When and why do you tap out money-wise with box sets, limited edition releases etc ?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Glenn Christense, Nov 21, 2020.

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  1. Vaughan

    Vaughan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex, UK
    I can accept it, but respect it? Not so much. :D
    You know. I bought Ultravox's debut album on release and loved it from the off. After three albums Foxx moved on, and we got the Ure version. I did buy Vienna at the time, and while I thought it was okay, it just wasn't what I wanted from them. I stopped buying their material after that. When the new box set of Vienna was announced it was, I thought, an easy skip for me. It's an album I thought was merely okay, but not great. So it's a little strange I eventually went for it. The kicker for me was two things, the Surround mix and mainly Steve Wilson. I knew that he'd make a great job of it, and his name was enough to push me over the edge.

    With Rolling Stones and Some Girls - Some Girl's is the only Stones album I've ever bought. I like it, mostly for Miss You and Beast of Burden. When the box came out, I'd of gotten it - but then I read about the terrible mastering, and it was ignored. Such a shame.

    From your list, the Be Bop's, Tull, King Crimson's and Yes albums have all been essential, imo. With XTC - the only album of theirs I like is the debut (Statue of Liberty is an immense pop song). Their Special Edition series skipped that one though, so I haven't bothered.

    In other words, I'm more discerning that I think.

    Stil, we're also talking here about mainstream boxes, but there are some excellent niche sets. The Charlotte Moorman Cello Anthology is crazy good. There's a three disc Philip Corner set I admire. There's a "happenings" box called Revue OU which is crazy nice, the Gentle Fire I've already mentioned, and a Text/Voice set of obscure stuff from Sweden I'm happy to have. And that's not counting the several Dust to Digital boxes I have. I mean, Goodbye Babylon is a set Dylan used to give as gifts one Christmas to his friends - just gorgeous. How about the Art Bears box? Or the Henry Cow set? Or the three sets making up the complete Schulze/Namlock Dark Side of the Moog series of releases? Or that amazing Art Ensemble of Chicago set from ECM? I have a great set covering 78's from the African continent that's pretty special, and a beautiful box of Moroccan music.

    I could go on and on. Pop boxes tend to be rather simplistic in what they offer - but these other boxes are at a whole other level and shouldn't be easily dismissed. IMO.
     
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  2. skyblue17

    skyblue17 Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    I’m honestly shocked that BTS are just starting to dabble in vinyl. If they ever go the Taylor Swift route, they are going to make beyond the (already massive) bank they are making, especially if they stick with the different photo concepts/photo cards too.
     
  3. the real pope ondine

    the real pope ondine Forum Resident

    Location:
    usa
    i window shop but really don't pop for one if it tickles my fancy, either has to be someone im really into but don't many of the albums, or is stacked with outtakes/demos etc. i stopped re-buying stuff a while back
     
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  4. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Miss the days of Tower Records when you could buy a well mastered 24k gold CD from DCC of MFSL, play it endlessly. Box sets has all the razzmatazz, nice content for sure.. but they sure are expensive. Boils down to economics end of the day. If you’ve got the $$$$, knock yourself out.
     
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  5. drbryant

    drbryant Senior Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    There are some great audiophile albums released for good prices recently. The two Coltrane albums on the Acoustic Sound series are terrific.
     
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  6. Lemon Curry

    Lemon Curry (A) Face In The Crowd

    Location:
    Mahwah, NJ
    There's a flow chart that I've starting applying to these "Super Deluxe" sets, because I've spent some real money on these and I only listen to a fraction of what I've bought.

