Why I love Vinyl - Part 1

Oh yeah, about the story of the young guy wanting all of his music to sound good? When I started upgrading my system years ago, most things did sound better. But at the same time, I started hearing imperfections and other sonic anomalies on my CDs and LPs. I was able to hear inside the medium and get to what was mastered and how it was mastered.

I guess I just didn't play many bad CDs at that time. But the ones that sounded bad before still sounded bad, like any 80s made CD from Arista.

How am I doing?

 

I am a friend of both Steve Hoffman and Humorem. We own many of the same audiophile equipiment. Both of them have been to my home and I have been to Humorem's for music listening (Steve's usually busy working at home). At this point in time, my music reproduction system is satisfying all the time, sometimes more than others. Yesterday, the designer/engineer of our line stage, amps, phono stage (my interconnects and soon to be uniquely fabulous active tube phono step up) shared great sound in my listening room-on a Saturday afternoon. I also have a better sound room (but could use some acoustic treatment).

I know that battery power and unplugging everything in my home would further enhance my listening pleasure (personal experience at Humorem's). Maybe I have lower standards in for than Humorem for listening playback, but now I and my friends, wife, etc. (cats) enjoy the music all the time, relative to the software (CDs, 78s, LPs, tape). I will never take the plunge and unplug the multitude of powered appliances, computers, clocks, etc. in my home. I will however, eventually invest in a battery source for my digital and analog front ends where the difference is most dramatic. Humorem's proof at my home was instantaneous and fantastic.

I have a new (old stock-1986) digital playback system which is sooo good and so inexpensive that I feel very bad for the digital front end equipment buyers who are generally gipped when they buy new digital equipment. (Example-Muse Signature 9 for sale for $2500, list $4000. Rounds off transients and highs, great soundstage, dynamically compressed and boring relatively speaking). My digital front end sounds almost as good as analog with good engineered CDs (like Steve's). My analog system will soon surpass digital playback with the new active step up (Humorem, our mutual friends and I all use transformer step ups). The analog front end has the ability to recreate the recording venue while preserving the musical cues and harmonics, ala digital but with greater soundstaging and that see-through quality found in good live performances (generally not electronic rock but acoustical performances).

My favorite music is opera, classical, jazz and pop pre-Rolling Stones. Because my system's magnificent resolution (I don't know how accurate my system is and I don't care-I listen to music most of the time, not sound), I am listening more to Humorem's favorite type of music, instrumental rock (even Led Zeppelin, et. al.) my wife's favorite type of music. I am enjoying 1960's to 1980's soft rock when well recorded and engineered on either CD or LP.

I must say that the cost is not relevant to audio equipment today. Used older gear often provides infinitely greater resolution and musical enjoyment at relatively low cost. Unfortunately, it is by trial and error (or with the help of my friends trial and error) that a musical system can be assembled.

Once in my search for musical equipment (and I was foolish in accepting review and salesman information in my 20's and 30's whereby I bought based on reputation as much as on listening), I nearly stopped listening to music at home. In the early 80's, I purchased an Audio Research SP14, Classic 60 and Martin Logan Quests. For three years I suffered, since I know what live acoustic music performed in great local venues sound like.

I am very pleased to have met Humorem and Steve in the last half decade. This has resulted (together with my brilliant design/engineer) in assembling a music reproduction system for all types of software which can provide endless hours of enjoyment, day or night (although I do like the sound at 1 am better).

Humorem is super critical. Steve is an easy going guy. I wasn't at yesterday's listening session but I had a great one at my house, several miles away. It is noteworthy that with our disparate personalities and musical tastes, that our music reproduction systems have great similarities and basically provide pleasure (at least most of the time for Humorem). Those who are deriding Humorem's free advice are only hurting their own growth. At least I never expected a perfect sound reproduction system could make gold from a sow's ear (whatever). I expect my system to retrieve as much information as possible that is embedded in the software. I've got most of that (when your good records start sounding like the master tape, your closer) and now the process is to eliminate non-musical information/noise such as bad A/C and other power artifacts.

Bye for now and to your listening pleasure.

 

Seagoat? What the hell made you pick a name like that? (Just kidding.)

Welcome to the forum, Steve.

