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Why didn't "You Love Me To Hate You" by KISS become a hit?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by RosesFromYesterday, Jan 14, 2022.

  1. RosesFromYesterday

    RosesFromYesterday Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North America


    One of the best obscure KISS tracks. Great hooks, especially on the pre-chorus ("girl you want me to cry..."), where harmonizing the melody with a G works well, turning what would otherwise be a simple Am-F-G progression into Am7-Fadd9-G. The key change from Cm to Am and back again is also nice.

    Probably Paul's best vocal performance on a record, the extremely high belting does a great job of conveying the desperation in the song. And the lyrics ("pleasure and pain feel the same when the night is through", "you've got my heart in a hangman's noose, pull the rope and make it tight", etc...) do a good job of depicting relationships accurately (as opposed to the idealized fairytales in most pop/rock music).
     
    905, miller_time22 and warewolf95 like this.
  2. AngusStanley

    AngusStanley Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cedar Rapids IO
    It’s not a terrible song but the recording is a touched up demo like most of that album, sonically it’s awful. Plus it was never released as a single. They thought Read My Body (blatant rewrite of Pour Some Suga On Me) was a potential single, it appeared on the hype sticker of some pressings.

    Always liked both that and King of Hearts from the same album. They’re blatant Bon Jovi trend hopping songs though, they don’t sound like KISS. Paul ruined that band by turning it into Bon Jovi lite, he was so jealous of Bon Jovi since he introduced him to Desmond Child.
     
  3. RosesFromYesterday

    RosesFromYesterday Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North America
    They should have brought back Nevison.

    I hear Bon Jovi in King of Hearts and Hide Your Heart. Not in any of Paul's other songs from HitS, nor in Eric's song, nor in Gene's songs. I never minded the Bon Jovi copying, I like Bon Jovi.
     
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  4. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Hot In The Shade is close to being my favourite KISS album (definitely top five). It's packed with songs strong enough to be hits and this was definitely one of them.
     
  5. Doomster

    Doomster Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Hot In the Shade is pretty mixed - a step up from Crazy Nights, but without any really standout tracks (unlike Crazy Crazy Nights), and at 15 songs, at least 5 tracks of filler.
     
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  6. Doomster

    Doomster Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    “Hide Your Heart” is a Bon Jovi rip. “Read My Body” is a Def Leppard rip. If I trimmed the album to my preferred ten tracks (you can’t make up for quality with quantity), both would go.

    But “You Love Me to Hate You” would make the cut, as confusing as I find the chorus lyrics.
     
    RosesFromYesterday likes this.
  7. Doomster

    Doomster Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    One thing I’ll say in favour of HITS is that, despite the conventional narrative, Revenge is not necessarily a “huge step up” quality wise, in terms of songs - the improvement is Ezrin’s production.

     
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  8. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Yeah, for me, Revenge is a massive step down songwriting-wise. It's the only KISS album with none I like at all. The Ezrin production was great though, obviously.
     
  9. Terrapin Station

    Terrapin Station Master Guns

    Location:
    NYC Man/Joy-Z City
    Unfortunately there's no official policy that every KISS tune must receive maximum airplay.
     
  10. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    I would vote for the politician who promised to bring that law in. :D
     
  11. ralphie

    ralphie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lawrence, KS
    Because it's a crap song, BusNoise/Conestoga Rankin/etc. Also, your hero Eric Carr didn't play on it.
     
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  12. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Location:
    Athens, Tennessee
    It's simple. Does the program director like it, well enough to try it. Do the listeners like it well enough? If so, it at least gets airplay. Enough stations add it, it has a chance to be a hit. Also, is it the right length to get airplay, does it have language issues, or other standards and practices issues?
     
    RosesFromYesterday likes this.
  13. Doomster

    Doomster Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Not sure you’re second point is why it wasn’t a hit :laugh:
     
  14. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    I think it's more about greasing enough palms.
     
    Curveboy likes this.
  15. Doomster

    Doomster Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    I assume it wasn’t a serious comment by Terrapin, but you are of course correct.

    The syrupy “Forever” from the same album was of course a big hit.
     
  16. mbd40

    mbd40 Steely Dan Fan

    Location:
    Hope, Ar
    It's not very good. I don't hear any strong hooks or melody.
     
  17. WhoDaresWins

    WhoDaresWins Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    The singing in the bridge and chorus are off and don't sound that great.. this song has potential if Paul and Gene had hired a producer that may had re-arranged or changed the song to work
     
  18. mbd40

    mbd40 Steely Dan Fan

    Location:
    Hope, Ar
    Yeah, the song sounds kind of annoying. I think most radio listeners hearing this back in the day would have switched to something else. There wasn't much hit potential.

    You're right that better production might have helped. It still wouldn't be a great song but it would sound better.
     
  19. Tattooed Headshrinker

    Tattooed Headshrinker Accidentally Like A Martyr

    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Because Kiss weren't writing "hits" in the late 80's. And even bringing in Desmond Child could not fix that.
     
    Northwind likes this.
  20. zphage

    zphage genre fluid

    It’s a throwaway chug a chug a, at a time when hair metal bands were doing much much better. But lest we cry for Gene and Paul, the album did go gold, but the song is not single worthy. The chorus performance can’t save the subpar production and performance on the verses, sounds like a demo, with standard hackneyed lyrics.
     
  21. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Except, of course, they picked up only their second ever US top ten single from the very album that the subject of this thread comes from.
     
  22. Deuce66

    Deuce66 Senior Member

    When the chorus arrives I'm out, Paul is out of his comfort zone and is basically unlistenable to my ears (very annoying). One of several tracks on this album that belong in the KISS dumpster.
     
    WhoDaresWins likes this.
  23. Chew

    Chew Casual Stalker

    This song has always been my favorite track from this album. Not sure why it was never put out as a single. Would it have topped the charts? No. But a great tune I think.
     
  24. RosesFromYesterday

    RosesFromYesterday Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    North America
    Some of Gene's songs are very bad here (i.e. Boomerang), they should have replaced that one with Street Legal. Much better song.

    Crazy Nights has better production.

    There's nothing wrong with mimicking another style if you do it well. Carnival of Souls is mimicking Alice in Chains, and it is great.

    You don't like "Take It Off"?

    "Girl you want me to cry..." is a very strong hook.

    What's off about the signing?

    The production isn't great, but the song itself is terrific.

    That's my favorite part of his vocal range. I wish he had done an entire album in that range.
     
    carlwm likes this.
  25. Terrapin Station

    Terrapin Station Master Guns

    Location:
    NYC Man/Joy-Z City
    What's wrong with "Boomerang" in your view?
     
    carlwm likes this.

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