Do you think that's because of compressor usage? I see that terms limiting (trimming peaks, boosting loudness) and compression (for timber change, highlighting certain elements etc) are being used often interchangeably and are confusing for non-pros. As @A well respected man pointed out, the Blu-Ray version is more dynamic and smoother sounding. A few side 1 tracks and the Medley part is more than listenable for me. But I do agree, that the top end on some tracks is not so soft as I would love it to be.
Also, in the remix of come together when Ringo’s playing the high hat. We all know the high hat is one of the furthest left components of a drum kit. Only the crash cymbal is further left. For some reason Giles decided to pan it FAR RIGHT!! What?!? I thought the whole point of the Stereo* drums was to simulate a modern drum sound with stereo overheads. How did that pass quality control?
I know mono is the often preferred way to go on early Bs. While I only read the first and last page here of this thread, I know that there are a sizable group that considers AHDN is a total knockout in stereo. I think it's got an appealing clarity and a satisfying mix that does sound like rock & roll. "I Should Have Known Better" is 3D perfection, why would someone want that folded down to mono? It's like they are live in your living room in stereo. John is right there not kidding, right!. MFSL LP is my fave sounding copy of this recording. As my ears age, it will likely stay my go-to listening pressing.
Actually, I think that notion (early Beatles-mono / late Beatles-stereo) is completely wrong. Ok, the first two (twin track recordings) are obviously much better in mono, and by the White Album stereo mixes were very good. But everything in between is the opposite for me: AHDN, BFS and Help! have very good stereo mixes, while Rubber Soul, Revolver and Pepper feel de-composed and clumsy, being much better in mono. I guess when their music got more complex, stereo became more difficult, and they didn't pay much care and attention to it anyway because mono was still king.
Incorrect (if you're referring to Beatles pressings). There was a German Green Odeon Mono "With the Beatles" for sure (I've seen one, which was completely trashed, and this nutty store wanted $300.00 for it about 10 years ago)... and I think (but am not sure) that there was a German Green Odeon Mono "A Hard Day's Night" .
Nope. I stand by my statement. But mono mixes were still put out for a year or so. And the fact that you haven't seen any German mono pressings after 1963 kind of proves my point. But.....I could be wrong... Let me know what you find sir.
How is Pepper a clumsy stereo mix?... The hard left- center- hard right panning had stopped by 1967. Can you elaborate on what you mean. I have been a mix/mastering engineer for over 18 years and I have never heard the phrase "clumsy" applied to a mix. Educate me please.
Yes, agreed. But unfortunately there is too much EQ on those MFSL records. But it would be nice if the 2009 stereo A Hard Day's Night CD sounded like the MFSL record....EQ AND ALL.
I made it clear that I was talking about the CD only. I can't play the Blu-ray version so... Could be the compresion that makes the top end harsh. Could be different mastering EQ applied to the 16/44.1 master. Mastering engineers love to make things brighter. I wouldn't be surprised if they used different mastering techniques for the CD and the Blu-ray. I shouldn't have to buy the Blu-ray to get good sound. That is fu**ed up.
No argument there. The mono mixes of those first two albums really rock and gell in mono. But I just love the separation of those early stereo mixes.
I mean beyond just listing our preferred mixes; If we stayed rigidly to the concept of the thread, it would have had a pretty short shelf life. So I don't mind it morphing into a thread discussing the mixing of the albums and why they were done that way and their alternatives. I wouldn't say we went off the rails, more like a scenic detour.
Most of these posts are about stereo and mono mixes. There is the odd post about Abbey Road remix. But it hasn't gone off the rails. The new stereo mixes were down by mostly Giles Martin. Some people don't like the Giles Marin remixes and that includes Abbey Road. So the topic is related and has to do with the conversation.
Obviously I can't educate you, because you are a professional and I am just a music lover sharing his impressions, surely in a very clumsy way . See, I don't know if clumsy was the correct word. English is not my first language so maybe it's wrong. I just mean the stereo mix sounds careless to me, like done in a hurry. Like Lovely Rita, for example: "put everything on the right and vocals in the center, leave it like that, yeah, that'll do..." And that's not mentioning the missing effects like the phasing in LSD or the different speed in She's Leaving Home. Now, A Day in the Life is wonderful in that 67 stereo mix, it's still my favourite mix of that song.
I grew up with the stereo of Pepper (we had a stereo by 1965 in our house-it was a Montgomery Wards label one but it sounded great for the time). So that has to be my pick especially for A Day in The Life.
For me - PPM - mono WTB - mono AHDN - stereo BFS - I lean to stereo but favor mono for the rockers like "Kansas City" HELP! - mono (close call) RS - mono (close call except it's no contest vs the awful stereo mix with no center signal) Pepper - toss-up MMT - stereo (Horzu) WA - toss-up due to major differences in some mixes. I think the stereo mix of AHDN is just magical and the stereo BFS is nice as well.
They were novel for folks at at the time where most of the instruments were on one channel. It was as close as a karaoke as we had then.
I will say again stereo for Money. Using the extra track for the additional guitar gives it extra kick and it’s a great early stereo mix.
Not only that, but also remember that when 3 or 4 tracks were 'bounced down' to only 1 track of another tape, that locks the elements of the song together and limits the panning options for mixing, so there were still technical limitations as well. Yeah, so much for "stereo mixes were done faster because they figured out the effects and balance while doing mono mixing".
Yes, and that's further proof of what stereo meant at that point: they could have gone back to the pre-bounce tapes to have more separate elements and make a better stereo mix. But they didn't even bother to do that. It seems it was more a question of expediency than creating the best possible stereo mix. That was my point, Revolver or Sgt. Pepper have worse stereo mixes than AHDN or BFS because when their music was more straightforward, stereo mixing was easier. Exactly, I never understood that argument. This is from Richard Lush, 2nd Engineer in Sgt Pepper: "The only real version of Sgt Pepper is the mono version. The Beatles were there for all the mono mixes. Then, after the album was finished, George Martin, Geoff Emmerick and I did the stereo in a few days, just the three of us, without a Beatle in sight. There are all sorts of things on the mono, little effects here and there, which the stereo doesn't have". And then Lewisohn adds: "Geoff Emmerick confirms this view and points out that almost all of the Beatles recording sessions were monitored in the control room through just one mono speaker anyway, except for when stereo mixing was being done". Of course, this is true for most of the album, since The Beatles attended a couple of stereo mixes (A Day in the Life being one), but it's the bottom line of the matter.
That's not true... The reason they bounced down was because they only had the four-track machine to work with. If they could utilize the pre-bounce tracks, they wouldn't have had to bounce the tracks in the first place!