Tell the good people about your speakers, why don't you? That's when you started to get into high fidelity, IMO.

Tell them about your Aurios. That was huge.

And I think I have heard good sound over at your house on Saturday afternoons. It still doesn't sound good over here though. I will have to come over and check it out. I will no doubt learn something. Love your room. Tell everybody about that too. Don't be shy. Not the best sounding room I ever heard but the most relaxing one I've ever been in. One day I would like to have a room like that. For now, as a humble record dealer, a room like that is just a dream for me.
But when I dream...

TP

 

Seagoat,

Welcome indeed. A very impressive first post. We have been a little short on opera lovers so you'll probably get a couple of questions asking for recommendations. I thought you expressed yourself very well in this particular sentence:

I hope you'll enjoy this forum.

Regards,
Metralla

 

Hi All,

I was also part of the small group that met at Acoustic Image years ago with Steve and Tom. Saturday meetings at Jerry’s Deli were the high point of the week for me. Both Steve and Tom are VERY good friends of mine. Both are totally dedicated to the “Music”.

Steve H is the “Greatest Mastering Engineer in the World Today” IMO. A Mastering Genius, now HE could make a “Silk Purse out of a Sows Ear” musically. Tom Port is with out a doubt “The Greatest Authority on Recorded Music Today” IMO, even if he is self-appointed. His dedication to the Absolute Sound of Reproduced Music is “Fanatical”. He strives for the Maximum resolution available out his system. What for? For US! When he recommends a record or a certain pressing, you can count on Tom taking it to the max! Sure batteries sound better, it’s a fact. I was with him when he bought his original set of batteries. For me it’s not practical, but I’m glad at least Tom has them in his system. Being a record dealer he needs to keep the playback system tuned to the max.

If Tom makes a recommendation on a recording you can take it to the bank. Good Friend or not I get a fair share of flak from him on the present condition of my system. That’s just Tom. Of course NO two systems will ever sound the same, I like to use the term “Different” since there isn’t ANY Reproduced Absolute Sound. I was with Tom at “The Jack Sheldon Venue” and HE DID say we have a long way to go with our systems, when we heard Jack’s Trumpet, live.

In closing…. Steve and Tom keep up the good work.

Brian D.

 

Thank you Humorem and Metralla. This is the only chat forum I have written to in five years of internet service. That's how much I enjoy reading the posts. This vinyl love thread has got some people who are not as open minded as we are concerning seeking better (sonically-what else?) music reproduction equipment.

My nom de plume is for my sign, Capricorn. My last name is usually misspelled and my first name is often mispronounced by younger people who never heard of Stephen Douglas or Stephen Foster (Stephen like in Steven).

Yes, when I bought my pair of Legacy Focus speakers, I arrived at the higher end audiophilically-speaking. They play all types of music equally great with the right combination of front end and power equipment. I just purchased a pair of Signature IIIs for the living room which replaced those mediocre Martin Logan Quests (I listed them on Audiogon at 12 am Sunday morning, they sold at 8 am on Monday morning with eight full price offers=to the losers I offered my advice that they were actually winners now that they could buy Legacy speakers instead. Some thanked me and some thought I was nuts).

The aurios under my CD player(s) are fantastic. I don't know if Humorem wants me to tell everyone about a lesser, very cheap method of mechanical vibration isolation which can be purchased at your local Fry's. They go under my equipment that have too many interconnects (pre-amp) and odd shaped (amps).

Is Brian the same one who I know from the east SFV who invented that superior record cleaning solution? That stuffs great on used records (don't use it on virgin vinyl though such as Classic reissues, for some reason it works on grade B vinyl and worse-the majority of all older records). Humorem sells it. Try it, you might like it.

Thanks again, Stephen, err, Seagoat

 

Pillows? Under the stereo? Are you kidding me?

I already told them! They didn't believe me!

“All truth passes through three stages: First it is ridiculed; Second, it is violently
opposed; and Third, it is accepted as self-evident”
—Arthur Schopenhauer

TP

 

Hi Seagoat,

You guessed it! How are you?

The record cleaning solution I concocted in the 70’s is some of what
Humorem is selling. Had Tom and Steve over some time ago to evaluate the before and after effects of the solution. Best four ears on earth to try and convince. Your're right the solution works best on old noisy records; Vg- garage sale stuff, record bin, and ebay vinyl.

