XRCD - sound quality compared to CD's & Hi-rez?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by RickH, Jul 25, 2005.

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  1. RickH

    RickH Connoisseur of deep album cuts Thread Starter

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    What's the consensus here regarding the sound quality of JVC's XRCD recordings when compared to well-mastered Redbooks, Hi-Rez Stereo, and vinyl?
     
  2. Michael St. Clair

    Michael St. Clair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Funkytown
    FYI XRCD is Redbook. It's not even a quasi-format like HDCD.
     
  3. PMC7027

    PMC7027 Forum Hall Of Fame

    HDCD is also redbook. I wouldn't even call it a quasi-format. To me it is an implementation.
     
  4. RickH

    RickH Connoisseur of deep album cuts Thread Starter

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    I've been to their site (xrcd.com) and I'm impressed with their process although the catalog is quite limited and prices are $30-$33 per title. But let me re-word my question in light of the fact they are redbook cd's: are they comparable to say, Mo-Fi, or Chesky, and the like?

    I think I've seen some of their stuff in Border's in the past.

    Man, here's one I'd love to get sometime:
     

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  5. PMC7027

    PMC7027 Forum Hall Of Fame

    I only have one XRCD in my collection; The Joker by Steve Miller. It sounds fine to me, although I do not have anything to which I can compare it.
     
  6. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    No, it isint. HDCD was not in the original redbook spec, nor was it added. HDCD requires a compatable player (or dac) in order to play them at full quality.
     
  7. Dave

    Dave Esoteric Audio Research Specialistâ„¢

    Location:
    B.C.
    I don't like them myself. I tried Dire Straits Brothers In Arms, Tina Turner Private Dancer and Steve Miller The Joker and they all could be much better. The only one I've kept is The Joker because it's not as hard sounding as the other two and better than the domestic version, but no where near the DCC albums. They have added air in the 10-13K region which just sounds unnatural and bright to me. There are much better sounding versions of the other 2 I've discussed here.
     
  8. Carmantom

    Carmantom Primo Audioholic

    Location:
    Central Florida
    I have several titles. Overall I am quite pleased with them.

    One that really stands out to me is Eagles "Hell Freezes Over" Sonics are great. Prices are high because there is no need for proprietary Dac or CDP. They simply get their money up front. I also like Carmen Lundy "Self Portrait"

    Tom
     
  9. Roland Stone

    Roland Stone Offending Member

    The XRCD jazz CDs, at least those licensed from the Fantasy labels, are done to a very high level. Note that many of the XRCD jazz titles will be very short in playing time, per the original LPs, and that some of them are in mono.

    The best jazz XRCDs I've encountered are those drawn from Norman Granz's Pablo label, including titles from Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan, Count Basie, Duke Ellington, etc. Presumably this is in part because the Pablo sessions were so well recorded to begin with.

    Another XRCD title that was praised by Steve himself is Kenny Dorham's QUIET KENNY.
     
  10. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    And all of the BILL EVANS titles. They seem to be done "straight".
     
    CBackley and George P like this.
  11. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    They make these in part here in Kennesaw, Georgia where the JVC office is. Teh sonics are very good, ahead of non-XRCD redbook, and behind SACD or DVDA assuming a proper mastering of each.

    I have a number of classical and jazz and I have heard at some length the Brothers in Arms XRCD at a friend's house. BIA sounds incredible. :)

    You can often find these discs for around $20 at hifi shows and the odd audio club meet if JVC has an offer out for a discount. This happened once at the Atlanta Audio Society.

    I think their use of a special glass mastering production process and loads of care in the mastering process explains much of their success.
     
  12. Dave

    Dave Esoteric Audio Research Specialistâ„¢

    Location:
    B.C.
    Ron, are these, and the Bill Evans Steve mentions, later XRCD titles than the 3 titles I mentioned? Perhaps they've realized the errors of past ways.
     
  13. PMC7027

    PMC7027 Forum Hall Of Fame


    Joe,
    I respectfully say that you are incorrect, or we have a misunderstanding. HDCD data are redbook compliant. A CD that is HDCD encoded is still a fully redbook complaint CD. The HDCD codes are part of the redbook bitstream, in the LSB less than 5% of the time. The fact that HDCD requires a special player does not make an HDCD disc not redbook compliant. Of course HDCD is not in the redbook spec. It does not have to be because HDCD data are redbook compliant. A "regular" CD player has no trouble decoding a CD that is HDCD encoded because it contains CD compliant data.
     
  14. thegage

    thegage Forum Currency Nerd

    The Joker and Private Dancer are notorious for being unusually bad sounding XRCDs. I have Dancer and can confirm it is bright and over-bearing. I haven't heard BiA. On the other hand, I do have some very nice sounding XRCDs, for example a couple of Doug Macleod's recordings, and Mighty Sam McClain's "Keep on Movin'." In general I think they're well regarded, but I have trouble paying so much for them and so don't have many.

