Wow and flutter, etc. Tape Speed Issues - Tone Poet / Blue Note 80th anniversary vinyl LP problems.

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by StevenTounsand, Aug 30, 2019.

  1. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    If only those weren't MQA encoded I might consider them. As it stands, I'll stick with my old 80s CD copies.
     
  2. mpayan

    mpayan A Tad Rolled Off

    I know. Thats the only crappy part. Doesnt that have to be decoded though?
     
  3. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    It will play decoded or undecoded, but the problem is, even if you decode it you get lossy audio because MQA is a lossy format. It's a scam I don't want to support, so I won't be buying any UHQCDs.
     
  4. mpayan

    mpayan A Tad Rolled Off

    Ill leave this alone after this post. I do wonder if the mastering is different on these. Sounds pretty darn good.



    ok back to warbles, wobbles and flutters
     
    patient_ot likes this.
  5. p.analogowy

    p.analogowy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Warsaw PL
    Do you mean you hear it on the piano? Just making sure since Grant Green uses a decent amount of vibrato which can be mistaken for flutter.
    I was thinking of getting this reissue but if it is still audible on the piano then I'll have to rethink this. Although I have to say I am quite happy with Born to be Blue.
     
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  6. YEX 750-1

    YEX 750-1 Long-winded Brother

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Yes- Kenny Drew’s piano is the only issue for me. The guitar sounds great.

    Honestly most of the record is completely fine, but some of the more piano-forward tracks suffer a tiny bit. It is NOT bad relative to the worst examples we’ve heard. If I wasn’t waiting for flutter to happen (which is a frustrating way to listen, I really wish my mind wouldn’t focus there) it wouldn’t bother me at all.

    And while the flutter is there- this is still a worthwhile release to pick up and support. This one hasn’t been redone before, and the KG mastering reminds me a little of the old APs (or maybe it’s a natural “air” in the recording). Packaging is excellent, even includes a replica of the original paper BN insert, a really nice touch. Hope more releases like this come forward.
     
  7. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    Thanks for the honest opinion. I may skip this one, but I'll probably pick up BTBB eventually.
     
    YEX 750-1 and p.analogowy like this.
  8. This Heat

    This Heat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    listening to Sunday Mornin now. It does sound great. I'm not hearing any piano issues yet, but I am also distracted by how much surface noise my pressing seems to have! I am going to clean it one more time.
     
  9. Ben Toscano

    Ben Toscano Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hartford, CT
    Same with my copy. Visually perfect but consistent surface noise on side 2.
     
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  10. This Heat

    This Heat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Yeah, side 2 was noisy.
     
  11. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    So I just cleaned and played the Craft Recordings Chet Baker LP from Black Friday RSD. A beautiful Stoughton cover, pressed at RTI, mastered by Kevin Gray. The pressing is flat and quiet.

    But.......significant piano warbling.

    Honestly, I don't recall EVER having this sort of issue with a mainstream release before this year. There could be wow due to an off-center pressing, and a pinch warp might cause a bit of riggling, but just what is going on? I'd like someone to put all of these affected LPs on Kevin Gray's system for him to listen to, one after the other, and ask him to explain why this problem has occurred only as of this year. Correct me if I'm wrong about the timing. But I have dozens of Music Matters and Analogue Productions pressings, and not one, as I recall, has this issue. But this year???
     
    AaronW, nosliw, Kimiimacman and 5 others like this.
  12. Mumdad

    Mumdad Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Very interesting. This would seem to put to bed a lot of the theories suggesting that this might've been due to the tapes being mishandled during/after the BN75 series, wouldn't it?
     
  13. 5-String

    5-String μηδὲν ἄγαν

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    I got my copy of Blue Mornin’ last night and started playing it almost immediately. I was too excited to wait. The cover looked beautiful and the vinyl was pristine.
    I posted enthusiastically in another thread as I was listening to the second song writing that this sounds amazing. I guess, I was wrong and my judgement was premature.
    From the third song of the side 1 and during the whole of side 2 the piano is unlistenable. To me the flutter on the piano sounded worst that the worst of the Tone Poet series. On the top of this the side 2 was noisy. I counted at least 5 instances of no fill coming for the left channel.
    My copy is the blue vinyl btw.
    Anyway, shame, shame, shame!:thumbsdow:thumbsdow:thumbsdow
    It cannot be a coincident that all these records were cut by Kevin Gray. I am suspecting that there is something wrong with the playback of his cutting system.:shrug:
     
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  14. Kimiimacman

    Kimiimacman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lost
    Oh poo. Mine is in transit from the USA. Luckily Rarewaves USA (via eBay)are particularly understanding of faulty pressings and refund immediately so I’m pretty safe I guess; here’s hoping.
    Like Jeff, I have lots of MM and AP + others and like him not a single issue regarding pitch.
    My understanding is that the Chet Baker album is on Pacific not BN? To get to the bottom of this fiasco I guess KG needs to cut a non-jazz, more modern album that has a prominent piano, if that proves to be off, then I will go some way to prove what’s at fault or not would it not?
     
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  15. 5-String

    5-String μηδὲν ἄγαν

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    The Chet Baker album is on Riverside.
    I don't know how bad the piano sounds on the RSD release but I canceled my preorder of the CHET boxset that also includes the stereo version of that record. I decided that I am going to wait to hear from the vinyl community first before I buy any new releases. I am not taking a risk with these again, I have better ways to spend my money if I want to.
     
    Kimiimacman likes this.
  16. nosliw

    nosliw Delivering parcels throughout Teyvat! Meow~!

    Location:
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    And now Grant Green LP and Chet Baker releases are afflicted by the wow/flutter? This is not good.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019
    AnalogJ likes this.
  17. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    Can anyone say how bad Una Mas is? I haven't taken it out of the shrink yet, so I could still return it.
     
  18. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    Were there any reissues of the Baker album somewhat recently prior to this?
     
  19. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    Does anyone know contact info for Cohearant and/or Kevin Gray?
     
  20. Tim1954

    Tim1954 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    Contact | Cohearent
     
    AnalogJ likes this.
  21. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    Thank you so much. I will write a thoughtful letter on this subject, and hopefully will get back a thoughtful response and post it here.
     
    Vic Trola, nosliw, jon9091 and 3 others like this.
  22. StevenTounsand

    StevenTounsand Waxidermy Refugee Thread Starter

    Location:
    Austin, TX
    I’ve been keeping my OJC versions of the Chet titles in the box just in case they have this flutter too. They sound great and are warble free. I’ve gotten in the habit starting with AP’s Prestige series of saving the OJC vinyl for the better covers. Yeah - I’m THAT guy who makes “Frankenstein” lps you may see around town (if you’re here in Austin TX). The AP Coltrane S/T had a weird low thump all through a ballad that also was never explained (ironically it was blamed on a piano!) - I just put the OJC in that beautiful cover and I’m set.
    I’ll be stuck with new Grant Green Sunday Morning though.
     
  23. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    That thump being caused a piano is possible. With the newer masterings having a wider bandwidth and greater dynamics, that greater lower end might reveal the use of the pedals on the piano. I have numerous recordings where the use of the pedal is audible.
     
  24. StevenTounsand

    StevenTounsand Waxidermy Refugee Thread Starter

    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Right, but this thump was regular in time with rotation consistent
    throughout the song - not a natural foot pedal occurrence.
     
  25. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    Ah. And there wasn't a pinch warp on the copy?
     

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