 

Seagoat and Brian D.,

Welcome aboard. It must have been fun to have weekend gatherings with Master Steve and Humorem. I really envy you guys.

Tom doesn't need any reinforcement here. So I guess you guys are here for containment. Have fun and enjoy the ride.

Stephen, you are not this guy in disguise, right?

 

Brian D, are you reffering to the Disc Doctor fluid??? If not, which fluid?

 

Gary, glad you like the sound, that's what it's all about. Trying to get some people to listen for themselves, for free, feels like pulling teeth sometimes, but your post tells me that all my typing has at least helped somebody out there.

Here's the real test, the easy way. Make sure no one is home, then throw every breaker to every circuit except the stereo. Then you will REALLY hear it.

On second thought, don't. You'll be spoiled for life. You'll be like me, never happy!

TP

 

Ahhh jeez - it's not that I doubt you Tom, but do you realize how many digital clocks I will have to re-set next Saturday?

 

More sad stories in the big city.

You have to suffer for your art, Al.

Not only do I suffer for my art, I make others suffer with me, and then I write about my suffering so other people have to suffer through reading it.

I think I must be Jewish, but my parents were WASPs, so don't know how that could be...
TP

 

There is a simple yet expensive remedy. Just power 'em all with batteries.

 

Any thoughts on PS Audio popwer regenerators

I did not much discusssion on these products from PS Audio. I have the PS Audio 300 which does wonder for phono, pre-amp, and Walker Power Fiiter (may be wrong name here) for Turntables. Their UO cleans up the sound for ARC VT200 without squashing the dynamics or bass. I am not thrilled about their power cables but probably it's another system matching issue.

So if someone has compared the benefits of products such as PS Audio vs. battery power, please post your experience. I have no affiliation with PS Audio but I do have a curse that I can't stop tweaking my system.

 

Re: Any thoughts on PS Audio popwer regenerators

Battery power guaranteed to be a dramatic improvement over PS audio or your money back. Whatever you heard with PS, double it. That's the battery effect.
TP

 

batter power

My apologies if this question has been asked and answered before. It may even exist in FAQ? Anyway, what are the products that I should look into and their price range? Thanks.

PS: I tried to search but the search points to the whole thread rather than a particular article within the thread. Did I miss something on the user interface of the search capability? Thanks.

 

I am bringing back the water analogy that Tom deemed flawed.

PS Audio (or any other brand) power condition : Battery
:: Water filter/distiller (drip, drip, drip..) : A full tank of purified water

You will see an even bigger difference when you're really thirsty.

 

battery power

I would like to try it but am clueless on what/where/how much to buy. And how long does the listening session last, i.e., charge up, listen until the battery drains, charge up?

 

I think it's the Record Rejuvenator fluid TP is selling.

 

Re: battery power

Try the guy who has a gun pointed at his head (what's his name?) in his avatar.

 

I Believe Humorem uses deep cycle batteries. Several bridged together for longer listening sessions. Now if Tom could pick up some surplus Submarine batteries...

 

CD player prices

A good CD player is not in expensive either. I have seen Krell 28S
at a list of $7500 and Wadia seperates at about $15,000.

Personally I am using Oracle/Graham/Koetsu turntable.

 

I see lots of assertions about what sounds better than what on this thread. Now, 'better' is a purely subjective claim -- obviously there's a vocal contingent that prefers the 'euphonic' distortion inherent to LP to the superior accuracy of CD, and there's nothing irrational about that. It's simply a preference. But 'different' needn't be a purely subjective claim. One thing I didn't see mentioned once in this thread (though I did only skim some of the replies) were the words 'controlling for bias'. None of the 'scientific' results suggesting difference I see reported here seem to have controlled for sighted bias, which would be an elementary control in a truly scientific test. Blind testing is standard way to minimize 'expectation effect' that accompanies sighted comparison.

There another well-documented sources of bias, i.e., if two systmes are not level-matched, up to a certain point the louder of the two will tend to be reported as sounding 'better'. The would certainly need to be controlled for in the case of, for example, comparing different masterings (e.g. LP vs CD) of the same material, or comparing two amps.