu! ...just kiddin!

happens with my old 'Band of Gypsys-Hendrix" brazilian version before the music start too but not in cd...and in some others that have 'low level in output'(no loudness war)...i can't remember now the others but only happens with LPs!
my cartridge have too high gain and can 'feel' the track on the 'side' before the music really start...groove echo like Driver 8 posted, seems that i could explain.

cheers!

 

...usually only heard if the song is LOUD!

 

Are you sure you are hearing it?

For me and on some albums that I've heard hundreds of times, I can "mentally hear" what the next track will be before it actually starts playing. I called it "mental print-through".

 

If the "ghost" is around 2 seconds, groove echo. If it's a fraction of a second, tape print-through. On my copy of Pink Floyd's "The Wall", the first note can be heard 6 grooves away.

 

Ok....

 

Again I find it hard to believe a master tape would have print through, those tapes are cared for like they were made of gold!!!

Jay

 

First of all, they are not all cared for like they were made of gold. Ask our host to tell you some stories about that sometime. There is an Elvis Presley stereo CD mastered from experimental binaural recordings made in 1957, from the time before RCA issued rock recordings in stereo. Sounds priceless, huh? Well the tapes for that CD reissue were rescued from a Dumpster, because RCA apparently couldn't be bothered to store them.

Second, master tapes are spooled on reels like any other tapes. Print-through occurs when the magnetic particles on the tape interact with the magnetic particles on the strip of tape spooled above or beneath it. Not sure why master tapes would be immune to this phenomenon.

 

Well I am not sure if they are or not myself, one would think that anyway!!! Also I would think the more rare ones would be handled with a lot of care!!! For instance (The Beatles) tapes or said to have more security than the president!!!

Jay

 

Maybe that is the case for the Beatles!!! For other bands, not so much!!!!!

 

If you hear the music start exactly 1, 2, 3, or more revolutions before the actual start of the song it's pre-echo (groove echo). Steve has talked about this a number of times. It's an LP mastering/manufacturing issue.

 

not only.
my "Band of Gypsys-Hendrix' have soft(low) level....i 'blame' my old cartridge output level(10vrms..too much level)

cheers!

 

I actually heard this for the first time as a teen when I bought a copy of Abbey Road. Oh! Darling and Octopus' Garden had it big time. Me believing the Beatles were Gods, thought that they'd come up with something new

 

yes, good memory!

cool avatar!

cheers!