Will digitally mastered vinyl become expensive in the future?

Of course, with digitally mastered vinyl, it can be done an infinite amount of time.

Yes, the masters would be digital, but they still are tangible.

I have some amazing sounding digital masters on vinyl. Of course, I would love originals but such is life.

 

It's expensive now?

 

This is true, but I mean a lot more expensive. That said, I agree, new vinyl is so over priced.

 

I think the collectors market is driven more by supply and demand than audio quality tbh.

 

The audio quality drives up the demand and reduces supply?

 

Are you asking a question or stating something?

 

Its already expensive. At £20 a pop and rising it's a premium way of listening to music.

I'm only in vinyl for the sound quality. If that starts to slide (and lets face it, it can be hit and miss on new issues) then I'll have no regrets in stopping buying on what is the most inconvenient format ever made.

 

Exactly.

 

He was saying that demand/supply or audio quality should not be posited as alternative causes of high prices, since audio quality determines demand/supply.

I think that the original post was actually closer to the truth when it comes to prices for vinyl; it just wasn’t clearly stated. Basically, I think that the demand for vinyl in the secondary market is influenced to some extent by audio quality (Led Zeppelin II “RL”). But, factors that have nothing to do with audio quality have always been far more important for most items.

The key factors are the popularity of the artist, the physical attributes of the item and the scarcity of the item. Prices for items by the Beatles, Dylan, Led Zeppelin, and the like are driven by the collectibility of the artist. Japan CD’s with their paper obis, and colored vinyl releases are examples of physical attributes that result in items that can demand high prices regardless of the fact that audio equivalent US CD’s or black vinyl may be widely available. And scarcity is key - the price of the four or five known copies of Dylan’s original test pressing of Blood on the Tracks will not come down simply because of the release of the recent box set. On rare occasions, all of the factors, including superior sound quality are present in a release - the perfect example being Led Zeppelin’s Classic Records 45 rpm box set - and prices will go through the roof.

But , most of the time, sound quality doesn’t have much impact. So, to answer the original post, rather than asking whether, for example, Bowie’s clear vinyl Black Star will hold its value despite its digital mastering, ask about the popularity of the artist, the physical attributes of the item, and the scarcity.

Oh, I should add that original pressing will always be desired simply for the fact that they are originals.

 

This ones's easy. No, not a single digitally mastered LP will become expensive in the future. In the future, they will look back with a mixture of pity and contempt on a time when people paid high prices for vinyl that was not AAA analog. Digitally mastered vinyl will be worthless, like Barbra Streisand records.

Digital and analog must not touch.

 

Er, WHICH Barbra Streisand records? She recorded analogue for way longer than anybody else.

 

The problem with your premise is 1) you assume the fact digitally mastered vinyl can be done an infinite amount of times is of any consequence and 2) there is much need to re-cut anything given you can make 100s of thousands of albums from a single metal plate.

New vinyl cuts - digital or analog - don't just happen for the hell of it. They happen for the most part because there is sufficient demand to justify doing a new pressing and the old metal plates were damaged or no longer exist OR a new cut will improve on the previous cut enough to drive sufficient sales. For the most part there isn't even sufficient demand for new pressings - let alone new cuts which is why so many albums only get one pressing these days.

The far, far bigger factors impacting price will be the cost of raw materials, the cost of running and maintaining equipment, and how viable economically vinyl is down the road (which to a large degree will be dictated by demand).

 

You can't make hundreds of thousands of LP discs from one plate. Not if you want good records. Stampers last so many records before they make poor records. One set of lacquers can be plated to make a mother and stampers. And those stampers can make 2-4 thousand records per set of good quality before they wear out. Vinyl is not a cheap medium to manufacture. Today's prices on average for new records correspond to the 1960's prices when inflation is factored in. Records are often a limited production item compared to the 1970's and 1980's.

 

This is a mixture of fact and fiction.

You can make dozens and dozens of stampers from a single mother and at least a handful of mothers from a single plate. This can easily be 6 digits of LPs. And how many LPs sell close to even 100,000 units these days? Virtually none. And that’s the point.

 

Dozens and Dozens of stampers from a mother, Yes. Handful of mothers from a plate, Yes. Ever heard of also, stampers do wear out, or also get mechanical damage, yes, sometimes they do. And in today's age, many times when there's a new reissue of something, there's often a remaster. And also, QC policies at record pressing plants vary, and so does how many pressings got pressed off a set of metalwork. And yes, I've seen old metalwork from the 1960's used into the 1980's on back catalog titles (MCA a commonly known offender) and Arista's Flashback 45 RPM reissues often using vintage stampers.

 

Fiction is also picking an arbitrary date and applying time value of money. It's bogus. The price of a record is market driven. Supply and demand dictate prices. CDs are cheap now, no demand. Vinyl in the '90s was $12 an album while CDs were $16. Those '90s used records are now priced upwards of $100 and a lot more if they are more desirable. Again, very limited supply and high demand.

 

I'm looking for that first Smiley Smile digital vinyl reissue by Simply Vinyl or one of those companies that came out 10 or 15 years ago. Unique -- bad recording to begin with, but with the added hard, brittle glass-like SQ in the that reissue and I think you've got a real collector's item there. I'll bet it's already climbed in value.

Wait...is that not the topic?

 

I dont think they are too expensive.....Just find an inflation calculator for 1977-80. $8.00 then is about $32.00 today So regardless of demand or audio quality the money is similar if not cheaper by couple bucks.

 

I have Simply Vinyl Pet Sounds, sounds rather awful.

 

Some of it already is...look at what certain RSD releases go for at times, even if the price comes down a bit later.

 

Hit or miss with that label. I had a SV press Byrds Sweetheart of The Rodeo that I thought sounded pretty good, but I'm the type that gets burned just one time before moving on, so that company lost me quite some time back.

 

Of course they wear out - after you make a half dozen or so mothers and a 50 or 100 stampers from each mother and 500 or so LPs from each stamper. Do the math. Nobody is selling the kind of numbers which mandate a new cut due to wear.

As for damage or cutting a master to improve on the old cut (or give the illusion of improvement to generate sales), I think I covered those in my earlier post.

 

No doubt that supply and demand plays a role. But it’s not as simple as that.

Records are not perishable goods. The price of a record is also driven by costs. You don’t have to make a single one (which is often what happens and was my original point) and you have to make a certain minimum quantity if you decide to make any at all. But you’re certainly not going to make them if the unit price where the supply and demnd curves is lower than the unit cost.

I’m not sure what picking an arbitrary date or applying the time value of money has to do with anything.

 

RE: the supply and demand discussion. This already occurs with digitally sourced vinyl. And sometimes those prices can be quite expensive.

I'm not talking about a reissue of some classic rock title btw, I mean albums from the last fifteen years that had a run in small numbers, sold out and now are fetching very high prices due to the vinyl resurgence. And the label, for whatever reason, has chosen not to do a re-press yet.

Perhaps in a decade, if vinyl goes back into its Dark Ages again the reverse will occur, but right now I've seen some pretty silly prices for some of these LP's.

 

Right, Wildflowers comes to mind, along with a bunch of other digitally master records from the 90s. Generally speaking used records in NM condition are overpriced.