    1. Examine the content. What's the extra stuff? Is it repetitive, i.e. multiple takes of the same song?
    If repetitive, go for a version of the product that scales back a bit. A good example is the 2 CD Imagine box. It was reasonably-priced and I enjoy every bit of it. More would have been too much.
    2. Read up on vinyl quality. If complaints are plentiful, nix on the vinyl.
    For this reason I skipped the Beatles singles box. I've got mono masters and it sounds great, why own warped disks in addition?
    3. If the vinyl reviews are excellent, is there a version with an attractive price point where, again, I don't load up on disks I'm not likely to play?
    I went with Tom Petty Sunflowers 3 disk instead of 9. No regrets.
    4. How are the sonics? Is it squashed?
    I've not bought the digital X-Pensive Winos live set because both the CD and "hi-res" download are squashed. Ugh. The vinyl is allegedly much better, which takes me to rule 3...
    I had a "last straw" moment with The Replacements "Pleased To Meet Me" box set. Everything squashed with a booming bass. I went back to my original CD, and it sounded great. A waste, for me.

    So, the boxes aren't automatic anymore...
     
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  7. Surly

    Surly Bon Viv-oh-no-he-didn't

    Location:
    Sugar Land, TX
    A box needs to have video content for me to seriously consider it. I did get the Tears For Fears Seeds of Love box, though - it doesn't have a DVD of videos (just a surround mix of the album), but I have their other two boxes and wanted the complete set. Their reissue campaign has been frustrating though - first album box came with a DVD, but just a live show; no videos. Second album box has all the videos, a documentary, etc. Same thing happened with Simple Minds and Street Fighting Years - previous boxes all have DVDs with videos; this one does not.

    Demo versions are somewhat interesting to me but I usually only listen once, say "oh, that's cool" and that's it. I want all the single mixes, remixes, b-sides, etc when I get a box, and preferably, all the videos, too (since I mainly collect '80s stuff).

    The latest Ultravox and U2 boxes do not have DVDs or blu-ray discs with videos, so likely will not purchase.

    I do have both New Order boxes (first two albums). Those are somewhat great because they have cool video content, nice boxes, and beautiful books. But the bonus tracks are lacking, and simply have no use for the vinyl LP to be included in each. They should do separate CD/LP boxes.

    The Prince Sign 'O The Times box is wonderful. That's the kind of box I like!
     
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  8. Chazzbo13

    Chazzbo13 Forum Resident

    I'm self-employed...income stability like a roller coaster...I make my list as I see releases happen, and buy when/if possible...sometimes it requires a bit of a wait...sometimes I try to determine purchase on how likely it is to stay in print...
     
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  9. I find it varies between box sets TBH, but the main thing that will get me putting down the cash is unreleased live stuff. Demos are interesting but not always essential, and unless there was a major issue with the original mix of the album I don't see the point in listening to new or alternative mixes, with some exceptions.

    Box sets which for me were worth the money:

    Joy Division - Heart and Soul - Admittedly this is helped by the actual JD catalogue being of rather limited size, so all of the studio recordings were able to fit on two CDs (bar one song), then there was a disc of demos/radio sessions/early versions which covered a fair amount of what is out there, and then a good selection of live stuff for the other disc. Pretty comprehensive and nicely put together with an interesting booklet to read.

    Metallica box sets - So far I only own the AJFA one, but whatever you might think about Lars Ulrich he's an obsessive archivist and a shrewd businessman in that he knows what the fans want when it comes to the band's history. These box sets are lavish, with nice packaging, detailed and interesting books, comprehensive album demos and - the ultimate selling point - a smorgasboard of live stuff spread across audio and DVD options, mostly complete shows. They also come with an MP3 download of the entire thing to boot. Very nice going so far and I'm interested to see what the next ones will have in terms of content. In addition, if you don't want to shell out for the box set you can always buy the 3CD deluxe edition which has selected highlights from the demos and the live stuff.

    Iron Maiden - Eddie's Archive - Could have been better (there are some B-sides missing, and the Donington 1988 performance on the Radio 1 broadcast disc is woeful), but is nicely divided into B-sides/Radio 1 broadcasts/Beast Over Hammersmith, and worth it for the latter alone which is the best Maiden live album around. The Reading 1982 show is really good too.

    Thin Lizzy - At The BBC - Very comprehensive package of all the radio sessions with a couple of great live shows included as well.

