Ampex ATR-102-----And, "How to align your analog tape machine"

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Joe Nino-Hernes, May 12, 2004.

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  1. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Ampex ATR-102

    Today I closed a deal for the purchase of an Ampex ATR-102!! :cool: :cool: The asking price was $2300, and I got him down to $1700! It is in great condition, so I can just plug it in and go! This is my first real pro tape machine. I have used a semi-pro Tascam 32 for a few years now. My work has gotten to the point where I am ready for the ATR. If anyone is interested in the 32, it is listed in the classified section here.
     

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  2. Damián

    Damián Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Spain now
    :drool:

    :cool:

    Edit: just to make this post a bit meaningful.. what tape format(s) does the machine use?

    Speeds?

    Are the electronics tube or SS?

    Those electronics boards, are they add-ons? Which ones does you machine have?

    What other gear are you running into/feeding from it?

    What mixing desk(s) are you using?

    Finally, what artists or well-known recordings used this machine?



    Thanks (I'm serious, btw)!
     
  3. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    South Plymouth, Ma
    Idlers and all in great shape? Wonderful score. :)
     
  4. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    I love mine but it is a pain in the *** to play old tapes on it. Why? Well, since it has no capstain or pinch rollers, the two guides at either side of the head-stack HATE any type of tape irregularities. Old tapes have leader that is a bit too wide or a splice that has oozed. These STOP THE MACHINE COLD in the middle of a song or album. Drives me frantic!

    Wonderful sound though; perfect for playing more modern tapes on and of course recording.
     
  5. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam

    So, this unit relies on motor-driven tape tension from the hubs only?

    On the surface, this would appear to be a concern if one is playing an older tape. Or not?

    Bob :confused:
     
  6. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Ya think?

    I use a Studer transport with ATR-102 (modified) electronics in it for vintage tape playback..

    The ATR-102 is really a great machine; Ampex's last machine and a true legend. I use mine to make 30 ips 1/2" cutting masters for LP work. Great sound!
     
  7. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member

    Location:
    Nashville
    Sorry to be nosy but do you play those older, more problematic tapes on the Studer? It's an A-80, right? That's what I have (had) at the studio. Wonderful machine. Hard to align with those older pots though. Every time you turn them the needle jumps all over the place.
     
  8. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Jamie,

    See my post #6 right above yours.
     
  9. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    This is a solid state microcomputer controled, pinch roller-less quarter inch two track machine that can be easily upgraded to half inch two track or one inch two track. The cards are for the audio EQ settings. This can run in NAB, IEC, CCIR, and AES eq curves. This is an amazing deck. It is easy to change between EQ curves, it can be set up at any speed from 3 3/4 to 30ips. Editing is amazingly smooth and easy. It also has a realtime counter. This unit can handle up to 14 inch reels.
    As far as the cards in the card cage, my unit has the transport card, the audio card and the power supply card. The cards make the unit easy to service. As far as who used (or uses this machine) everyone. This is the industry standard mixdown and mastering deck. Steve has one of these decks, Bob Ludwig has a couple of them. Visit www.atrservice.com and hit the news archive link. This will give you an Idea of who is using them now. Mike Spitz at ATR Services, is a very good friend of mine. His Aria reference electronics for the ATRs are the best ever made. I feel that they are the greatest advancement in sound recording since the introduction of the ATR series.

    I am using a dirt cheap Behringer mixer. Even though this is not the best board in the world, I can achieve excellent results. Steve has heard my work, so he can tell you that.
     
  10. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member

    Location:
    Nashville
    Oops. I answered the phone and Steve already chimed in with the answer. :)
     
  11. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Congratulations Joe! Good luck with the Ampex.
     
  12. StyxCollector

    StyxCollector Man of Miracles

    VERY nice. I've been using my pro Technics deck for archiving some R2Rs, and would have loved something nicer.
     
  13. Damián

    Damián Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Spain now
    Thanks for taking the time! Sound slike an amazingly cool unit :cool:.
     