    John K.
     
  15. eelkiller

    eelkiller One of the great unwashed

    Location:
    Northern Ontario
    Anyone heard the Aaron Neville Japanese XRCD (Warm Your Heart)?
     
  16. Barry Wom

    Barry Wom New Member

    Location:
    Pepperland
    Great great sounds - the best from Red Book?
    but totally awful catalogue, the worst, it continually disappoints me. Surely JVC have enough money to get something else. Japanese jazz? Dire Straits? Tina Turner ? no thanks

    it could be SO good.

    Tim
     
  17. Claude

    Claude Senior Member

    Location:
    Luxembourg
    I haven't been disappointed by any XRCD I have bought (only OJC reissues), except for Art Pepper "Landscape" which is not a very good recording (live soundboard recording from 1979, maybe they issued it for the japanese market, because it was recorded in Japan).

    But some of the XRCDs are topped by APO SACDs (Bill Evans "Waltz for Debbie", "At the Village Vanguard") or DCCs (Bill Evans quintet album, Sonny Rollins "Saxophone collossus")e

    As always, it's in the remastering.
     
  18. Metralla

    Metralla Joined Jan 13, 2002

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    I bought that XRCD at CES in January to compare systems after hearing it in the Reimyo room.

    I mainly used the track "We Bid You Goodnight" but I also used the version of "Ave Maria" on this album and another track that slips my mind. Everyone who heard the first song I mentioned thought it sounded fantastic - I must have played this song on at least a dozen top class systems.

    It's incredible.
     
  19. Paul C.

    Paul C. Senior Member

    Location:
    Australia
    I have an XRCD of "The Ray Bryant Trio" - it's nice, but I have nothing to compare it to. For an older mono recording they've done a good job, although i have a sneaking suspicion that it's a tad bright.

    Aldo have a couple of Art Pepper titles (Meets the Rhythm Section, +11) which sound really good - I'd like to compare them with SACD or other versions.

    Also have Breakfast at Tiffany's, which sounds fine but is not a great recording to begin with.

    I did briefly have "West Side Story" - Andre Previn & Co. - but I sent it back because it had a problem with glue from the packaging corrupting the playing surface - in fact I sent two back with the same problem! Pity - it was a great sounding disc.

    Finally, I have Brilliant Corners by the Bill Holman Band, a modern recording that sounds great - and great interpreatations of Monk stuff.

    One thing to look out for with some XRCDs is the packaging - the Japanese issues and later US ones use a fancy digipak, which is fine, but earlier ones had a larger cardboard sleeve arrangement about which I've heard many bad reports. I can attest to this as well- the Bill Holman Band XRCD is in the larger package, and it's very hard to get the disc out of the paper sleeve without surface damage. My copy already had damage when I bought it. Somehow moisture had penetrated the disc, and there were what looked like corrosion spots under the protective clear plastic surface of the disc. I will not buy another XRCD in the old packaging.
     
  20. Parkertown

    Parkertown Tawny Port

    Last night I played my XRCD of Bill Evans' "Explorations." Wowsa! That's a sweet, warm sounding disc. Not a bit bright...definite magic going on...

    I then played my XRCD of "Quiet Kenny." Sounds nice, but lacked the magic the Bill Evans disc had.

    Case by case situation here, folks. Trust yer own ears!
     
  21. tomcat

    tomcat Senior Member

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Steve, there's an annoying (for me, at least) high pitch whistling sound on some "Portrait" tracks - as if there was a TV on next to the microphone. Is this sound also on the DCC or did the XRCD guys use the wrong tape? Thanks for responding.
     
  22. GabeG

    GabeG New Member

    Location:
    NYC
    These discs aren't the greatest. The Brother in Arms disc wasn't done under the auspices of the american xrcd program.

    As far as the other xrcd discs, there hasn't been any air added to any that I know of - I know a couple of the key people involved on the american side (actually they ARE the only people). As far as any funny eqing - simply not the case. Akira Taguchi HATES it.
     
  23. GabeG

    GabeG New Member

    Location:
    NYC

    To my knowledge, this has always been a problem with this album.
     
  24. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Tone generator bleeding in, only on the stereo machine but Audiophiles love stereo. The mono versions are fine.

    At any rate, we fixed it on the AP 45 RPM versions and notched it out as best we could on the DCC version. The DCC version doesn't have that treble boost that the XRCD does though..
     
  25. I used to own all the Miles Davis Quintet XRCDs -- Cookin', Relaxin', Steamin' & Workin'. Then I finally took somebody's advice here and tracked down the DCCs (for about the same price). Compared to the DCCs, the XRCDs sounded harsh and brittle, and seemed to have an artificial treble rise.

    I sold off the XRCDs and never looked back. I don't think the XRCD "process" actually improves the sound quality. More and more I'm convinced, "It's all in the mastering". (Shouldn't that be trademarked?) :)
     
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