    Pink Floyd - The Early Years - I like how this is done - you can either buy the entire set or individual chapters based on specific time periods (I went for the 1972 set as I wanted Pompeii on CD). Huge amount of unreleased and live stuff from what is probably Floyd's most interesting era.


    Here are the ones which I didn't get, for the following reasons:

    Pink Floyd - The Wall Immersion - Save your money and go for the Deluxe edition as that has stuff from The Wall demos as bonus material which justifies the purchase for me. But the box set is a disappointment. Where is the DVD of the Wall live shows? It would be such an obvious thing to include and would have made the set an automatic purchase for a lot of people I suspect. Not including it is just weird. In fact all the PF Immersion sets were rather lacking TBH in terms of content.

    Guns N' Roses - Appetite For Destruction Locked N' Loaded - Wow. Just wow. Seriously, this takes fleecing the fans to a whole new level. A THOUSAND DOLLARS for what is essentially a piece of furniture and the only actual interesting musical content is demos and alternate mixes. No. Live. Stuff. At. All. Seriously. Just wow. If you are going to charge a thousand dollars for a deluxe edition then I expect to get all the soundboards/broadcast mixes from the tour. At the minimum there should be 15-20 full live shows included alongside all of the other stuff. But no, just moderately interesting demos and alternate mixes (included on the normal Super Deluxe Edition, which was just about worth a purchase) and then a load of tat. Flags? Memorabilia? Look, I get why this jacked the price up, some of it was hand crafted stuff, it cost a lot to produce. But I don't buy box sets for this. I buy them for the music, and this was the ultimate case of caveat emptor.
     
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  10. Vaughan

    Vaughan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex, UK
    This has been mentioned several times, and I have a question. Let's take a song, any song, let's take Allison by Elvis Costello. We have the original album version. We have a demo. We have a live recording. Aren't both the demo and live recordings "alternate versions"? In fact, isn't any version other than the original album release simply an alternate? It seems as though some folk think slightly differently - that a live performance is different from a home recording or studio mix... but to me they're not that different. Do you see them as being different?

    I also wanted to say, in a more general way, that I seem to be seeing a mindset in some that something isn't worthy of a second listen if it isn't perceived as being better than the original. For me, this boils down to a "Greatest Hits" type of mindset - that the only version of a song worth hearing more than once is the very best version (however "best" is interpreted). I may well be incorrect - I just don't think of things this way.

    Take,for example, the bonus discs on those expended Costello albums - sometimes I'll just put them on as an normal album. The set includes the original album, of course, but it's nice to have a variant. Being better or worse isn't really in my mind, it's about the moment and experience.
     
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  11. Kiss73

    Kiss73 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scotland
    My tap out is its stopped being fun.

    I have bought 7 deluxe sets recently and 5 of the 7 came damaged. All from different online retailers (I have no local decent shops)

    So the constant disappointment when a parcel arrives has sucked the fun out of this hobby. Thankfully I have a great collection and this seems a real good time to considerably reduce my purchases. It will need to be something real special for me to purchase in the future.
     
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  12. For me it's usually that live versions - good ones anyway - are played with more intensity and are generally more exciting, or that they seem more transcendent than the studio versions. Demos can also deliver a sense of urgency that gets lost in a full studio recording too. Alternate mixes (unless drastically different) are just variations on a theme to my ears.
     
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  13. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    I discovered long ago that for most albums I don't care about hearing every last demo. There are exceptions --- Dylan's Cutting Edge - but the album has to be very special, not just something good that happens to be hitting an anniversary.

    Then the questions are: is it well done? Is if fair value? So the Jethro Tull boxes are great not just for demos but surround, book, remix, reasonable price. New Focus 50 years anthology is another great package, done with care and attention. If it feels overpriced or something to take advantage of "collectors" I steer clear.

    Tim
     
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  14. newelectricmuse

    newelectricmuse charm, strangeness and quark

    Location:
    London
    Exactly this. It's a while since I last bought a box set and it was quite a financial commitment. When the it came damaged and then the replacement was also damaged (I kept it but wish I hadn't) it made me very wary for the future. Tales on this forum (like yours, and the hassles that people have had with the recent Richard and Linda Thompson box set, good though the content may be) have only reinforced my opinion.