  14. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Joe,

    I'm sure you know this, but just in case-----Get a good MRL test tone tape for alignment of the Ampex. We can dub you off one if you don't have the $$ to get your own. It's essential to keep the machine perfectly aligned during playback and recording. It's such a great machine!
     
  15. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Oh yes, I have an MRL tape. It was expensive, but worth every penny. I had my tape made custom, with a longer than usual 1000cps tone.

    I cant wait to receive this machine! Now I need some work, to pay this thing off! My Father was nice enough to lend me the money, I hate borrowing money from my parents, so I want to pay it off as fast as I can.
     
  16. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Great! Now I'm starting to get excited about it. You're going to love that machine. Don't forget (as I know you know) to print tones at the beginning of your recording sessions. Some day you'll want to play your stuff back on another machine......(I know I'm preaching to the choir...) :)

    For those who don't know, the "set up" tones at the beginning of a master tape enable the operator to align the tape exactly as it was aligned during mixing. So, no matter what your machine, you can readjust the 1k, 10k, 50 cycle tones to hit zero VU exactly. Now your playback will match pretty much match the tonality of the original machine and you will be "in phase". A very important step that MANY engineers (who know better) skip!
     
  17. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam

    Steve,

    Thanks for letting us know the frequencies of the set-up tones. I knew about the 1k tone but, not the other frequencies. Typically how long, in time, are the set up tones?

    Thanks,

    Bob :)
     
  18. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Well, there should be at least a minute of each. You start with the 1,000 cycle tone and align your meters to 0 VU (actually in modern machines it is +3 but it reads 0. Then you align the 10,000 cycle tone, setting both channels to 0 VU. Then you wind back the 10,000 tone and look at your 'scope. You move the playback head until the circle (made by the 10k tones in stereo) goes to a flat line, or a flat as line as possible. Now you are in phase and when you collapse to mono, the music should remain in phase.

    Now, you align the bass tones, which is hard to do because sometimes there is a bump there, but you approximate.

    Now, you go back to the 1k tone and make sure both channels are still at 0 VU and you are (for the most part) finished.

    Rewind, swab the heads and GO!

    On compilation tapes where each song is from a different session, you have to do the above ALL OVER AGAIN FOR EACH SONG. This is why it is impossible to cut a lacquer from a comp tape spliced from different studios or eras or sessions..
     
  19. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam

    Steve,

    Great "audio class" lesson - thanks!

    Bob :)
     
  20. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    I don't have an oscilloscope, (stupid question) is it possible to get close just using the meters?
     
  21. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    No. You should get a cheapo scope if you are serious. Another way is to record some pink noise in stereo and play it back IN L+R MONO while manipulating the head. Your ears will tell you when you get to the correct phase or not. DON'T TURN THE HEAD TOO MUCH THOUGH! You might go out of phase in the other direction and will very possibly not get back in again without a scope. So, be careful! Both the record AND playback heads have to be in alignment!

    Joe, you only have to get in phase once though. The heads will hold their positions nicely for a long time and if you only play back what you record yourself, you won't have to readjust.
     
  22. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Thanks everyone, for all of your help, support and good advice! I will let you all know when the machine arrives here.
     
  23. Bob Lovely

    Bob Lovely Super Gort In Memoriam

    Joe,

    Keep us posted how you and your machine are doing...

    Bob :)
     
  24. stereoptic

    stereoptic Anaglyphic GORT Staff

    Location:
    NY
    Joe, I've got to give you a lot of credit. You are running your own business while you are still in high school, and you already have your priorities in order with a committment to quality. Before you (or we) know it, you'll have a fully operating recording studio in a beautiful location (Lake Placid). I'm sure we'll be reading your name in the credits of quite a few recordings in the years to come.
     
  25. Joe Nino-Hernes

    Joe Nino-Hernes Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Thanks. After college, I am not sure where I am going to set up a studio. It depends on many things, but that is the future, we just have to see what happens.
     
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