    Some bands have some very good outtakes that do have relisten value (Jethro Tull springs to mind) but the best of these often find their way out attached to standard releases. Demos often get one listen. I'm not interested in remixes (by Steven Wilson or anyone) and there's plenty of live stuff "out there" if you want it. I'd rather read an actual book about the artist than the kind of booklet that comes with a box set. And with any box set I've usually got most of (and probably the best of) the material anyway in the form of the original albums.

    If I had money to burn I might be more cavalier about buying these sets, but unfortunately that's not the case.
     
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  15. markreed

    markreed Forum Resident

    Location:
    Imber
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  16. mr.datsun

    mr.datsun Incompletist

    Location:
    London
    Mainly it’s about the material. The box I’m less bothered about. Also only two bands will turn my head with regards boxes and extras. The VU and The Stooges. But, I refrained from buying Loaded 45th as that period is of lesser interest and I have no interest in the extras . I also refrained from the latest Fun House Stooges vinyl megalith as I have the CD box, and even the possibility of the funhouse album cut at 45rpm would not sway me.

    On the whole boxes take too much room and I’m not interested in boxes that just represent a set of studio albums, some of which I wouldnt even buy singly. So no Bowie boxes for me - and if I have to miss out on the bonus material like The Gouster vinyl or the Re:Call disks, then so be it. Quite easy to hear them without straining shelf or wallet.

    NB. However, I do think the GRM boxes of Bayle, Ferrari and Parmegiani are well worth it for the price. 12 or 15 CDs in a neat shelf-friendly box presenting material arguably better heard on CD than some of the boutique vinyl releases that these artists’ music have been gracing in recent years.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2020
  17. Jerquee

    Jerquee Take this, brother, may it serve you well.

    Location:
    New York
    I used to be more obsessive and completist but that just burned out over time. I think I realized that I wasn't really devouring what I bought as I did when I was younger. The sheer volume was part of that but it was also a matter of the acquisition becoming too important rather than the actual listening.

    These days, I still have a few areas where I'll shell out but I am much more discriminating. I vet new releases by considering opinions here and finding places on the net to hear previews. Avoiding expenditures that wouldn't have really satisfied me is a newfound pleasure in itself.

    Despite being a huge Beatle fan I find it easy to avoid the obvious money soak releases that McCartney, for instance, has been guilty of recently (I'm in for the Archive sets but the obvious scammy overblown super traveller trinket edition stuff gets a "Hell, no!"). When you actually look at what they're asking for a few CDs, maybe a DVD and a bits of paper ephemera in a cumbersome box, it's just abusive.

    I find that I enjoy music these days more in the way I did when I was first discovering it so I know I've made the right correction.
     
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  18. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product

    Really hard question.
    Most of the box sets I have are merely for the surround mix.... and frankly it annoys the piss out of me that I need to get a box to have them.
    Aside from that I like album collections. I like listening to music. I don't really want little bits of crap, to dress them up, but essentially cheapen the product, in my mind at least.

    It seems like frequently these days there are these super mega boxes that come in at a big price, but have essentially little to offer. The same album in three formats. Some outtakes that rarely interest me. A book I likely won't read. Some postcards. A pair of used underpants..... I know they need to offer something to try and make their product stand out .... once upon a time it was the music.
     
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  19. Kristofa

    Kristofa Enthusiast of small convenient sound carrier units

    Location:
    usa
    For me, the big selling points for a box set are surround, Hi-res, how much of the content I already own, and how much it costs.

    The Doobie Brothers and Chicago Quadio boxes are a perfect examples of perfect purchases for me. I will continue to buy these blindly because the quality has been wonderful. Keep ‘em under $100 and they are no brainers.

    Career/era spanning retrospectives like the R&L Thompson, Bobbie Gentry, Fleetwood Mac, Def Leppard, and Joni Mitchell all got my money because I didn’t have much of the content or I like the mastering. Unfortunately, 3 out of the five sets either were not filled even though pre-ordered or the discs were so defective, I am still waiting on replacement discs. It makes me want to just buy the downloads for less money and less shelf space.

    individual album mega box sets don’t grab my eye much. I purchased the Roberta Flack s/t deluxe recently and was disappointed as it arrived with damaged packaging, I prefer the sound of my earlier CD, and I didn’t want the LP in the first place (still haven’t played it).

    I had the Pink Floyd Later Years box on pre-order and canceled it. That and the Seeds Of Love box seem to be on the other side of my limit. I want the material, but i don’t want to pay what they are asking. There are so many other things to purchase! :goodie:
     
  20. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Oh, I will add, regarding boxed sets that are just collections of studio album reissues:

    If it’s an artist for whom I would like and don’t already have all the albums included, I’m in, so long as the price per disc that I’m actually going to listen to isn’t crazy. There is some risk in that the odds of every LP in a set being a good copy decreases as the number of LPs increases, but that’s what returns are for. I’ll look for reviews of pressing quality, and, if people tend to say it’s good, I’ll go for it when I see a decent price.

    For example, the Dylan mono box was a no-brainer, both because of the mono mixes and because I did not already have most of those albums on LP. I listen to all of those albums occasionally, so the price per useful LP was pretty good.

    I just got the Dire Straits studio albums boxed set that was recently repressed. I had none of those albums on LP, so every disc included is useful to me, and I jumped on a substantial price drop.

    One time I wish I had not tapped out: The Beatles mono boxed set. My judgement was that $30-ish per LP, of which there are at least two I expect I’d spin one time, and all being albums I already own in stereo on some format, was too much, and I could just buy the individual albums I wanted. However, I was late to the game (started buying vinyl again in late 2016), and didn’t realize some of the albums were going scarce at retail. So, in hindsight, the retail price for the whole box would have been relatively sane. Oops. Though, had I been with it at the time of release, I could have just bought all the individual albums I wanted, too... but the lesson I learned there is, if I think I want something, I buy it as soon as possible. Not out of being any sort of completist, just because it now nags at me when I am reminded that I could have had it.
     
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  21. Stencil

    Stencil Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lockport, IL
    I buy or don't buy for various reasons. I was very hot for the Soft Cell box set. But no banned Sex Dwarf video? Im good with the albums and 45s I have. Same thing with the Goats Head Soup box. The 5.1 sounds interesting (I love 5.1) but I realized my main interest was the posters. So I passed. Had a mild interest in King Crimson (far from my favorite band unlike Soft Cell or the Stones); yet I have all of their deluxe box sets! How did that happen?
     
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  22. Kiss73

    Kiss73 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Scotland
    Just as well you passed...the posters are **** quality.
     
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  23. Stencil

    Stencil Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lockport, IL
    Even better to know. I have an original vinyl and the Japanese SACD so I think im good sound wise. Would be nice to hear the 5.1 but I love the murkiness of the recording and I don't think that 5.1 is going to add anything to that or help me appreciate it in any way. Now the 5.1 XTC releases have made a band I'm interested in jump to one of my all time favorites.
     
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  24. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    Some interesting remarks here. For example:

    "What Sir Paul has done with his release is deeply cynical, deeply cynical, and I think there’s a difference between the deluxe box set, where you are really thinking about giving value for money, giving content that justifies the price tag. And there is the other thing where you’re simply manipulating the fact that there are completists. And, like I said, there is a lot of people out there now that are putting box sets together, where there really isn’t the concept to justify them. There are people putting out deluxe editions or multi-formats where there really isn’t anything to justify that."

    Tim
     
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  25. Eric_Generic

    Eric_Generic Enigma

    Location:
    Berkshire
    I think we all have boxsets we wish we'd jumped on, and not quibbled over, and then ones we regret a little!

    Hopefully we have fewer of the former than the latter :)

    EG.
     
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